Continuation Part 2 - Discussion of the Amanda Knox case

[RWVBWL]

Because she made an error, it does happen. But that's boring compared to making up a wild conspiracy theory involving planted evidence, Hitler-like prosecutors, depraved police officers all with a single mission: to keep Saint Amanda, the patron saint of Seattle, in prison forever....
....just cause she's beautiful!

Hi Alt-F4,
Funny that you mention conspiracy...
As I left the beach today, I heard on the radio that former Orange County sherrif Mike Corona,
once dubbed "America's Sheriff", is now off to jail for conspiracy and witness tampering.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/01/25/michael-carona-exorange-c_n_813743.html

Do you think that the murder case we often discuss that happened in Perugia, Italy is immune to any chance of a similiar occurance as had happened in the OC?

 

[Chris C]

Yes, I'm aware how successful American corporations have been at indoctrinating the people into believing that things like State healthcare are a bad thing. Luckily here in Europe we don't share those views.

If you wanted we could discuss this somewhere else, but just so you know. America already had free or affordable healthcare for those that couldn't afford it. however, its not just healthcare.

 

[Chris C]

Because she made an error, it does happen. But that's boring compared to making up a wild conspiracy theory involving planted evidence, Hitler-like prosecutors, depraved police officers all with a single mission: to keep Saint Amanda, the patron saint of Seattle, in prison forever....


....just cause she's beautiful!

Well it can't be too wild of a conspiracy theory, if the prosecutor is being accused of the same things he has done before. When you say conspiracy theory you try and imply that they are being accuse of some secret plot against Knox and Sollecito. Yet in reality, there has been nothing secret about what has been happening. You have witnesses for the prosecution that have been caught in a lie. You have withholding of evidence by the prosecution. You have a lower court that has overruled a higher court. You have a crime scene that was tampered with after it was supposedly sealed. You have a lab that has ignored scientific standards. You have a prosecutor that tried to discredit the coroner to use his wild theory that the court didn't even accept. You have 2 different trials on the same murder, that have a murder happening at 2 different times. So I dont see a secret plot here. Its pretty much out in the open.

 

[Kaosium]

That would make you an extreme right winger in the UK, far outside anything on our political spectrum.

Indeed divorced from it completely. As you noted before, different societies, different paradigms. Despite superficial similarities American politics especially has nothing whatsoever to do with the composition of the French National Assembly during the First Republic which is where those designations come from.

 

[RWVBWL]

I am certain the sneakers Rudy wore were white, because he needed to rinse blood off them in the bathroom in case anyone noticed the stains on his way home. I don't know if there's definite proof online anywhere.

Hi Withnail1969,
I had thought they might be white, but I decided to look anyways found some with color. And as 1 was a limited editon color, well, I was thinkin' that Rudy might have bought that color of sneaker to you know, separate himself from the posers, so to say...

I found this:
It is dated 11/18/2008 4:41pm + is 2/3rd's of the way down the page:
http://www.basketballforum.com/logos-uniforms-collectibles-kicks/412687-what-shoes-do-you-wear.html
+ this:
http://www.foot-wear.gr/product-en.php?product_id=415
+ this:
http://shop.ebay.com/i.html?LH_Avai...com/i.html?_nkw=nike+outbreak+2&_arr=1&_rdc=1

If anyone else knows what color of Nike Outbreak 2 sneakers Rudy Guede owned, will you please add it to our discussion here?
Thanks, RWVBWL

 

[RWVBWL]

The color of the Rudy's shoes were...

Hey Chris C,
You have a good eye too, what do you think is the color of the sneakers that the person walking in the garage is wearing?
Watching that video over and over again, I seem to feel that the person has white sneakers on.
What do you think?

