Vaccine/autism CT discussion

[000063]

You should research the parameters of the studies you value so highly.

Such hypocrisy.

 

[TSR]

Measles, Chicken Pox, and Rubella were never deadly diseases in the 50s or after doctors started washing their hands.

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In the US, from 1989 to 1991, 55,622 measles cases were reported with a total of 123 measles-associated deaths. Half of the cases and deaths were in children younger than five years of age. The most important cause of this epidemic was low vaccination rates among preschool-age children. This means that the incidence of measles death is slightly higher than the incidence of autism -- and autism doesn't kill you.

During 2003 and the first half of 2004, CDC received reports of eight varicella-related deaths. The age of the decedents ranged from 1 to 40 years. Six of the eight deaths occurred among children and adolescents aged <20 years. But it's all about the kids, right?

From 1963-1965, a rubella epidemic swept across the globe. In the United States alone, there were about 11,000 fetal deaths and 20,000 infants born with congenital rubella syndrome, a group of birth defects that can occur in an infant when its mother is infected with rubella during pregnancy. Oddly enough, one of the problems associated with CRS is




Wait for it...






Wait for it...





A significantly higher rate of ASD.



Seriously, if you didn't try to make it up as you go along, you'd not end up looking quite as foolish.

Still quite foolish, just not quite as much.
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[Clayton Moore]

I'm going to go out on a limb and question the legitimacy of rumormillnews as a source.

So what internet source would you recommend as a source? theman.com? NIST.com? Bigpharma.com Baptist.com? Cheney.com? Rumsfeld.com

If JoAnn started a site for ideas to make money would it be likely that most would be bogus?

 

[TSR]

The false dychotomy of assuming the spreadingof a disease if not inoculated is notated. My child was allergic to certain vaccines due to an anaphylaxis condition. There was no way I would give him the required vaccine just so a paranoid condition could be satisfied. He never contracted any of the diseases the vaccines were targeting...

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Read up on "herd immunity" and get back to us...
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[Arisia]

The false dychotomy of assuming the spreadingof a disease if not inoculated is notated. My child was allergic to certain vaccines due to an anaphylaxis condition. There was no way I would give him the required vaccine just so a paranoid condition could be satisfied. He never contracted any of the diseases the vaccines were targeting...

I have a feeling most, if not all, states will allow a waiver to be issued in cases where allergies would make vaccinations dangerous to a child. Herd immunity from their vaccinated peers will protect those children, for now. The idiocy of the anti-vaxxers is severely taxing the ability of herd immunity to protect the un-vaccinated, though, so folks who can't immunize their children for legitimate medical reasons should be at the front lines fighting the anti-vaxxers and their misinformation.

 

[fullflavormenthol]

So what internet source would you recommend as a source? theman.com? NIST.com? Bigpharma.com Baptist.com? Cheney.com? Rumsfeld.com

If JoAnn started a site for ideas to make money would it be likely that most would be bogus?

Yeah...nice, but seriously I am not going to take medical history from a site like rumormillnews. How about a site about medicine and medical history that doesn't have the word rumor in the name, and isn't a conspiracy theory website.

But given that I am a baptist pharmacist Cheney/Rumsfeld supporter who is the man and is in league with the NIST....something about JoAnn too. I don't know, anything to ignore the fact of rumormillnews being a less than legitimate source.

 

[Safe-Keeper]

So what internet source would you recommend as a source? theman.com? NIST.com? Bigpharma.com Baptist.com? Cheney.com? Rumsfeld.com

If JoAnn started a site for ideas to make money would it be likely that most would be bogus?

For the third time, you don't measure the worth of web sites just by looking at who founded them, for what purpose, whether they disagree with you, or how much money they make. You do research. As a matter of fact, start by reading up on the scientific method and how it's the best tool we have.

 

[Clayton Moore]

From 1963-1965, a rubella epidemic swept across the globe. In the United States alone, there were about 11,000 fetal deaths and 20,000 infants born with congenital rubella syndrome, a group of birth defects that can occur in an infant when its mother is infected with rubella during pregnancy.[/URL

In young children, rubella is usually mild, with few noticeable symptoms. They may feel feverish and have a sore throat.

Rubella Is Dangerous for Unborn Babies

MMR Vaccine: Preventing Rubella Disease and Birth Defects since the 1960s

* the first dose at 12–15 months of age and
* the second dose before entering school, at 4–6 years of age.

What did we read? Rubella is mild with children.

Rubella is dangerous to unborn babies. That means the danger lies with women at child bearing age.

So why are year old babies getting a Rubella vaccination?

 

[Tolls]

I'm going to go out on a limb and question the legitimacy of rumormillnews as a source.

