South Tower 81st floor filled with thermite?

[twinstead]

They said the seismic data had the signatures of explosives. I'm watching the entire 911 Witness documentary at the moment, and hopefully they will say something about the timing. When I looked at the timing of the recorded seismic events some time ago I found inconsistencies, but I don't remember exactly if the seismic events started some 10 seconds prior to the start of the collapse for each tower as some videos show. I remember a 5 second inconsistency and a 17 second inconsistency, or something like that.

The seismic data is completely contrary to the notion that explosives were used to bring down the buildings.

 

[DGM]

I never knew about the vast numbers of batteries (UPC) stored in the vicinity of impact. However, if true, that certainly explains the "molten metal" thingy.

http://11-settembre.blogspot.com/2007/02/ups-on-81st-floor-of-wtc2.html

This is a good article about the UPS/ molten metal issue.

 

[Dave Rogers]

Remember, those pools of molten metal also could have been there for any one of a dozen reasons.

Or, given that they're all from eyewitness accounts that by their very nature can't have been checked against physical evidence, they may not have been there at all.

Dave

 

[alphahelix]

ups stuff

Ok, I can see that in a large UPS system there could be separate batteries, mounted in racks. But the article talks about the entire floor filled with 'battery-looking things'. Doesn't sound like the kind of UPS system you describe.

It depends on the purpose and the type of "ups" installed.

Some NOCs I've been in have stacked 48 volt batteries (they look like car batteries) that come pre-charged. (Mainly DC stuff)

Others have the APC brand (or other brand) which can be slightly larger than a power strip to as tall as a room. If they powering devices the "ups" is on but the batteries are only used if power is lost, or if the batteries are charging.

Some "ups"s are just there for line conditioning or have just enough power to hold until a generator comes on.

If a large amount of power is needed in a "ups" with a good electrician any number of batteries and componets can be custom built to suit needs and power requirements.

And if the batteries never engaged the circuit to provide power its a good thing (It means you have good clean dependable power). I would expect the batteries were load/stress tested from time to time to make sure that one didn't go bad.

 

[Gamolon]

1. Charges for creating the holes in the shape of planes in the facades (plus magnesium flare as a marker for timing and positioning of computer graphics insertions)

I've asked this before. You claim explosives were used to create the holes in the perimeter columns? Please explain how the aluminum cladding, COVERING The outside of the perimeter columns was dented INWARD from the outside? How is that possible without an object of some kind impacting the aluminum cladding from the OUTSIDE traveling inward to make that dent?

This one piece of damage alone debunks your claim of explosives being used.

 

[ElMondoHummus]

Ha. I checked NCSTAR 1-3C and the document doesn't say that the steel from floor 81 was NOT damaged!

No, you quite obviously didn't. There are multiple paragraphs and even some photos where the damage to recovered channels, flanges, webs, etc. were displayed and discussed.

Furthermore, even if the steel was not damaged, that right there would disprove the thermite proposal. How would thermite have started the collapse on that floor without damaging the steel?

 

[Triterope]

The bank managers may say that they indeed had just installed a huge UPS system on that floor, although I find that a bit suspicious.

What in God's green earth is suspicious about a banking firm installing backup equipment?

Frankly, this sort of statement is why the world doesn't take 9-11 Truthers seriously. You're "suspicious" of the most innocuous things (a type of firm with extensive data storage requirements installing IT backup equipment) and you jump from that to outlandish non-sequitir conclusions (woooo, thermite!)

 

[Anders Lindman]

It depends on the purpose and the type of "ups" installed.

Some NOCs I've been in have stacked 48 volt batteries (they look like car batteries) that come pre-charged. (Mainly DC stuff)

Others have the APC brand (or other brand) which can be slightly larger than a power strip to as tall as a room. If they powering devices the "ups" is on but the batteries are only used if power is lost, or if the batteries are charging.

Some "ups"s are just there for line conditioning or have just enough power to hold until a generator comes on.

If a large amount of power is needed in a "ups" with a good electrician any number of batteries and componets can be custom built to suit needs and power requirements.

And if the batteries never engaged the circuit to provide power its a good thing (It means you have good clean dependable power). I would expect the batteries were load/stress tested from time to time to make sure that one didn't go bad.

It would be interesting to know if the WTC towers had any back-up system for electricity such as diesel generators. Then there would hardly be any need for any individual tenant to have their own huge UPS system filling an entire floor.

 

[Anders Lindman]

I've asked this before. You claim explosives were used to create the holes in the perimeter columns? Please explain how the aluminum cladding, COVERING The outside of the perimeter columns was dented INWARD from the outside? How is that possible without an object of some kind impacting the aluminum cladding from the OUTSIDE traveling inward to make that dent?
[qimg]http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff290/gamolon/wtchole2bent.jpg[/qimg]

This one piece of damage alone debunks your claim of explosives being used.