Here is another different to the CCTV video:
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/article1734239.ece

Here is a link to a photograph of Rudy Guede holding his jacket that he had when 1st arrested:
http://tinypic.com/usermedia.php?uo=ru02A/45RKD0S3Yn0dvoNIh4l5k2TGxc

Candace Demsey really, really does her research!
I found all of the above info here, in comment post 367025:
http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...ives/179047.asp+nike+outbreak+2+italy&ct=clnk

 

[Alt+F4]

Well it can't be too wild of a conspiracy theory, if the prosecutor is being accused of the same things he has done before. When you say conspiracy theory you try and imply that they are being accuse of some secret plot against Knox and Sollecito. Yet in reality, there has been nothing secret about what has been happening. You have witnesses for the prosecution that have been caught in a lie. You have withholding of evidence by the prosecution. You have a lower court that has overruled a higher court. You have a crime scene that was tampered with after it was supposedly sealed. You have a lab that has ignored scientific standards. You have a prosecutor that tried to discredit the coroner to use his wild theory that the court didn't even accept. You have 2 different trials on the same murder, that have a murder happening at 2 different times. So I dont see a secret plot here. Its pretty much out in the open.

So with the exception of Amanda and Raffaele everyone else involved in the case either lied, is corrupt, or incompetent. Got it.

 

[Danceme]

________________________
.....akin to Rudy breaking Meredith's bra while he's behind her, has her on her knees---or on all fours---with his knife drawn.

///

Well that says it all IMO! Spot on Fine.

Hi Withnail1969,
I had thought they might be white, but I decided to look anyways found some with color. And as 1 was a limited editon color, well, I was thinkin' that Rudy might have bought that color of sneaker to you know, separate himself from the posers, so to say...

I found this:
It is dated 11/18/2008 4:41pm + is 2/3rd's of the way down the page:
http://www.basketballforum.com/logos-uniforms-collectibles-kicks/412687-what-shoes-do-you-wear.html
+ this:
http://www.foot-wear.gr/product-en.php?product_id=415
+ this:
http://shop.ebay.com/i.html?LH_Avai...com/i.html?_nkw=nike+outbreak+2&_arr=1&_rdc=1

If anyone else knows what color of Nike Outbreak 2 sneakers Rudy Guede owned, will you please add it to our discussion here?
Thanks, RWVBWL

All the Outbreak 2's have stripes in the sole, and a fairly visible Nike swoop. Too bad the video has such poor resolution. I see only dark sneakers with a white sole which doesn't rule them out.

I've always wondered why it is assumed to be Rudy if he's emerging from the car park instead of walking along the road. Does anyone know if cutting through the car park is a short cut from somewhere he might have been just before, the Kebab place for instance, to Via Della Pergola?

 

[Kaosium]

I wonder who it is that is supposed to have a "psychological descent to murder"?

My guess would be Amanda, being as they're promoting Hayden as the star. Perhaps they plan to overdo the bohemian lifestyle overseas to imply she did it, but keep in a mystery and thus everyone happy?

Or everyone will be angry, which is often how it works out. I still think an account of everything in the timeline that can be proven or inferred as correct, absolutely skipping the murder--and by necessity the interrogations--would make for an interesting show. I also think most would come to the conclusion she was probably innocent, especially as every five minutes in the latter half of the program the police would be shown to be either mistaken, lying or acting far more suspiciously than anything Amanda and Raffaele did.

 

[Alt+F4]

You have a good eye too, what do you think is the color of the sneakers that the person walking in the garage is wearing?
Watching that video over and over again, I seem to feel that the person has white sneakers on.
What do you think?

I don't know about the video but blood on that color sneaker wouldn't be noticed much at night. I seriously doubt RG washed off his sneakers in the bathroom when he didn't give a damn that he left bloody shoeprints heading out the front door. The bloody footprint on the bathmat belongs to Raffaele.

 

[Kaosium]

So with the exception of Amanda and Raffaele everyone else involved in the case either lied, is corrupt, or incompetent. Got it.

Which is usually what happens in a cover-up of a blunder.

