Merged Smoking should be banned universally

[23_Tauri]

What about the medical costs of obesity?

Huge.

 

[23_Tauri]

"Those who deny freedom to others deserve it not for themselves, and, under a just God, cannot long retain it." --Abraham Lincoln, letter to H.L. Pierce, April 6, 1859.

The problem is when millions of them get sick and need expensive medical attention / funeral expenses that non-smokers then have to pay for. This "Drug Use Cost" should be built into the price of cigarrettes so that only the community of smokers has to pay for their unhealthy decision. If they want to die on it, it's their free life and that's on them, not me.

In the UK, this is done through high taxes on tobacco. Tobacco tax revenue was £10.5 billion in 2010. Estimates on the cost to the NHS of treating smoking related illness vary, but they are all way below this figure. This NHS site puts it at £5 billion in 2009. So in fact we smokers subsidise the health care of the non-smokers!

Like the Abe Lincoln quote though.

 

[sgtbaker]

I suppose the private club thing would work because everyone in there would be giving consent. What about homes with children, though? None of them asked to breathe smoke, and none of them have a say in it if the parent does smoke.

They have some laws, protecting a child's wellbeing/safety; helmets while riding a bicycle, seatbelts in the car, etc, I think health laws get slippery. Where would it stop? On top of that how is it even remotely enforceable without a total invasion of privacy.

 

[dafydd]

I am very, very happy that smoking is banned in restaurants and most public places. I have no issue with one smoking in one's own home, but I appreciate not having to deal with other people's smoke when out and about.
I hate getting stuck behind a smoking person when walking down the street. Yuck.

The point about an open street is that you don't have to get stuck behind a smoker.

 

[dafydd]

You're right; I probably should have made my own position more clear. That was my mistake. Usually I tend to just express my views and not worry too much if I'm coming off as supporting one "side" or the other, since my position is usual somewhere in the middle.
It was interesting to me, though, that so many anti-ban posters also don't think that reasonable restrictions on public smoking are reasonable -- which are the only situations I addressed, and which were immediately defended by several posters, including yourself. I would very much like to not have to walk behind smokers on the street, and I think that's a reasonable restriction on smoking that, to my knowledge, doesn't currently exist.

I have more problems with the awful tinny music that comes out of youngsters' phones and I pods. A far worse form of pollution than a bit of smoke in the street.

 

[Halfcentaur]

What about the medical costs of obesity?

What about the medical costs of all those athletes and their injuries?

 

[AvalonXQ]

I have more problems with the awful tinny music that comes out of youngsters' phones and I pods.

... which is why I support prohibiting speakers under the same circumstances. The key is to try not to be a nuisance to those around you, whether by lighting up or blasting music.

 

[sgtbaker]

... which is why I support prohibiting speakers under the same circumstances. The key is to try not to be a nuisance to those around you, whether by lighting up or blasting music.

People should try to be as considerate as possible but there are times when you just have to deal with the fact that other people exist and on occassion, we may be reminded that they are there.

 

[Francesca R]

The point about an open street is that you don't have to get stuck behind a smoker.

Yeah that kinda had me wondering too . . . .

"Jeezus, bloody Sunday walkers. GET OUTA THE MIDDLE LANE *****!!!! Wonder if there's any way I can do a U-ey . . . ."

 

[JFrankA]

... which is why I support prohibiting speakers under the same circumstances. The key is to try not to be a nuisance to those around you, whether by lighting up or blasting music.

Sometime one can be a nuisance simply because the person who is being annoyed is looking for a reason to be annoyed......

 

[AvalonXQ]

Sometime one can be a nuisance simply because the person who is being annoyed is looking for a reason to be annoyed......

Yes, and sometimes one really is a nuisance. Apparently we disagree as to which of these cigarette smoke is.

 

[23_Tauri]

Yes, and sometimes one really is a nuisance. Apparently we disagree as to which of these cigarette smoke is.

So, why are more people so much more intolerant of cigarette smoke compared to 30 or 40 years ago? Whether someone considered something a nuisance or not is not a factor of how much it affects their health, and it's certainly not based on any objective assessment of said 'nuisance'. Opinions in the media, the views of our peers, changing cultural mores, these all shape our perceptions on what is acceptable and what isn't.

We used to be cool with smoking, now only the smokers are cool.

 

[LukeB]

... which is why I support prohibiting speakers under the same circumstances. The key is to try not to be a nuisance to those around you, whether by lighting up or blasting music.

Is the sole criteria for banning things that they annoy you, or is there some other metric involved? Because if it's just annoyance I got a whole list of things. Children, other peoples dogs, people talking loudly on their mobile phones...
Or I can act like an adult and suck up the fact that I have to share this planet with other apes who often engage in acts I don't like
No that's just silly, ban them all I say!

 

[JFrankA]

Yes, and sometimes one really is a nuisance.

Agreed. I was just making a little joke with a point. Didn't mean any insult or inference.

Apparently we disagree as to which of these cigarette smoke is.

We do. However, what I completely disagree with is a "universal ban" based on something being a "nuisance", otherwise we'd all sit in a corner and not do anything (which is part of the point of my previous post).

Further, and not directed towards you Avalon, but there are some posters who are equating smoking with murder. That's really off the charts. If someone wants to go that route, then we can say that the Hostess Company is a bunch of murderers.

One of the reasons why I hate the "truth" ads (these are television commercials here in the US that try to deter people from smoking by making the cigarette industry an evil entity). The ads they produce are calling cigarette companies murderers. That's just like calling Hostess murderers because all they produce is sugary fattening snacks.

 

[LTC8K6]

Hostess has a 100 calorie line.

 

[Stray Cat]

One of the reasons why I hate the "truth" ads (these are television commercials here in the US that try to deter people from smoking by making the cigarette industry an evil entity).

Another point they miss with this approach is that some of us actually enjoy being associated with evil entities... it does one's Rock 'n' Roll cred a ton of good. Especially when it is as unjustifiable as these anti-smoking ads are.

 

[Francesca R]

Smoking is already banned in the universe:

Total number of planets: infinite

Number of planets where smoking happens: finite

==> Percentage of planets in the universe where smoking is allowed: 0%

 

[TragicMonkey]

Smoking is already banned in the universe:

Total number of planets: infinite

Number of planets where smoking happens: finite

==> Percentage of planets in the universe where smoking is allowed: 0%

Not entirely true. The Borg are all heavy smokers, due to a hugely successful marketing campaign with the slogan "Assimilate Flavor Country". The Daleks, however, banned smoking. Not for health reasons but because for a race with three long probes sticking out of their fronts the last thing they wanted was another Freudian object in the mix.

 

[AvalonXQ]

Not entirely true. The Borg are all heavy smokers, due to a hugely successful marketing campaign with the slogan "Assimilate Flavor Country". The Daleks, however, banned smoking. Not for health reasons but because for a race with three long probes sticking out of their fronts the last thing they wanted was another Freudian object in the mix.

Sometimes a cigar is just EX TER MIN ATE!

 

[coalesce]

"It's Chesterfield for me! KAHPLAH"—Kahless the Unforgettable.

Michael