Explosives mounted on the outside of the facade: http://www.ewindowwashing.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/High-Rise-Window-Cleaning-San-Diego-1.jpg

 

[Anders Lindman]

No, you quite obviously didn't. There are multiple paragraphs and even some photos where the damage to recovered channels, flanges, webs, etc. were displayed and discussed.

Furthermore, even if the steel was not damaged, that right there would disprove the thermite proposal. How would thermite have started the collapse on that floor without damaging the steel?

I couldn't find any text that ruled out thermite being used on floor 81. I saw some images of some very curved steel columns. The completely melted steel on floor 81 they may simply have omitted from the report.

 

[Dave Rogers]

Of course, you've only got the unsupported word of NIST that steel samples were recovered from that floor.

The completely melted steel on floor 81 they may simply have omitted from the report.

OK, I'm a bad person.

Dave

 

[Anders Lindman]

What in God's green earth is suspicious about a banking firm installing backup equipment?

Frankly, this sort of statement is why the world doesn't take 9-11 Truthers seriously. You're "suspicious" of the most innocuous things (a type of firm with extensive data storage requirements installing IT backup equipment) and you jump from that to outlandish non-sequitir conclusions (woooo, thermite!)

Nothing strange with bank managers ordering a UPS system. What made me suspicious was the monstrously huge size of the UPS system (filling an entire floor with 'battery-looking things' as it said in the article). What bank managers would order such a titanic UPS system to be installed in an expensive office floor in Manhattan?

 

[Dave Rogers]

Nothing strange with bank managers ordering a UPS system. What made me suspicious was the monstrously huge size of the UPS system (filling an entire floor with 'battery-looking things' as it said in the article). What bank managers would order such a titanic UPS system to be installed in an expensive office floor in Manhattan?

Managers of a very, very big bank.

Dave

 

[Triterope]

It would be interesting to know if the WTC towers had any back-up system for electricity such as diesel generators. Then there would hardly be any need for any individual tenant to have their own huge UPS system filling an entire floor.

IT firms need UPS backups that take effect instantly, so computers in use at the time of the outage will not lose or corrupt data. Something diesel-powered would hardly be effective. Therefore individual firms can have UPS needs that differ from the building as a whole.

Again, you prove you don't know what you're talking about.

 

[Anders Lindman]

IT firms need UPS backups that take effect instantly, so computers in use at the time of the outage will not lose or corrupt data. Something diesel-powered would hardly be effective. Therefore individual firms can have UPS needs that differ from the building as a whole.

Again, you prove you don't know what you're talking about.

Yes, instantly, that's the idea with a UPS you know. Until the diesel generators kick in. And for that they will not need to fill an entire floor with UPS units.

 

[Quad4_72]

My theory is, I have written about it in several other threads but could be worth repeating here, that they only needed to rig one floor in each tower with thermite in order to make sure that the collapse would start on those floors. The collapses of the entire towers were caused by large explosives under the basements of the towers. See for example this video called 911 Eyewitness from about 15:50: http://www.videonger.com/watch/1847/

The large amount of explosives under the basements emulated a strong enough earthquake to make the towers start to collapse. The towers were designed to collapse like they did straight down for safety reasons in the case of a severe earthquake. The alternative would have been to design them to risk falling sideways like dominoes into Manhattan. Not good.

This is borderline psychotic thinking. You are aware that there is not a single audio recording of an explosive charge being detonated on 9/11 correct?

 

[DGM]

It would be interesting to know if the WTC towers had any back-up system for electricity such as diesel generators. Then there would hardly be any need for any individual tenant to have their own huge UPS system filling an entire floor.

Yes they did have emergency power. It's absurd to think it would cover all the needs of the towers. This shows how shallow your understanding of the workings of a large building is,

 

[Dave Rogers]

Yes, instantly, that's the idea with a UPS you know.

Depends on the application. Lighting and heating out for a few seconds while the diesel generator starts up, no problem. Client/server architecture with frequent automatic backups, minor problem. Large mainframe processing real time data, major problem. If the building doesn't provide what the tenant needs, then the tenant needs to provide it himself. And, since most tenants won't need the highest possible spec, it doesn't make sense for the building owner to provide it.

Dave

 

[WildCat]

Is everything made of thermite in the magic land of truth?

It's thermite all the way down.

 

[WildCat]

But it was from floor 81 in the South Tower where molten metal could be seen pouring out: http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/analysis/theories/docs/st_spout3s.jpg

I think that could have been a result of a lot of thermite used on that floor.

Or it was the result of the airplane hitting that floor, along with the many tons of aluminum it was made of.

Of course, you don't think any airplanes hit the WTC, so this explanation is probably unsatisfactory to you. But people without a mental illness will understand.