9/11-investigator explains the Holocaust

[Hans]

Your message is off-topic and has been copied several times, even while I said I would address them.

BUT you have said that before and not done so......

You might just answer the questions - since you have time to post other messages.

Post the answers 9/11 stop avoiding them

 

[Craig4]

BUT you have said that before and not done so......

You might just answer the questions - since you have time to post other messages.

Post the answers 9/11 stop avoiding them

Were you expecting anything else from the likes of him?

 

[dafydd]

BUT you have said that before and not done so......

You might just answer the questions - since you have time to post other messages.

Post the answers 9/11 stop avoiding them

He has abandoned this thread because of questions.
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=178524&page=111
A brave Aryan warrior indeed.

 

[Wroclaw]

Were you expecting anything else from the likes of him?

I doubt any of us thought he had the sack to answer those questions.

 

[dafydd]

BUT you have said that before and not done so......

You might just answer the questions - since you have time to post other messages.

Post the answers 9/11 stop avoiding them

Please don't engage until he answers.

 

[Craig4]

I doubt any of us thought he had the sack to answer those questions.

Typical of his kind.

 

[Dogzilla]

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But what you didn't say was that it was the *wrong* word, you said it wasn't right "in the sense" of being removed from the country -- which is it's only meaning.

Your staement leaves open the possibility that in some other, DZ-only sense, the word was correct.

The words you're looking for are "I was wrong to use the word deport to describe what happened to the Japanese internees." Full stop.
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According to wikipedia, the source of all truth, "deportation" isn't the wrong word to describe what happened to the Japanese. It even says it's not the wrong word for what happened to the Jews.

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And it would have to be free, since the Nazis confiscated all their property.
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Nazis aren't the only people who deport. And that is what we're talking about. Deport.



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And that *you* used "in the sense of" what happened to the Japanese, which was a completely different thing than happened to the Jews

The issue at hand is "deportation." As in deporting Jews qua Jews in and of itself is a crime so obvious that only a hate filled bigot could disagree. We're talking about physically removing people against their choice/will. That is all.

I didnt say it was a stupid thing for *him* to say, I said it was a stupid thing for *you* to say regarding the Japanese internees, as anyone with normal English skills can plainly see.

Well it wasn't a stupid thing to say for the Jews either.

What a strong admission that you were wrong

But since I wasn't.....

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... exists only in your mind, since I was very obviously discussing *your* use.
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My use. Dudalb's use. Let's say "the" use of the word.

Well, anyone with normal English skills would assume that when *you* said that, you were talking about, you know, deportation and further were trying to suggest that the way the US treated the Japanese internees was equivalent to the way the Nazis treated the Jews.

Or anybody who didn't follow the conversation from the beginning where it is clear we're talking about deportation in and of itself being a crime when it happens to the Jews vs when it happens to any other group of people. What happened to the Jews or the other people before or after 'deportation' or why it was done isn't part of the discussion

I did. Then I did again. The second time in the very post to which this response of yours was a response.

No you didn't.

Yes.
Yes.
Yes. Will you be withdrawing your smear that I am prejudice <sic> ?

A person of honour would.

NOW you answered the question. My "smear" was conditional so, yes, it is withdrawn. It was never really there to start.

I was using the word "minute" in the adjective form meaning "teeny tiny" in response to your use of the term "minutia".

That makes more sense.

The sentence structure and content makes this clear to anyone with normal English skills.

I taught myself English while I was in prison, serving four years of a ten year sentence. It's not easy to learn a language when you're a young adult without any fluent speakers to help you practice.

ITYMTS "lied about". And the lack of bodies is *your* problem: the normative understanding of these events explains why there are fewer bodies than there were deaths (cremation) and the rest *do* exist.

Well, duh! Of course it's MY problem! If it was everybody else's problem too, it wouldn't be a problem. It would be our understanding of what happened in the AR camps.

Which was off-topic, since the internment of the Japanese in the US was not a part of the Holocaust, by any normal definition of that term.

No, we were talking about what a hate filled bigot would think of deportation, in and of itself, when it happened to the Jews.

And, no, why you asked the question was in a lame attempt to equate the treatment of the Jews with the treatment of the Japanese and set the groundwork for a "gotcha".

No, I was specifically talking about 'deportation.' You are the one who read more into it by conflating 'deportation' with other actions following 'deportation.'

Which, in your ignorant and mendacious opinion ... what, exactly?

I don't have any ignorant or mendacious opinions. The definition of "holocausted" can only be as detailed as the definition of "holocaust."

What specific page in this novel are you lying supports your accusation that the Hungarian Jews were "set free to inflict an orgy of rape and pillage against the civilian population"?

