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Bill O'Reily challenges scientest to explain how moon got there...

Bill Thompson said:
which God? Spinoza's God? Athiests use the biblical god, but that is a strawman argument. "godless universe" makes about as much sense to some as "natureless nature"
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Bill O'Reilly is a Catholic. He believes in the Biblical God, not Spinoza's God. Hence it is not a strawman.
 
fuelair said:
What point Bill? And how is his remark out of context? In what context is that not a beyond ignorant (no, stupid, ignorant can be fixed)point/request/question for a theoretically educated adult in the USA in the 21st Century?:confused::confused::jaw-dropp:jaw-dropp
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I think I made an earlier post about that.
I do not feel like defending a man who does not know that we have a good idea where the moon came from.
Or, for that matter what causes high tide.

Anyway, I think an earlier post I made explained what he was trying to say or what I think he was trying to say.

There are thiests who actually are also fairly bright scientists. I think Bill was trying to make a point that they would make. But he is not as educated as they are and it did not work. "where did the moon come from" would have been something more like "why does the the universe even exist at all" if a brighter guy was talking. If you watch the whole video that seems to be what he was trying to get at because the context of what he said was in reference to someone who wrote him telling him that high tide was caused by the gravity of the moon.
 
Puppycow said:
Bill O'Reilly is a Catholic. He believes in the Biblical God, not Spinoza's God. Hence it is not a strawman.
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That is untrue. Even the pope (at least John Paul said...) does not believe in a literal biblical god. Catholics are not biblical fundamentalists. At least, not all are.

And I am not defending Bill O'Reilly.
 
Out of curiosity I looked up Spinoza's God.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spinozism

In a letter to Henry Oldenburg he states that: "as to the view of certain people that I identify god with nature (taken as a kind of mass or corporeal matter), they are quite mistaken".[1] For Spinoza, our universe (cosmos) is a mode under two attributes of Thought and Extension. God has infinitely many other attributes which are not present in our world. According to German philosopher Karl Jaspers, when Spinoza wrote "Deus sive Natura" (God or Nature) Spinoza meant God was Natura naturans not Natura naturata, and Jaspers believed that Spinoza, in his philosophical system, did not mean to say that God and Nature are interchangeable terms, but rather that God's transcendence was attested by his infinitely many attributes, and that two attributes known by humans, namely Thought and Extension, signified God's immanence.[2]
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Sounds like pseudo-intellectual hogwash to me.
 
He is getting into astronomy and cosmology. I do not know why. He is getting into theology. I don't know why.

So he has opened himself to be an easy target for the political Left who sends a lot of time looking for any slip-up from his team to magnify.

I find it embarassing that a grown man does not know that we have known since the Apollo missions where the moon came from.

Like I said, if he ever had a good point to make in the past, it is going to be ignored now.
 
MG1962 said:
But Robo The Earth and Moon orbit a common point of gravity so indeed they should be considered a twin planet - Now the decison to demote Pluto comes back to haunt, because Earth has not cleared its orbit of sufficent mass

And for the record - give Bill a couple of gummy bears and send him on his way
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Jupiter and Ganymede also orbit a common centre of gravity. Does that make Jupiter not a planet?
 
Roboramma said:
I don't see how that follows: it would be true even if the moon were a twentieth it's current mass. That's just how gravity works.
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But the issue is - Earth has a wobble created by the influence of the Moon. The barycenter is some 200 miles or so from the center of Earth
 
Bill Thompson said:
There are thiests who actually are also fairly bright scientists. I think Bill was trying to make a point that they would make. But he is not as educated as they are and it did not work. "where did the moon come from" would have been something more like "why does the the universe even exist at all" if a brighter guy was talking.
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So to summarize: If he were smarter, he would have said something less dumb.

While I agree that the above is a true statement, I fail to see how it's useful for the discussion at hand.
 
Damien Evans said:
Jupiter and Ganymede also orbit a common centre of gravity. Does that make Jupiter not a planet?
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Jupiter does not wobble in the orbit. But it is a good example because one of the informal definitions is the barycenter should be above the surface of one body. Where is the surface of Jupiter

A further complication - the Moon is moving away from Earth. At some point in the future the barycenter will be outside the defined point of the Earth's surface
 
My theory is that, like lots of famous people, no one is around to tell this guy when he has made a huge mistake or should take a moment and do some research. His ego has outgrown the common sense he should have to not talk about something he does not know anything about.

I am also afraid that maybe this is how we all go when we get older. Let me guess, someone is going to say that I am already there.
 
Wow, just wow, this man is an important figure on US national TV......
this must be so embarrassing to normally educated US Americans.
Almost as embarrassing as von Däniken is embarrassing to me :D
 
Thunder said:
since when did O'Reilly become such a moron?
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"Become"? Unless we're talking about a different Bill O'Reilly, he's always been a moron. Caution: contains bad language, including the F-bomb.


 
Bill Thompson said:
That is untrue. Even the pope (at least John Paul said...) does not believe in a literal biblical god. Catholics are not biblical fundamentalists. At least, not all are.
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I don't think anyone who knows anything about Catholicism could think that Catholics are Biblical literalists. That doesn't change the fact, though, that they believe in the Biblical God. Nor does it change the fact that the answer I originally gave which you categorised as a strawman is no such thing.

It's worth noting that O'Reilly often refers to God as "the God of the Bible". He also has offered up the Bible's existence as proof of the existence of God. I think that, if the fact that he's a Catholic doesn't, should be enough proof that he believes in the Biblical God.
 
Bill Thompson said:
He is getting into astronomy and cosmology. I do not know why. He is getting into theology. I don't know why.

So he has opened himself to be an easy target for the political Left who sends a lot of time looking for any slip-up from his team to magnify.

I find it embarassing that a grown man does not know that we have known since the Apollo missions where the moon came from.

Like I said, if he ever had a good point to make in the past, it is going to be ignored now.
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I know why...because he will be attacked by secularists and pointy-headed intellectuals and leftists. It makes him a). someone persecuted for his religious beliefs (very big in the fundie-christianist movement right now, to be a persecuted christian); and b). it gives him street cred with his Fox-peeps for taking on the know-it-all-been-to-college elitist who he's pretty sure look down on his audienc and hold them in contempt.

He doesn't have to worry about science or logic or even Catholic doctrine...he just has to have someone -- the "pin-heads" -- to blame and for his audience to blame for whatever...
 
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