Protests in Wisconsin - Scott Walker

See, here the entire collectives are being called a state union or the Wisconsin chapter:
Government unions in Wisconsin perfectly match the definition of "special interests," a term Obama often invokes. Four of the top six Wisconsin contributors to the 2010 elections were labor unions, with the state's teachers union giving $119,342 and the Wisconsin chapter of the American Federation of State, County, and Municipal Employees spending $83,888. The teachers union gave 96 percent of its money to Democrats, while Wisconsin AFSCME gave Democrats every penny.

Government unions spent $573,868 on Wisconsin's 2010 elections -- almost all of it going to Democrats -- while government employees spent another half million, with most going to Democrats.
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This anti-union site has some useful data.
Major Unions in Wisconsin
IBEW (State Conference)
CJA (State Council)
UFCW (Local 1444)
AFSCME (District Council 48)
LIUNA (District Council)
IUOE (Local 139)
UFCW (Local 73)
UAW (Local 95)
PPF (State Association )
IBT (Local 695)
SMW (Local 18)
IBEW (Local 2150)
IAM (District Lodge 121)
IBT (Local 662)
IBT (Local 200)


State-level Political Donations
Public sector unions give thousands of dollars to local legislators, often in an effort to guarantee exorbitant benefits from the state.

Total Contributions
Democrat $ 473,152
Other $ 26,632
Republican $ 20,960

Federal-level Political Donations
Each election unions spend millions of their members' money supporting politicians, many of whom the union members don't even like. The following Wisconsin candidates received money from labor unions.

Total Contributions
Democrat $ 904,575
Republican $ 149,600
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I haven't found a breakdown by union yet.
 
Whiplash said:
What is being pulled here is far far worse than that which you decried for the last two years. Republicans didn't pull any stunts like this. They just refused to support you. This is childish, and the entire thing is being misrepresented by most people on the left.
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He deliberately broke government to diempower working peope to create a more corporate-friendly environment. He's a petty tyrant and it would speak ill of the wisdom of the people of Wisconsin to ever elect the jerk to another office.
 
Whiplash said:
As a lifelong Wisconsin resident, I am actually not happy that we are currently the center of attention like this. Some may think it would be cool to be all over the national news.. but I hate it.

Mostly because it's getting all kinds of people weighing in on something that is a local issue, from other places where they don't know all the details and facts, and are often misrepresenting the truth, for political reasons.

All I can say is, as much as you Democrats may hate Walker and think he's an idiot, I would suggest you be careful. You could make him famous. You only know what you know about him based on your own little liberal blogs and what little time he's been in the spotlight. He was our Milwaukee County Executive for many years. He did a great many good things in that time. He showed himself to be a true fiscal conservative. A responsible man who takes his job very seriously.

The man is greatly respected here. It would not be surprising at all to many of us for him to launch into national spotlight from this sort of thing.

Be careful what you wish for. Don't let your ideology drive you to make decisions you will regret. The man could be a superstar for the right one day.

And I can't help but note how Democrats are defending this "flee the state" stalling tactic. It's a direct attempt to circumvent the results of the election. And considering the way you lefties were crying and crying about Republicans JUST FAILING TO VOTE WITH YOU, it's the height of hypocrisy to then defend this action. What is being pulled here is far far worse than that which you decried for the last two years. Republicans didn't pull any stunts like this. They just refused to support you. This is childish, and the entire thing is being misrepresented by most people on the left.
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Please explain how and why this respected fiscal conservative took a budget surplus and created a budget deficit, or who really did so. Also, please address why this makes it alright to take this 'crisis' and use it to dismantle collective bargaining.

I'm not from Wisconsin, I don't know. The fact that have been present in this thread, which granted are difficult to separate from the usual politics bickering, don't paint either group in a great light, but shows blatant misconduct by Walker. Perhaps you have some facts that I haven't seen yet?

My opinion is that the union strikes make perfect sense, but should be official strikes. The Democratic reps should have refused to vote and left the state for one day as a publicity stunt, then returned to vote. They should then point out the stupidly obvious ploy Walker used and end every speech/letter/interview with, "And don't forget Walker created a deficit in order to attack workers," until he's out of office. Walker should remove the current proposal and promise to look at other ways, perhaps by changing some of the stuff he changed to create the as yet unfulfilled deficit, and appear that he is trying to unite. He can always propose these current measures again if he really thinks they are important, but it's hard not to see it as rewards for allies.
 
Crowds could get up to 70,000 on the Square today from what I've read. But the weather will be turning awful with half a foot of snow and ice forecast starting tonight.
 
esquel said:
So at the conclusion of my union contract, it's hunky-dory if the state decides to unilaterally replace it with payment in cheese sandwiches, no pesky negotiation required? Gee, thanks!
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And that's exactly what can happen in the private sector. Welcome to my world.
 