Or is this another lame attempt to distraact from your mendacity?

Library. Thingys called books. Literacy. Yes. Good. Read. Find truth. Feed. No spoon.

Ah, then you admit that your description that the Hungarian children as inflicting an orgy of rape and pillage against the civilian population" was a lie.

It help your credibility if you just come out and say it.

I don't know if it's a lie. The whole book is one fantastical event after another that describes the holocaust of the 1950s but little resemblance to the one today. Other sources document problems with DPs roaming the countryside so for this one aspect there is corroboration.

Free hint: Check the time stamp on *my* post.


Now check the time stamp on *your* answers.


Then link to the answers you lied that had given before then.

Every time I log on it seems that various posts are being merged with others. It makes sense to streamline all the HD discussions but it does make it difficult to answer questions or find the answers to the questions when they've been moved to another thread.

Then you may want to consider being more specific in the future. Of course, this makes it slightly easier to demonstrate your lies, so you probably won't.

I thought it was obvious who Zvi was by the context. My bad.

Okay.

Now that we've established who you're talking about, all you have to do is document that he was ever "sent to the gas chamber."

I'll wait right here

Nobody said he was "sent to the gas chamber." Strawman much?

This picture is from the Stroop Report. What happened to the Jews in the Warsaw ghetto after the ghetto was liquidated? Where were they sent? How many of the Jews in the photographs from the Stroop Report are presumed to have survived the war?

Get thee to a library and read some. I correct gross errors and point out lies here -- it's not my job to educate the unwilling.

I guess that's true. It's also easier than simply supporting your argument.

Liar:

All the eyewitnesses describe the AR camps as places where Jews stopped for a delousing and then left.

And that statement itself is a lie, as well.

You're really not very good at this, are you?
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And there's a word for what you just did.

It's "lying".
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That's your response to my denying that I said Madjanek was a transit camp (when actually you said that I claimed Madjanek was a "transport camp.")?!?

 

[Dogzilla]

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Yes, but this neither the first nor, unfortunately for you, the last exchange we have had / will have to which your first sentence applies.
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Well, since you have still yet to define in rational terms what you mean by the word "holocausted", but are saying (completely without any evidence) that the Hungarian Jews were "sent elsewhere", this would be another of those exchanges.
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You can define holocausted if you know the definition of holocaust.

 

[Wroclaw]

I taught myself English while I was in prison, serving four years of a ten year sentence. It's not easy to learn a language when you're a young adult without any fluent speakers to help you practice.

What was your first language?

 

[TSR]

According to wikipedia, the source of all truth, "deportation" isn't the wrong word to describe what happened to the Japanese. It even says it's not the wrong word for what happened to the Jews.

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Really? Well by that logic, Wikipedia also reports the normative understanding of the Holocaust is fact, so we can expect you to abandon your denial?

And BTW, checking the Wiki entry for Japanese internment camps, that article uses a variation of the word "deport" exactly 6 times: twice to refer to Japanese non-citizens, twice in reference to the Volga Germans in Siberia, twice to refer to Peruvian natives of Japanese descent.

And absolutely zero times to refer to American citizens of Japanese descent, making this another of your lies.
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Nazis aren't the only people who deport. And that is what we're talking about. Deport.

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No, you proposed, twice, and I agreed, twice, that "forced relocation" would be the term we used.
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The issue at hand is "deportation." As in deporting Jews qua Jews in and of itself is a crime so obvious that only a hate filled bigot could disagree. We're talking about physically removing people against their choice/will. That is all.

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And we seemed to have agreed that this doesn't just include forced relocations of Jews qua Jews, but forced relocations of Japanese qua Japanese and forced relocations of Germans qua Germans (just to name the two groups that had your panties in a wad.)

Or is it that you don't think that Jews qua Jews is a crime?
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Well it wasn't a stupid thing to say for the Jews either.

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No, it wasn't, because what happened to them *was* deportation. What happened to the vast majority of Japanese internees was that they were allowed to return to their homes after, in that they weren't killed.
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But since I wasn't.....

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I see, so you now feel you lied when you made your first "strong admission"?
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My use. Dudalb's use. Let's say "the" use of the word.

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No, let's not. I was very clearly and specifically talking about *your* use.
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Or anybody who didn't follow the conversation from the beginning where it is clear we're talking about deportation in and of itself being a crime when it happens to the Jews vs when it happens to any other group of people. What happened to the Jews or the other people before or after 'deportation' or why it was done isn't part of the discussion

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Tell me again: how is a discussion of the legality of deportation in general relevant to a discussion about the Holocaust?

You *do* realize that's the topic of the thread, right? The Holocaust?
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No you didn't.

