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Merged General Holocaust denial discussion thread

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There are no deniers.
There are no deniers.
There are no deniers.
There are no deniers.
There are no deniers.

There are revisionists.
There are revisionists.
There are revisionists.
There are revisionists.
There are revisionists.
There are revisionists.
There are revisionists.
 
The bombing debate is nothing more than a red herring from the deniers.


Perhaps so, but at least it's a topic to which I can contribute. Nick Terry et. al. have got the main topic well handled.

And it is (yet another) subject which illustrates how little actual history the Holocaust doubters/deniers really know.
 
Mathew, what it is, Rabbit's cobbling together seeming bits of authoritive information to create some sort of franken-holocaust denial story. For example Gutkowski entitled "The Scroll of Agony and Destruction. Is actually The scroll of agony - it was not a text but a reproduction of a diary, by some else entirely

Gutkowski - or should we say Jacob Grojanowski who's real name was Szlamek Bajler wrote a detailed account of Chelmno extermination camp. Here is a translation of his diary.

http://www.deathcamps.org/occupation/bajler.html

So once again rabbit you cover yourself in glory. Using dishonest quotes to build on your own intelectual dishonety. It is strange that for the claims that the holocaust is not real, so much proof has to be made up

I think you may just be making things worse for yourself - I would advise checking in with Dr Terry before opening your mouth.

Anyway thanks for the heads up - the quote I posted is not mine but comes from that noted revisionist journal "Yad Vashem Studies 21"

You can see it in snippet view here
http://books.google.com/books?ei=G1DHTcKzJYbJrQfMuq3ZBA&ct=result&id=gbdtAAAAMAAJ&dq=Agony

As it happens I think you are correct - this is the same joker who was also writing diaries about Chelmno - in otherwords a thoroughly dishonest liar who has helped explode two camps with one stone so to speak.
 
There are no deniers.
There are no deniers.
There are no deniers.
There are no deniers.
There are no deniers.

There are revisionists.
There are revisionists.
There are revisionists.
There are revisionists.
There are revisionists.
There are revisionists.
There are revisionists.
.
Sure, there are revisionists. It is a highly respected branch historical study, engaged in by actual historians.

But there are also deniers. There is a difference.

"Revisionism" is obliged to deviate from the standard methodology of historical pursuit because it seeks to mold facts to fit a preconceived result, it denies events that have been objectively and empirically proved to have occurred, and because it works backward from the conclusion to the facts, thus necessitating the distortion and manipulation of those facts where they differ from the preordained conclusion (which they almost always do).
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Anyway thanks for the heads up - the quote lie I posted is not mine but comes from that noted revisionist journal "Yad Vashem Studies 21"

Fixed that for you

As it happens I think you are correct - this is the same joker who was also writing diaries about Chelmno - in otherwords a thoroughly dishonest liar who has helped explode two camps with one stone so to speak.

Cant help yourself can you. I have conclussively proved you wrong, and your only response "He is a liar" great work.

So tell me do you Saggy and Clayton have a roster system for who gets use of the brain cell next. Cause between the three of you I have seen more higher brain function from E Colli colonies
 
Perhaps so, but at least it's a topic to which I can contribute. Nick Terry et. al. have got the main topic well handled.

And it is (yet another) subject which illustrates how little actual history the Holocaust doubters/deniers really know.

I actually wish there was some real historical discussions in the forum, cause I find all their posts extremely interesting reads
 
Fixed that for you



Cant help yourself can you. I have conclussively proved you wrong, and your only response "He is a liar" great work.

So tell me do you Saggy and Clayton have a roster system for who gets use of the brain cell next. Cause between the three of you I have seen more higher brain function from E Colli colonies


What part of "what I quoted comes straight from Yad Vashem Studies 21" are you finding difficult to understand?


HELLO - http://books.google.com/books?ei=G1D...AMAAJ&dq=Agony - IS THERE INTELLIGENT LIFE ON THIS PLANET?


The fact that the same dude also faked up a diary about Chelmno is great for revisionists/deniers, but not something I could have been expected to know.
 
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What part of "what I quoted comes straight from Yad Vashem Studies 21" are you finding difficult to understand?

The fact I have a copy of the magazine - And I can not find it in there. And before you tell me I dont - there is a photo of a Bishop on page 3 - Whats his first name?
 
The fact I have a copy of the magazine - And I can not find it in there. And before you tell me I dont - there is a photo of a Bishop on page 3 - Whats his first name?

OMG - the anti-semites at google books have struck again!

Go to page 207 of your copy and type the sentences you think appears instead of what google books has.

Sheesh - to what pathetic games are you going to sink to?
 
OMG - the anti-semites at google books have struck again!

Go to page 207 of your copy and type the sentences you think appears instead of what google books has.

Sheesh - to what pathetic games are you going to sink to?

caught you again. The particular issue you are quoting from only has 20 pages. But you should know that if you had a copy
 
Got real quiet in here all of a sudden ***taps microphone** Is this thing still on?
 
Mathew, what it is, Rabbit's cobbling together seeming bits of authoritive information to create some sort of franken-holocaust denial story.
I'm used to this tactic from Holocaust deniers. On the Skeptic society forum there is a similar thread from a holocaust denier but this time claiming it was a radio broadcast.