Frank Newgent said:
Crowds could get up to 70,000 on the Square today from what I've read. But the weather will be turning awful with half a foot of snow and ice forecast starting tonight.
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I've read that Tea Party folks are going to be bussed in.

I hope this doesn't get violent---from both sides.
 
esquel said:
So at the conclusion of my union contract, it's hunky-dory if the state decides to unilaterally replace it with payment in cheese sandwiches, no pesky negotiation required? Gee, thanks!
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You're a teacher esquel? Here's a homework assignment for you, paraphrase this article in your own words and relate it to your "cheese sandwich" post: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_dilemma
 
Vampire said:
Wow. So you're not exactly scientifically literate are you? Didn't think I would stumble across that on randi.org

Additionally, your other posts don't exactly bolster your reputation either; insistently dodging questions and giving garbled answers shows a number of facets of your thinking here (all poor, sorry).
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Wow. All of two posts and you know everything about me and JREF. :rolleyes:
 
The sad thing is the usual news false equivalency coverage. It appears there's about 50 counter-protesters and CNN just gave them equal time, without any mention whatsoever that they were interviewing a handful of people compared to the tens of thousands on the other side.
 
Kthulhut Fhtagn said:
Besides, in practice there really is no difference between an unfunded increase in spending at one-hundred and forty million dollars and a tax cut of one-hundred and forty million dollars if spending isn't reduced.
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You really believe that? Liberal economics 101 folks.

PS ... Looks to me like Walker is going to reduce spending. :D
 
esquel said:
So at the conclusion of my union contract, it's hunky-dory if the state decides to unilaterally replace it with payment in cheese sandwiches, no pesky negotiation required? Gee, thanks!
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what makes you think you deserve cheese?

/sarcasm
 
BeAChooser said:
You really believe that? Liberal economics 101 folks.

PS ... Looks to me like Walker is going to reduce spending. :D
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Maybe then you could explain the functional difference between a budgetary shortfall incurred due to $140 million dollars worth of spending increases and a budgetary shortfall incurred due to $140 million dollars worth of tax cuts?

And of course he is, right after he used the budget shortfall he created to attack unions. Funny how that worked out.

Also, maybe you could try addressing the rest of my post and, oh I don't know, address me instead of your imaginary audience?
 
tyr_13 said:
Please explain how and why this respected fiscal conservative took a budget surplus and created a budget deficit, or who really did so. Also, please address why this makes it alright to take this 'crisis' and use it to dismantle collective bargaining.
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I don't think there's only one "deficit" that's being discussed here, one group seems to be blaming Walker for a current deficit and claiming he started with a surplus, but there was a projected future shortfall of $2.2B (allegedly that number also presumed about $1B of existing spending cuts to be continued by Walker) over the next 2 years when he took office. The $2.2B is definitely not his fault, as for the other number people are talking about I have no idea. Either way the budget issues aren't simply "fake" like is being stated. He may or may not have overspent or overcut or whatever in his first couple months, but I'd like to see where he uses this 2-month budget deficit as the primary justification of the bill..

(Edit: Now I'm reading the tax breaks he gave to businesses don't take effect until next year's budget anyway.. So aside from $1B/year projected shortfall whether he "created" a deficit in the current year or used that as an "excuse" for this bill should be laid out a bit more clearly by whoever is making those accusations..)

(Edit 2: Well I tried, and I can't find anywhere that Scott Walker pointed at this year's budget as the reason for the bill. All I can find is him talking about the $3B+ two-year deficit that's projected. People who are saying that he spent/taxcut $150M or so as an excuse to pass this bill, please provide a link where he actually makes any such excuse.. I admit it might be tough since there are 500 websites repeating the accusation clogging the google results.. but those sites also don't appear to have any quotes from Walker to support this notion.)
 
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How long are Wisconsinites supposed to wait before seeing if the business tax cuts will increase employment and how will the governor show the changes were due to his business quid pro quo (assuming the businesses that got the tax cut included a lot of campaign contributors) vs due to the economy improving in the county?

Are states going to get in bidding wars (they already do) to see who can attract the most companies by offering the best tax deals? That's not evidence low taxes increase employment, BTW, it's evidence low taxes shift employment. So if you think it's every state for itself you would think that was fine, until everyone from low employment states flood into yours for the jobs. It's self defeating in the long run.


My bigger worry is that all this budget tightening both state and federal is going to set the recovery back.
 
Representative Gordon Hintz gives a passionate explanation of why Walkers actions piss him off.

 
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