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Yes, I did. That the answer didn't take the exact format you insisted on later in your last response to me doesn't change that.

And then I responded in exactly the format you demanded, so why is this part of the conversation continuing?
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NOW you answered the question. My "smear" was conditional so, yes, it is withdrawn. It was never really there to start.

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No, what was never really there was a basis. There is nothing conditional about "Why don't you stop being a girly man and just admit you're prejudice".
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That makes more sense.

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Made perfect sense before, too. You just didn't understand.
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I taught myself English while I was in prison, serving four years of a ten year sentence. It's not easy to learn a language when you're a young adult without any fluent speakers to help you practice.
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I will begin to take that into account when I respond to you, and try to keep it simple and obvious (there was no sarcasm intended in that statement, BTW)
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Well, duh! Of course it's MY problem! If it was everybody else's problem too, it wouldn't be a problem. It would be our understanding of what happened in the AR camps.

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What I was trying to say is that the normative understanding completely explains why there are more dead people than there are bodies. It's only *your* version that lacks that explanation. If you want your explanation not to be laughed at, *you're* the one that has to come up with bodies.
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No, we were talking about what a hate filled bigot would think of deportation, in and of itself, when it happened to the Jews.

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... and then you brought up the Japanese internees, who have no relevance to what you *just said* was the topic under consideration.
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No, I was specifically talking about 'deportation.' You are the one who read more into it by conflating 'deportation' with other actions following 'deportation.'

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"Deportation," which you subsequently admitted was not the correct term. "Deportation," which everyone else also saw as the beginnings of an attempt to equate the overall treatment of the Japanese and the Jews.
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I don't have any ignorant or mendacious opinions. The definition of "holocausted" can only be as detailed as the definition of "holocaust."

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And you obviously have a different definition of the Holocaust than most people. So detail *that* definition and stop ducking the question.
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Library. Thingys called books. Literacy. Yes. Good. Read. Find truth. Feed. No spoon.

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One notes not even the slightest attempt to answer the question posed, so here it is again for you to run from again:

What specific page in this novel (that is to say, a work of fiction) are you lying supports your accusation that the Hungarian Jews were "set free to inflict an orgy of rape and pillage against the civilian population"?

It doesn't, and you have not read it so you don't even know it doesn't.

I have, so I do.
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I don't know if it's a lie. The whole book is one fantastical event after another that describes the holocaust of the 1950s but little resemblance to the one today. Other sources document problems with DPs roaming the countryside so for this one aspect there is corroboration.

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If these "other sources" document the Hungarian Jews raping and pillaging, why did you not cite them instead of a novel which does not mention them as having done so?

I'm still waiting for evidence in support the lie you told about the Hungarian Jews. And yes you *do* know that it's a lie, in that you know you made it up in a lame attempt to be clever by crapping on their graves. That says a lot about you.
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Every time I log on it seems that various posts are being merged with others.
It makes sense to streamline all the HD discussions but it does make it difficult to answer questions or find the answers to the questions when they've been moved to another thread.

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All of the posts mentioned were always a part of *this* thread. Dodge noted.
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I thought it was obvious who Zvi was by the context. My bad.

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... because, of course, there's only one Zvi who was ever mistreated by the Nazis...
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Nobody said he was "sent to the gas chamber." Strawman much?

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No, never.

As I said, little Henrio was snatched from the comfort and safety of his family and sent to the gas chamber in either Auschwitz or Treblinka. I'm not sure which one. It's possible--although not certain--that he was thrown alive into the gas oven. After the war, he moved to Brooklyn and became a successful ear, nose, and throat specialist.

Oh, wait a minute! That was Zvi, not Henrio.

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Lie much? BTW, you have still yet to link to "where you said" this making this an again.
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This picture is from the Stroop Report. What happened to the Jews in the Warsaw ghetto after the ghetto was liquidated? Where were they sent? How many of the Jews in the photographs from the Stroop Report are presumed to have survived the war?

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What picture is that?
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I guess that's true. It's also easier than simply supporting your argument.

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... says the expert on not supporting zir argument. Hypocrite much? How's that Hungarian "rape and pillage" thing working out for you?

My argument is that you can't say what happened to Henio, and that you can't because you know that the act of looking into it might cause you to reconsider your denial, which must be maintained at all costs.
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That's your response to my denying that I said Madjanek was a transit camp (when actually you said that I claimed Madjanek was a "transport camp.")?!?

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What? Pointing out your fundamental dishonesty isn't response enough?
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[TSR]

You can define holocausted if you know the definition of holocaust.

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I do know the definition, and know that it includes a variety of acts by the Nazis.