Here is the claim by deniers on that forum.
The first Treblinka myth was generated by the British propaganda radio station broadcasting in Polish Radio Maria...in August 1942. That is where the "steaming tale" started: Turned into the diesel tale in a couple of weeks.
It's complete rubbish.

http://www.skepticforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=39&t=15394
 
There are no deniers.
There are no deniers.
There are no deniers.
There are no deniers.
There are no deniers.

There are revisionists.
There are revisionists.
There are revisionists.
There are revisionists.
There are revisionists.
There are revisionists.
There are revisionists.

Possibly the most moronic post ever
 
I'm used to this tactic from Holocaust deniers. On the Skeptic society forum there is a similar thread from a holocaust denier but this time claiming it was a radio broadcast.


Here is the claim by deniers on that forum.
The first Treblinka myth was generated by the British propaganda radio station broadcasting in Polish Radio Maria...in August 1942. That is where the "steaming tale" started: Turned into the diesel tale in a couple of weeks.
It's complete rubbish.

http://www.skepticforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=39&t=15394

LOL I see what you mean. And for the life of me I can not think of one good logistical reason the Nazi's would steam people to death
 
Got real quiet in here all of a sudden ***taps microphone** Is this thing still on?

I am sorry, I had to do some stuff.

I am sorry your copy of the Yad Vashem Studies 21 has only 20 pages. I suspect who ever sold it to you must have vandalised it. You do realise it is an annual - it appears 1991 or whatever year it was must have been a particularly bad vintage.

Fortunately you can vicariously enjoy page 207 through Google Books
http://books.google.com/books?ei=G1DHTcKzJYbJrQfMuq3ZBA&ct=result&id=gbdtAAAAMAAJ&dq=Agony

Madness visible....
 
Perhaps a little biography of Ruta Sakowska, a scholar that seems inexplicably to have escaped MG1962's attention, might be order. She is the author of the piece that somehow managed to stretch into page 207 of the volume in question.

Dr. Ruta Sakowska of the Jewish Historical
Institute in Poland has been awarded the Jan Karski and
Pola Nirenska Prize for 1997.

Dr. Sakowska is the pre-eminent historian of the Warsaw
Ghetto and director of the Ringelblum Archives of the
Jewish Historical Institute, considered the most
important Holocaust archives in the world. The archives
were established by the historian Emmanuel Ringelblum
and his clandestine organization Oneg Shabat in the
Warsaw Ghetto; they document every aspect of the life
and death of the ghetto as well as the fate of scores of
other Polish Jewish communities. The first volume of a
planned complete academic edition of the archives has
just appeared in Poland under Dr. Sakowska's editorship.
Dr. Sakowska is also the author of "Ludzie z dzielnicy
zamknietej" (2nd rev. ed., Warsaw, 1993), a social
history of the Warsaw Ghetto, as well as numerous other
studies.
 
Sheesh, this guy is a legend: Chelmno, Belzec and Treblinka.....a month early

Grojanowski Report was written by Szlamek Bajler, under the pseudonym of Jacob Grojanowski, who escaped from the Chelmno extermination camp and described in details the atrocities that he witnessed there.[1]

Bajler, who managed to make his way from Chelmno to the Warsaw Ghetto, gave detailed information about the his death camp experience to the ghetto's Oneg Shabbat group, headed by Emanuel Ringelblum. He described the entire extermination procedure at the camp: how people were murdered in gas vans, how their corpses were removed, how the inside of the vans was cleaned, and how the bodies were buried in large pits.[2] Bajler also described his escape from the camp, the bleak conditions of the prisoners forced to deal with the dead, and the brutality of the murderers.[3] Oneg Shabbat and Bajler then wrote up the report in both Polish and German; they sent the Polish version to the Delegatura, the underground representatives of the Polish government-in-exile, while the German copy was meant for the German people, in the assumption it would evoke their compassion for the Jews.[4][5][6]

Bajler subsequently escaped to Zamość where he wrote to the Warsaw ghetto of the existence of a death camp in Belzec.[7] A few days after writing this letter, towards the end of April 1942, he was rounded up, deported and gassed at the Belzec extermination camp.[8]

And yet miraculously managed to write something on May 29 1942. Truly a hero!
 
LOL I see what you mean. And for the life of me I can not think of one good logistical reason the Nazi's would steam people to death
I simply assume that no witness had ever seen a gas chamber before and someone thought it was a steam chamber. It doesn't really matter as gas chambers were consistently mentioned in all early reports.

I like tanks. The British HMO published a book with all the classified early exchanges between intelligence services and eyewitnesses concerning the Tiger. It has the same small errors. I assume it's the nature of early intelligence.
 
I am sorry, I had to do some stuff.

I am sorry your copy of the Yad Vashem Studies 21 has only 20 pages. I suspect who ever sold it to you must have vandalised it. You do realise it is an annual - it appears 1991 or whatever year it was must have been a particularly bad vintage.

Fortunately you can vicariously enjoy page 207 through Google Books
http://books.google.com/books?ei=G1DHTcKzJYbJrQfMuq3ZBA&ct=result&id=gbdtAAAAMAAJ&dq=Agony

Madness visible....

Sorry I am simply not buying. It is a quarterly, and the particular issue was published in the winter of 2001
 
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