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conspiracy psychology debunked

Walter Ego,

Who said truthers are suffering from diagnosable psychological disorders?

No-one. The point is that when regular people turn on the TV to watch History Channel's 9/11 Conspiracy Theories Fact or Fiction, and they see that the first half hour of the program is dedicated to these phychological theories as to why conspiracy theorists think the things they do, they may assume that there is a clinical pathology that has been identified using real science as opposed to recognizing that the program is deliberately wasting time with the flawed pseudo scientific speculations of authors, and political scientists, because they would rather not spend more time discussing the evidence.

Based on psychological questionnaires, Leman and his colleague in the video can predict which groups of students are more likely to believe in conspiracy theories.

Well, I have to thank you, at least, for finding studies that have been done by real psychologists at least (something all the other posters couldn't seem to do.)

Your psychologists came up with the not too surprising conclusions that there is a correlation between people who believe in conspiracy theories and those that:

1) exhibit low levels of trust
2) feel alienated from society
3) are prone to making assumptions.

In regard to the first two, what does this correlation prove? How can you establish causation? For example is the sitauation a) ctists are mistustful of others and feel alienated so they tend to overspeculate? or b) People who have researched the very real criminal behaviour of many organizations throughout history and have discovered very real scandals tend to be less trusting and feel more alienated than those who are living under a false security blanket or have a false sense of security because they are unaware of the dangers in life (much like teenagers are much more likely to take stupid risks when they drive because they are simply ignorant to the dangers.)?

In regard to the third premise, it may well be that people who are more aware of real past scandals may tend to speculate more about other possible scenarios than people who are oblivious to the very real scandals of which they are unaware. Again the correlation is there but the causation seems to be missing. It depends on whether the conspiracies are true or not.

Remember at the beginning of the video when the psychologists stated that it was not a concern whether the conspiracies were real or not?
 
I don't really care personally whether or not truth movement proponents are clinically insane or psychologically disturbed. Pseudo-science tends not to discriminate between someone who joins conspiracy movement out of paranoia versus those who are politically incline in some way or another to follow.
 
Walter Ego,



No-one. The point is that when regular people turn on the TV to watch History Channel's 9/11 Conspiracy Theories Fact or Fiction, and they see that the first half hour of the program is dedicated to these phychological theories as to why conspiracy theorists think the things they do, they may assume that there is a clinical pathology that has been identified using real science as opposed to recognizing that the program is deliberately wasting time with the flawed pseudo scientific speculations of authors, and political scientists, because they would rather not spend more time discussing the evidence.
WHAT evidence? Do you see the problem? They fixate on the conspiracy theorists state of mind because there is NO evidence of a conspiracy.
 
A most intriguing deflection thread.

The evidence can't substantiate the 9/11 conspiracy claims, so we now have to "argue the psychology"????

Surely you have more than yet another Wookie Defence?
 
Telltale Tom,

I am a bit disappointed with your post that superficially covers an interesting topic. I hope your own research in your own topic is more comprehensive. I expect you know that much has been written about it.

Your presumptuous opening statement is amusing. You presume that there has been 'much' written about it. (I know there has been much written about it based on the speculations of authors and political scientists, but that is not what I asked for.) You presume that if there are a lot of real psychological publications about it that it will be easy to find online. Moreover I am not interested in your disappointment or approval.

And I wouldn't call item 1 paranoia and delusional mindset, but rather a perception that the world is happening outside of their control.

This is fine as your opinion but it is just your opinion not psychology.

I think that the leaders are driven by slightly different objectives. Richard Gage was a below-average second rate architect. After 20 years in the business he had made it as far as Project Manager for a small firm, handling site work. Believe me that is no-body going no-where. And then suddenly he became important, a leader of millions if he believes what he says. Even today hundreds of people turn up to hear him speak at almost any event. He is wined and dined and every year he does a world tour to convince the millions that he is right.

More speculation here but if your self validation pseudo-psychoanalysis had any merit whatsoever it would come with study samples that exhibit these kinds of behaviours in a controlled experiment. By the way, since Gage was kind of late on his involvement with the 9/11 Truth Movement, I guess his low sense of self identity didn't evolve until the last few years. What the heck was he thinking being happy with his job for so long and then deciding at a later date to feel unfullfilled? Coincidentally, all those feelings of unimportance seemed to well up within him at the very same time he was presented with the evidence of the collapse of WTC 7. Sure is funny how that works. lol
 
Opportunity knocks on a staff architects door

Telltale Tom,



Your presumptuous opening statement is amusing. You presume that there has been 'much' written about it. (I know there has been much written about it based on the speculations of authors and political scientists, but that is not what I asked for.) You presume that if there are a lot of real psychological publications about it that it will be easy to find online. Moreover I am not interested in your disappointment or approval.



This is fine as your opinion but it is just your opinion not psychology.



More speculation here but if your self validation pseudo-psychoanalysis had any merit whatsoever it would come with study samples that exhibit these kinds of behaviours in a controlled experiment. By the way, since Gage was kind of late on his involvement with the 9/11 Truth Movement, I guess his low sense of self identity didn't evolve until the last few years. What the heck was he thinking being happy with his job for so long and then deciding at a later date to feel unfullfilled? Coincidentally, all those feelings of unimportance seemed to well up within him at the very same time he was presented with the opportunity to use the collapse of WTC 7. Sure is funny how that works. lol
Fixed that for ya. Gage found a coat tail to ride.
 