Are you saying that all of these acts were performed on all of the Hungarian Jews?

Who was left to 'rape and pillage' then?
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[9/11-investigator]

Interesting links:

http://www.fpp.co.uk/History/General/SPBest/030447.html
Real Conditions in the Nazi concentration camp at Sachsenhausen during World War Two
Letter from Anglo to Anglo where the first prisoner accuses the second of exageration:

http://www.fpp.co.uk/History/Keegan/Keegan040396.html
Reading main stream historian Keegan between the lines, seeing that he is sceptical about Auschwitz death toll. Inexplicably sticking with the 6M figure (probably does not want to ruin his career)

http://www.fpp.co.uk/History/General/PolishReport1943.html#typhus
Polish resistance deliberated spreading typhoid bacteria!
Anne Frank killed by Poles rather than Anglos?!

http://www.fpp.co.uk/Auschwitz/docs/Pravda020245.html
Extremely interesting report from Pravda about Auschwitz from feb 1945, shortly after liberation of the camp.

What is most striking about this press report is that it is totally at variance with the version of Auschwitz that we have come to know, substituting the traditional atrocity record with another, completely imaginary one. That the first non-anonymous observer at the Auschwitz camp could be so far from the current narrative speaks not only to the inaccuracy of this initial report, but also to the artifice of all subsequent ones.

 

[9/11-investigator]

I had missed this one:

http://www.eutimes.net/2010/01/holocaust-was-a-jewish-invention-says-top-polish-bishop/

Holocaust was a Jewish Invention, says top Polish Bishop


He said it one year ago.
The dams are going to break, thanks to this medium.

 

[TSR]

I had missed this one:

http://www.eutimes.net/2010/01/holocaust-was-a-jewish-invention-says-top-polish-bishop/

Holocaust was a Jewish Invention, says top Polish Bishop


He said it one year ago.
The dams are going to break, thanks to this medium.

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And then, a few days later

He explicitly denied saying that he had called the Holocaust a "Jewish invention".

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Hey, niner: What Happened To Henio?
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[dafydd]

I had missed this one:

http://www.eutimes.net/2010/01/holocaust-was-a-jewish-invention-says-top-polish-bishop/

Holocaust was a Jewish Invention, says top Polish Bishop


He said it one year ago.
The dams are going to break, thanks to this medium.

Guys add your questions please in the format below:

1. Hans: Where is the text of these 'peace messages' 9/11 says Hitler was putting out early in the war.... Give us the details, the date it was sent by who, to whom and what did it say, full and complete details.

2. Hans: Why did 2.8 to 3.3 million Soviet POWs die in Nazi 'care'? More than 50% against 3.5% of western POW taken by the Nazis?

3. Hans: 9/11 give us your vision of the world in 1946 if the English and French hadn't declare war on Germany when it invaded Poland? What would have happened?

4. Hans: So why didn’t all the horribly terrible countries that wanted to attack Germany not do so? Why didn’t Russia, Poland, Czechoslovakia, Luxembourg, Belgium, Netherlands, Denmark, Norway, Britain and France just all attack in 1933, 34, 35,36,37 or 38 or 39 why sit there and wait for Germany to attack them? Elucidation 9/11?"

5. TSR: Prove a single lie from the *judgments* at Nuremberg.

6. TSR: Prove that Poland fought wars with *all* of its neigbhors for expansion post WWI.

7. TSR: Where in this document which you cited is the word "lebenstraum" even mentioned?

8. TSR: And what did Bullitt say to Cordell Hull in '36 and why?

9. TSR: What evidence does Suvorov cite in his book(s)?

10. TSR: What, specifically, did each of those tens of thousands you admit were shot "in the East" do to deserve being shot?

11. TSR: What does this from your own source do to your citation of Stefan Scheil as authority?

Dabei ignoriere Scheil folgende Tatsachen:
die Hoßbach-Niederschrift vom November 1937, nach der Hitler den Krieg gegen Polen angestrebt und für unvermeidbar erklärt hat,
Hitlers Kriegskurs seit dem Münchner Abkommen 1938,
unannehmbare Forderungen des NS-Regimes an Polen, so dass dessen Regierung eine gegenseitige Grenzgarantie im März 1939 ablehnte,
die „bewusst eskalierten Spannungen mit Polen im Sommer 1939“,
dass die Wehrmacht seit Juni 1939 angriffsbereit war,
dass die „teilweise martialischen Töne“ in Polen bedeutungslos waren, weil den Deutschen ihre reale militärisch-technische Überlegenheit klar war,
Hitlers Rede am 22. August 1939 vor Wehrmachtsgenerälen, in der er zur Zerschlagung Polens und Vernichtung seiner Führungsschicht aufrief und kein Eingreifen der westlichen Bündnispartner Polens erwartete,
dass Stalin Hitler mit dem Hitler-Stalin-Pakt nicht zum Krieg gegen Polen drängte, sondern dessen Angriffswillen für eigene gefahrlose Gebietsgewinne nutzte.

