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John Edwards to face criminal charges

There was a time when an Edwards candidacy might have been viable. (Not that I would ever have voted for him.) But that time came and went. Once he had the need-to-cover-up monkey all over his back, he was toast.

If you say or do stupid things, then in my judgment, you are stupid, regardless of your IQ. Edwards was and is stupid.
 
Ken Lay was not found guilty of anything.

He was found guilty by a judge and jury ergo he was found guilty, although technically the law views it as though he had never been indicted, tried and convicted. Kind of an odd semantic situation.

Ergo, his name will not appear on any list of convicted felons. Not found guilty. :)
 
So imigine we have a murderer, found guilty and getting death, the appeal process takes ten years - and he dies after nine years. Conviction is vacated, as per the precedence, and he is now "never found guilty of anything"?
 
If you can't hire the mistress you've made a sex tape with to be staff videographer and then have an aide try to take responsibility for your love child then what the hell is the point of even running for elected office anymore? :mad:
 
Ken Lay was not found guilty of anything.

I realize that this is a semantic dispute of absolutely no significance, but I think scrut is wrong here. Lay was found guilty and then his conviction was vacated. So by the simple and standard meaning of the English words involved he was found guilty by a jury and no subsequent events can undo that or invalidate the correctness of the statement that he was found guilty.

As to the John Edwards indictment:
This is kind of cool I think. If I understand the situation a couple of rich old ladies gave him some money which he used to keep his mistress in the style to which she aspired to be kept in, presumably out of love or because he didn't want her spilling the beans so he could run for president.

Is it a problem for him that he claimed that his mistress was actually doing work on the campaign? Did any of the money from the old ladies (beyond their personal campaign contribution limit) get used to pay Hunter while she was doing actual campaign work? The obvious Edwards defense to that is that he was just stone cold lying about the role Hunter had in the campaign and that was all just a ruse so he had an excuse to keep his mistress around and give her money.

But if he now comes forth and claims that Hunter wasn't doing actual work on the campaign could he be charged with misuse of campaign contributions if any of the Hunter money came out of his campaign's general fund? Dicey for him: he needs to admit to being really sleazy to avoid one charge, but then limit how sleazy he admits to being to avoid another. And the feds may argue that this is all moot. Keeping the mistress/baby story secret was an essential aspect of his campaign and therefore money he received to assist with the effort to keep the mistress/baby secret was by definition a campaign contribution.

So far these charges look like a stretch to me, but I am ignoble enough to enjoy the show and the sense of satisfaction that this is happening to a fairly sleazy fellow.

Does anybody have any thoughts about whether Spiro Agnew or Edwards was sleazier?
 
I realize that this is a semantic dispute of absolutely no significance, but I think scrut is wrong here. Lay was found guilty and then his conviction was vacated. So by the simple and standard meaning of the English words involved he was found guilty by a jury and no subsequent events can undo that or invalidate the correctness of the statement that he was found guilty.

As to the John Edwards indictment:
This is kind of cool I think. If I understand the situation a couple of rich old ladies gave him some money which he used to keep his mistress in the style to which she aspired to be kept in, presumably out of love or because he didn't want her spilling the beans so he could run for president.

Is it a problem for him that he claimed that his mistress was actually doing work on the campaign? Did any of the money from the old ladies (beyond their personal campaign contribution limit) get used to pay Hunter while she was doing actual campaign work? The obvious Edwards defense to that is that he was just stone cold lying about the role Hunter had in the campaign and that was all just a ruse so he had an excuse to keep his mistress around and give her money.

But if he now comes forth and claims that Hunter wasn't doing actual work on the campaign could he be charged with misuse of campaign contributions if any of the Hunter money came out of his campaign's general fund? Dicey for him: he needs to admit to being really sleazy to avoid one charge, but then limit how sleazy he admits to being to avoid another. And the feds may argue that this is all moot. Keeping the mistress/baby story secret was an essential aspect of his campaign and therefore money he received to assist with the effort to keep the mistress/baby secret was by definition a campaign contribution.

So far these charges look like a stretch to me, but I am ignoble enough to enjoy the show and the sense of satisfaction that this is happening to a fairly sleazy fellow.

Does anybody have any thoughts about whether Spiro Agnew or Edwards was sleazier?

She did actual work for Edwards but was paid for that out of campaign funds I think. Then after she got pregnant is when the big money started flowing from a couple big donors, to keep her whisked away and out of sight. None of that money came officially through the Edwards campaign. The big donors sent the money to the people taking care of Hunter (Edwards' mistress) and they used it to take care of Hunter. The people giving the money said they were doing to help Edwards because they liked him, etc, rather than as an official campaign contribution.

The campaign contribution limit was $2,300. The woman in Virginia, Bunny Mellon, gave something like $700,000. And she didn't even know where the money was going. She was just a 97 year old woman that was very enamored of John Edwards and then when Edwards caught a bunch of flak for getting a $400 haircut she volunteered to give Edwards money to take care of such type of things.

Interestingly, Edwards just went to visit Bunny Mellon, now 100 years old, a week or two ago. I don't know if she'll have to testify at the trial or not, or what kind of condition she's in. At the court hearing yesterday that Edwards attended one of the judges orders was that he not have any further contact with Bunny Mellon.
 
Thanks Number Six for the response.

It seems like the case against Edwards boils down to whether people buy into the theory that paying off one's mistress to buy her silence when one is running for public office is a campaign expense or not.

I suppose the feds want to pursue this because they want to limit the use of loopholes to get around campaign donation limits. Still, I think this case is going to be a tough sale as it winds its way through the legal system. But it does look like Edwards' is guilty of at least a technical violation of the rules here. It seems very doubtful that the money would have been given if he wasn't running for high public office and it seems unlikely that he would have spent as much money on his mistress as he did if it wasn't part of his campaign for public office.
 
I realize that this is a semantic dispute of absolutely no significance, but I think scrut is wrong here. Lay was found guilty and then his conviction was vacated. So by the simple and standard meaning of the English words involved he was found guilty by a jury and no subsequent events can undo that or invalidate the correctness of the statement that he was found guilty.

But if you look at a list of people indicted and found guilty, his name will not appear. Ergo, he was neither indicted or found guilty of anything.
 
This all sounds great to Elizabeth's supporters, I'm sure, but it really boils down to "We'll wait and see what the evidence is." Edwards had shown himself to be a genuine creep, but as long as no laws were violated, where's the Federal Government's case?

Should the wealthy be allowed to buy their way out of trouble. No, but that hasn't stopped them before.
 
big whoop. The donations that ordinary citizens made should be returned and the donations that were made by those knowingly cover his sorry butt should be turned over to some program for battered women.

He can afford to pay it, from what I have heard.

There is really no reason for anyone to care how much he suffers now.

I assume you support Tom Delay's conviction being overturned on the same logic?
 

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