More speculation here but if your self validation pseudo-psychoanalysis had any merit whatsoever it would come with study samples that exhibit these kinds of behaviours in a controlled experiment. By the way, since Gage was kind of late on his involvement with the 9/11 Truth Movement, I guess his low sense of self identity didn't evolve until the last few years. What the heck was he thinking being happy with his job for so long and then deciding at a later date to feel unfullfilled?
I guess so... he's apparently happy promoting the crackpot theories more than he is about being genuinely competent as a professional. The memoirs of "believing the OCT" whether true or not are mostly zingers to make the "conversion" to conspiracy sound cooler
 
... with the evidence of the collapse of WTC 7. Sure is funny how that works. lol
Gage has no evidence. Gage is making 70k a years spreading lies. Is he clueless or spewing lies on purpose to gain his donations. What is his motive; who cares, he is pushing delusions.

Gage could have some mental issues, but it is most likely money.
 
A W Smith,

WHAT evidence? Do you see the problem? They fixate on the conspiracy theorists state of mind because there is NO evidence of a conspiracy.

LOL. History Channel's 9/11 Conspiracy Theories Fact or Fiction boasted to not only address the theories themselves but Shermer said that they had debunked them all. Meanwhile while Shermer, Berlet, on the others were pretending to be psychologists, real experts like Dr. Robert Bowman who were much more qualified to be talking about the defense capabilities on 9/11 than any of the debunkers, PM twits, Loose Change filmakers, radio hosts, skeptics, Lester Holt or all the other guests that got vastly greater amounts of talktime. I think he had one or two lines in the whole documentary and was the former Director of Advanced Space Programs Development for the U.S. Air Force in the Ford and Carter administrations, and a former United States Air Force Lieutenant Colonel with 101 combat missions. He holds a Ph.D. in Aeronautics and Nuclear Engineering from the California Institute of Technology.

What a sad piece of yellow journalism.
 
A W Smith,

Fixed that for ya. Gage found a coat tail to ride.

Yeah, that was what Gage was looking for, a group of people questioning the government's official position with regards to an emotionally sensitive event. He must of thought 'ooooooooh, this'll be great for my career.'

:jaw-dropp
 
AJM8125

Well I actually watched up until the point where Laurie Manwell says 9/11 In Plane Sight was the video that sent her down the rabbit hole.

That does not change the fact that she alludes to some real psychological studies in her interview where skeptics, authors, historians, and political scientists usually allude to their own specualtions when discussing the issue of psychological motivations.
 
beachnut,

Gage could have some mental issues, but it is most likely money.

Yeah, maybe, us 9/11 conspiracy theorists get paid a lot of money, you know from, um well you know the cash just rolls in! Tomorrow I'm going to buy a house! ;)
 
AJM8125



That does not change the fact that she alludes to some real psychological studies in her interview where skeptics, authors, historians, and political scientists usually allude to their own specualtions when discussing the issue of psychological motivations.

Which does not change the fact that she herself appears to be mentally ill.
 
A W Smith,



LOL. History Channel's 9/11 Conspiracy Theories Fact or Fiction boasted to not only address the theories themselves but Shermer said that they had debunked them all. Meanwhile while Shermer, Berlet, on the others were pretending to be psychologists, real experts like Dr. Robert Bowman who were much more qualified to be talking about the defense capabilities on 9/11 than any of the debunkers, PM twits, Loose Change filmakers, radio hosts, skeptics, Lester Holt or all the other guests that got vastly greater amounts of talktime. I think he had one or two lines in the whole documentary and was the former Director of Advanced Space Programs Development for the U.S. Air Force in the Ford and Carter administrations, and a former United States Air Force Lieutenant Colonel with 101 combat missions. He holds a Ph.D. in Aeronautics and Nuclear Engineering from the California Institute of Technology.

What a sad piece of yellow journalism.

Bob Bowman is a crackpot, embarrassing to the community and hard person to spend time listening to. No wonder they didn't give him any time! The people on the other side of him aren't going to be appearing in documentaries about mentally challenged humanoids. They are currently working in the defense department. Your "argument from authority" here makes no sense. They don't have to appear in the documentary to refute him, the fact that they aren't saying anything like him does that just fine!

Something you'll probably never understand about 9/11 truth, the reason that the debunkers are usually the only ones who seriously engage you is that everyone else hates your guts too much to care. Skeptics often have an altruistic purpose to debunking. You have no respect for this or understanding of your current situation which amounts to you being in a cult and us trying to help you out of it.

:boggled:
 
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The point is that when regular people turn on the TV to watch History Channel's 9/11 Conspiracy Theories Fact or Fiction, and they see that the first half hour of the program is dedicated to these phychological theories as to why conspiracy theorists think the things they do, they may assume that there is a clinical pathology that has been identified using real science as opposed to recognizing that the program is deliberately wasting time with the flawed pseudo scientific speculations of authors, and political scientists, because they would rather not spend more time discussing the evidence.

Interesting that you keep harping on this program. You must think it did a good job discrediting the Truth Movement. As it so happens, I'll be working on getting a version of the show up on You Tube for inclusion on my 9/11 video blog since the Google video version will be gone in less than a week. (It's still viewable here until April 29.)

I haven't watched the show in several years and don't have time today (it runs 90 minutes) but I'll review it later and see if your little capsule critique is at all accurate. (Btw, my aforementioned blog has a lot of other major media "hit pieces" about which you might want to give us an opinion.)
 
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Triterope,



Why? It proves my point that Laurie Manwell talks about real psychology whereas the '9/11 conspiracy skeptics' just recycle all the speculations from other authors, historians, and political scientists that agree with them.
What is the reason 911 truth believers fail to understand 911 and prefer the lies of 911 truth? It is ignorance, or the failure to think for themselves?
 
beachnut,



Yeah, maybe, us 9/11 conspiracy theorists get paid a lot of money, you know from, um well you know the cash just rolls in! Tomorrow I'm going to buy a house! ;)

Gage claims 9/11 pays him almost $80,000 a year. Plus he gets to travel the world and write it off. Blood money.
 

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