12. TSR: In what way am *I*, personally, an enemy of Europe?

13 What were Anne Frank's crimes?

 

[9/11-investigator]

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And then, a few days later

Not everybody has the spine of bishop Williamson.

Pope welcomes back holocaust denying bishop

Pope Orders Bishop Williamson to Recant

Holocaust-denying bishop apologizes, but does not recant

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Hey, niner: What Happened To Henio?
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Henio who?

 

[dafydd]

Answer the questions first.

 

[TSR]

Not everybody has the spine of bishop Williamson.

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You misspelled "sheer obstinate and willful ignorance" above, HTH.
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Henio who?

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Henio Zytomirski, which you would know had you been paying attention rather than scouring liar denial sites for crap to justify your Jew hatred, and spending so much time whining about everyone pointing out that you cannot answer questions about your own assertions (the answers to which a *rational* being would have have before making them).
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[9/11-investigator]

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You misspelled "sheer obstinate and willful ignorance" above, HTH.
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You think you can impress anyone with pointing at spelling mistakes in a language that is not my first but third, after Dutch and German, but before French and Russian? Does it not show that you have no arguments regarding the topic we are discussing in this thread?

Henio Zytomirski, which you would know had you been paying attention rather than scouring liar denial sites for crap to justify your Jew hatred, and spending so much time whining about everyone pointing out that you cannot answer questions about your own assertions (the answers to which a *rational* being would have have before making them).
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Henio Zytomirski who?

 

[TheRedWorm]

You have severe problems with honesty.


1. Hans: Where is the text of these 'peace messages' 9/11 says Hitler was putting out early in the war.... Give us the details, the date it was sent by who, to whom and what did it say, full and complete details.

2. Hans: Why did 2.8 to 3.3 million Soviet POWs die in Nazi 'care'? More than 50% against 3.5% of western POW taken by the Nazis?

3. Hans: 9/11 give us your vision of the world in 1946 if the English and French hadn't declare war on Germany when it invaded Poland? What would have happened?

4. Hans: So why didn’t all the horribly terrible countries that wanted to attack Germany not do so? Why didn’t Russia, Poland, Czechoslovakia, Luxembourg, Belgium, Netherlands, Denmark, Norway, Britain and France just all attack in 1933, 34, 35,36,37 or 38 or 39 why sit there and wait for Germany to attack them? Elucidation 9/11?"

5. TSR: Prove a single lie from the *judgments* at Nuremberg.

6. TSR: Prove that Poland fought wars with *all* of its neigbhors for expansion post WWI.

7. TSR: Where in this document which you cited is the word "lebenstraum" even mentioned?

8. TSR: And what did Bullitt say to Cordell Hull in '36 and why?

9. TSR: What evidence does Suvorov cite in his book(s)?

10. TSR: What, specifically, did each of those tens of thousands you admit were shot "in the East" do to deserve being shot?

11. TSR: What does this from your own source do to your citation of Stefan Scheil as authority?

Dabei ignoriere Scheil folgende Tatsachen:
die Hoßbach-Niederschrift vom November 1937, nach der Hitler den Krieg gegen Polen angestrebt und für unvermeidbar erklärt hat,
Hitlers Kriegskurs seit dem Münchner Abkommen 1938,
unannehmbare Forderungen des NS-Regimes an Polen, so dass dessen Regierung eine gegenseitige Grenzgarantie im März 1939 ablehnte,
die „bewusst eskalierten Spannungen mit Polen im Sommer 1939“,
dass die Wehrmacht seit Juni 1939 angriffsbereit war,
dass die „teilweise martialischen Töne“ in Polen bedeutungslos waren, weil den Deutschen ihre reale militärisch-technische Überlegenheit klar war,
Hitlers Rede am 22. August 1939 vor Wehrmachtsgenerälen, in der er zur Zerschlagung Polens und Vernichtung seiner Führungsschicht aufrief und kein Eingreifen der westlichen Bündnispartner Polens erwartete,
dass Stalin Hitler mit dem Hitler-Stalin-Pakt nicht zum Krieg gegen Polen drängte, sondern dessen Angriffswillen für eigene gefahrlose Gebietsgewinne nutzte.

12. TSR: In what way am *I*, personally, an enemy of Europe?

13 What were Anne Frank's crimes?