Well, it's not entirely incorrect.
Britain did suffer its worst smallpox outbreak after compulsory vaccination was introduced. It was introduced in 1853, and the worldwide epidemic was in 1871/72. So 20 years, not 40.

The vaccine didn't prevent you getting the disease, quite often. It did reduce the chance of death. There are 20th century statistics showing something like a reduction from 40% to 10%. No idea how this compares with the figures for the 1870s, though.

 

[Travis]

From 1963-1965, a rubella epidemic swept across the globe. In the United States alone, there were about 11,000 fetal deaths and 20,000 infants born with congenital rubella syndrome, a group of birth defects that can occur in an infant when its mother is infected with rubella during pregnancy.[/URL

What did we read? Rubella is mild with children.

Rubella is dangerous to unborn babies. That means the danger lies with women at child bearing age.

So why are year old babies getting a Rubella vaccination?

Was this a serious question?

 

[Tolls]

Was this a serious question?

I think we can safely conclude that CM has no idea how vaccines work...CM just knows they're eeeevil.

 

[excaza]

The false dychotomy of assuming the spreadingof a disease if not inoculated is notated. My child was allergic to certain vaccines due to an anaphylaxis condition.

There have always been waivers for those who are physically unable to handle vaccinations. Herd immunity will do a decent job of protecting them.

There was no way I would give him the required vaccine just so a paranoid condition could be satisfied. He never contracted any of the diseases the vaccines were targeting...

And another anti-vaxxer who doesn't understand how or why vaccines work. This trend is...disturbing.

 

[excaza]

Measles, Chicken Pox, and Rubella were never deadly diseases in the 50s or after doctors started washing their hands

Swing and a miss. All three of these are airborne diseases, washing your hands is going to do jack diddly.

 

[Grassy Knowlington]

Originally Posted by Clayton Moore
I know personally the parents of maybe 10 young children including my granddaughters. 3 of the little boys are autistic. ....

I am sorry to hear that. Are they diagnosed as Autistic or Aspergers? There's quite a spectrum from a mildly Aspergers condition to what is usually labelled Autistic.

CM - I do not wish to be intrusive but I have a child who was diagnosed Aspergers (at one point Autism was considered but then dismissed) and would like to hear your experience.

 

[kookbreaker]

You gotta love the anti-vaxxer attitude of "if it isn't deadly, it isn't a problem!". I mean, who cares about impotence, crippling joints, pnuemonia, deafness....

 

[excaza]

http://www.rumormillnews.com/cgi-bin/archive.cgi/noframes/read/8803

This is an incredibly awful article.

 

[Travis]

You gotta love the anti-vaxxer attitude of "if it isn't deadly, it isn't a problem!". I mean, who cares about impotence, crippling joints, pnuemonia, deafness....

Hey, let's face it, the flu sucks even if it doesn't cripple you. You miss a couple weeks of work and you are wishing for death while stuck in bed.

Think of the all the productivity in the economy lost to things like the flu too.

 

[ladmo]

There have always been waivers for those who are physically unable to handle vaccinations. Herd immunity will do a decent job of protecting them.


And another anti-vaxxer who doesn't understand how or why vaccines work. This trend is...disturbing.

Actually, your comment is beyond disturbing. I am going to put my son's life at risk??

Edited by kmortis: 

Removed personalization

I will not sacrifice my son for anything.

Edited by kmortis: 

Removed personalization

Your inference that you have a particular set of knowledge is misplaced arrogance. I elect to have a choice, not a mandate by you or anybody else.

I never said that vaccines create anything beyond what would affect my son. Is the general public paranoid? Yes, if the public feels vaccines are necessary and should be forced on people who don't want it.

Question: should my son die just because you want him to have a vaccine?

 

[ladmo]

There have always been waivers for those who are physically unable to handle vaccinations. Herd immunity will do a decent job of protecting them.

You do not know what you are talking about... there was no waiver.

 

[Dave Rogers]

Actually, your comment is beyond disturbing. I am going to put my son's life at risk??

Edited by kmortis: 

Removed personalization

I will not sacrifice my son for anything.

Edited by kmortis: 

Removed personalization

Your inference that you have a particular set of knowledge is misplaced arrogance. I elect to have a choice, not a mandate by you or anybody else.

I never said that vaccines create anything beyond what would affect my son. Is the general public paranoid? Yes, if the public feels vaccines are necessary and should be forced on people who don't want it.

Question: should my son die just because you want him to have a vaccine?

You seem to have read the exact opposite of what excaza posted, which is that your son should be waived mandatory vaccination due to his physical inability to handle it, but would be protected by herd immunity in the event of those who were not at risk having had their vaccinations. In effect, it's the mandatory vaccination of others that's protecting your son, and the efforts of anti-vaccination campaigners that are placing him at risk.

Dave