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Merged 8.8 quake in Sendai, Japan

They're talking about my Cascadia Megathrust Zone right now on the news. My house is also almost directly on the Seattle fault. :eek: But I digress...

(Not being talked about but stuff I know: ) We have interesting monitoring of the Cascadia hazard. There are GPS position markers that measure the Olympic Peninsula as it scrunches up and eases down ~every 19 months or so letting the San Juan de Fuca and Gorda Plates slide under the North American Plate like an inch worm.
 
That's amazing! That a cubic meter of water happens to equal a metric ton!
 
I can't believe the footage of the Tsunamis. It's just incredible. Horrific, terrifying, and incredible. I think one of the most disturbing I saw was a tide of black water, littered with debris, slowly swallowing what looked like farmland. As with the earlier footage I saw of waves coming ashore, what I think is most chilling is how it doesn't actually look that dangerous. It's just some slow-moving water, right? And then it hits something solid, and just keeps going, and carries the solid thing with it, be it a car, a bridge, or an entire building. And it just keeps coming, and coming, and coming. Entire suburbs barely seem to slow it down.
From the distance it looks like black muddy water, but when they show the close up and you see cars, trucks and whole buildings, it look scary as hell.
 
"Cooling system failed in reactor in...." oh it's gone from the screen.

Not good?

Rolfe.
 
It is just so senseless...random...and mortifying...

It is like the Earth spilled some coffee, and everything in the wake was consumed in wood, dirt, metal, and glass... Oops...?

I mean what IS that? You can be having a cookie and milk one minute, only to notice that the water outside your window is rising, then the house collapses around you into water and mud...black...

That is some bullbutter, man.

This is why I believe that the "God of the Bible" is no longer hands on here, anymore.

Are you telling me there wasn't a single "Lott" in those cities?

Was there no one worth saving?

BULLBUTTER.

This is messed up...
 
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It is just so senseless...random...and mortifying...

It is like the Earth spilled some coffee, and everything in the wake was consumed in wood, dirt, metal, and glass... Oops...?

I mean what IS that? You can be having a cookie and milk one minute, only to notice that the water outside your window is rising, then the house collapses around you into water and mud...black...

That is some bullbutter, man.

This is why I believe that the "God of the Bible" is no longer hands on here, anymore.

Are you telling me there wasn't a single "Lott" in those cities?

Was there no one worth saving?

BULLBUTTER.

This is messed up...

I recently watched a documentary explaining that without the whole plate tectonics process the above-water land mass of the planet would just gradually erode and get washed into the sea.

So the occasional person drowning from a tsunami is the price to be paid to prevent all of us drowning.
 
OK, this is not good. Guess I need to read up on this hazard more often.

Risk of giant quake off American west coast goes up - A magnitude 8 or greater earthquake has a one in three chance of hitting in the next 50 years.
Previous hazard estimates, based on the magnitude-9 earthquakes, had set the recurrence interval for earthquakes in the region at about 500 years, with a 10-15% chance of another in the next 50 years. But Goldfinger's study, by upping the total number of earthquakes to 41, has cut the average recurrence interval to about 240 years.

The last earthquake on the subduction zone was on 27 January 1700. Adding in the new earthquakes, and taking into account the statistical distribution of intervals between them, the next earthquake is overdue, and there's a 37% probability it will occur somewhere along the Cascadia fault in the next 50 years.

Apparently the work has not been confirmed.
 
I recently watched a documentary explaining that without the whole plate tectonics process the above-water land mass of the planet would just gradually erode and get washed into the sea.

So the occasional person drowning from a tsunami is the price to be paid to prevent all of us drowning.

Thanks to that merciful god of yours, eh Plumjam? ;)
 
Man if that reactor does meltdown it will be a huge blow to efforts to get us off of coal and oil power.
 
OMFSM, they just showed a car floating in the tsunami and it's wiper blades were operating. I know people must have been in lots of those vehicles, but that's the second one I've seen that clearly had people in it when the wave hit. The other one was moving and the video showed the wave overtaking it.
 
I got this off the Canadian Nuclear Society email list, from one of our members who did her M.Sc. in nuclear engineering at university of Virginia and di much of her course work studying General Electric reactors:

What actually happened was that at one of the plants, the Fukushima Nuclear Plant, when the quake hit, there was a reactor scram and a turbine trip (per design basis) but the emergency diesel did not start. This is a reportable event, it was duly reported, and it resulted in an evacuation.

The plant is a General Electric boiling water reactor, which means that there is no secondary loop - the steam generator is in the top of the pressure vessel, followed by a cyclone separator, and from there the main steam line goes directly to the turbine. The rods come into the core through the bottom, but they are spring loaded and pulled out against the springs, so that on loss of power the poles go into the holes - as they did.

There is a diversion loop going directly to the heatsink for cooling when the plant is not running, and there are also steam driven pumps for circulation - the electric auxiliaries are not critical for heat removal. This is an older plant, with four hours of battery backup available, but note that the steam auxiliaries do not require electrical power to operate - this is deliberate.

At the end of the earthquake the reactor was scrammed, the rods were in, the batteries were on line, the emergency diesel was not. There was several feet (by design, it works this way) of water over the core, giving several hours of boiling cooling before the core would be exposed.

Operating procedure for these plants under such conditions is to spin up the steam pumps, stand by the ECCS (emergency core cooling system) which is nothing more than a pipeline to the nearest available water source, and to get the emergency diesel on line. Note they have four hours to do so. You really don't want to have to use the ECCS, that is not feed grade water, use of it not only gunks up the reactor but results in contamination (the water has to go somewhere) inside the containment.

Here is the conjecture. Unless there was damage to the emergency diesel (minimum, two) this should be doable, so I am assuming it was done. After that, as long as there is sufficient diesel fuel available, things should be under control. Thus, all else is media hysteria.

There's more. Critical loads (such as circ pumps) have more than one source of power. The diesels are designed to start automatically after interruption of switchyard power, and each load (pump) is equipped with an ABT (automatic bus tranfer) device which uses yard power as the primary source but which switches automatically to the secondary source if the primary source is interrupted. Also, everything (remember, this stuff is three phase) is required to be delta connected. That way, if you lose one of the phases you can still get roughly fifty percent (I think the figure is 57 percent) output from the load. Circ pumps are sized with this in mind. That's one.

Then there are the steam pumps. A GE BWR has a torus around the base of the core, filled with steam and water, about 50 percent when things are running well. This can be tapped for steam to run the steam pumps. They can exhaust either to a condenser (if available) or open-loop to the containment. That's two.

Then there is the ECCS. We have discussed this. That's three.

The point is, there is defence in depth in the design. All of the straight mechanical systems can be aligned and operated manually, no electricity required. So cooling should be available.

Having said that, if the diesels truly did come up and then flooded out, they have a serious problem. If they run out of steam (can happen) then the steam auxiliaries will stop and the only thing left will be the ECCS - and that will scrap the core. But that is or should be several days down the road, and if they can get any kind of three phase generator in there (assuming right voltage and frequency), even flying it in, they should be fine.

The ECCS is a flooding system designed to dump cold water directly into the core. If you have to use it then you will crap up the reactor, spill water all over the containment and generally make a mess, but it is just water - any firetruck with a pump can supply enough water to do the job. And if you really get into that much trouble, you could use seawater if you had to. But say goodbye to that core - it will never run again.
​
 
The term MG1962 was looking for is called "islanding".
This means that the reactor and turbine does not trip but disconnects from the grid. Reactor power is reduced and the electricity generated supplies the plant. This is called "house load"

Thank you - I tried to google, had no luck
 

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