 

[Chris C]

Hi Withnail1969,
I had thought they might be white, but I decided to look anyways found some with color. And as 1 was a limited editon color, well, I was thinkin' that Rudy might have bought that color of sneaker to you know, separate himself from the posers, so to say...

Thanks, RWVBWL

I used to think those were two different cameras at opposite ends of the garage. However, today I compared similar points on both videos. And they are in fact the same camera. Its just both video's have been cropped. Which begs to wonder, why any of those 3 would be walking from that direction in the garage if they didn't park there.

 

[Alt+F4]

Which is usually what happens in a cover-up of a blunder.

I doubt working for the government there is much different than where I am (U.S.). I work for the municipal government and I would never lie or cover up evidence to cover up someone else's blunder. Not because it's wrong, but because I wouldn't risk my paycheck for anyone. Why do you think the municipal employees of Perugia would do differently?

 

[Katody Matrass]

Skeptical Bystander argues that disbelief in the holocaust should be punished by life imprisonment, being charitable she may have been just being defense and not believe in life for thought crime.

But I would comment that's a perfectly good example of how people during a harsh interrogation say stuff they don't really mean. And one I hope SB takes to heart in her later comments about AK and RS "lying". And mind you she should could have just hung up the phone and it was one on one nor where their any real consequences and inside 30 minutes; she was saying crap.

Spot on! Her blurting about the holocaust was really stunning.
And Dave despite of his attitude totally makes sense, cutting through the crap to the heart of the issue - no motive, no murder weapon, no criminal record, case that makes no sense pushed by a prosecutor who is a convicted criminal.

 

[Chris C]

So with the exception of Amanda and Raffaele everyone else involved in the case either lied, is corrupt, or incompetent. Got it.

Not everyone has lied, is corrupt or incompetent. However, Mignini is in fact corrupt or atleast has been judged that way by his own peers. Mignini is the one that also proposed a double body switch to fit his Conspiracy theory that some Masonic cult was behind the murders in florence.

You can call this list a conspiracy theory, but its fact not theory.
There has been alteast one police officer caught lying.
Stefanoni herself has lied and tampered with the lab instruments.
Prosecution has withheld evidence.
Prosecution witnesses have been caught either lying or telling stories that go against the facts of the case or other prosecution witnesses have entered testimony that goes against other prosecution witnesses.
Prosecution witnesses have testified against defense witnesses without even looking at the evidence.

 

[Katody Matrass]

Well that says it all IMO! Spot on Fine.

Actually not so, because Fine completely misrepresents Hendry's reconstruction.

 

[Chris C]

Spot on! Her blurting about the holocaust was really stunning.
And Dave despite of his attitude totally makes sense, cutting through the crap to the heart of the issue - no motive, no murder weapon, no criminal record, case that makes no sense pushed by a prosecutor who is a convicted criminal.

Well there is someone that has posted here that pretends to be jewish that believes Knox/Sollecito got what they deserve because Knox hates Jews.

*cough*loverofzion*cough*

 

[Kaosium]

I doubt working for the government there is much different than where I am (U.S.). I work for the municipal government and I would never lie or cover up evidence to cover up someone else's blunder. Not because it's wrong, but because I wouldn't risk my paycheck for anyone. Why do you think the municipal employees of Perugia would do differently?

Perhaps they thought their reputations were on the line and there was little chance they would get caught? I'm not sure what you mean by 'municipal' in this case, as the most suspicious conduct was by the Perugian police, which are part of the national ILE to my understanding. I often refer to them as I do above because I don't think it fair to damn all of them for the actions of a few, though 'police in Perugia' is probably more accurate and I use that sometimes too. The court is national too, I believe, though I've suspicions it actually answers to Byzantium ultimately.

 

[Katody Matrass]

Well there is someone that has posted here that pretends to be jewish that believes Knox/Sollecito got what they deserve because Knox hates Jews.

*cough*loverofzion*cough*

I'm from a bit different cultural circle, and Ganongs's declaration looked really extreme to me. Is it an acceptable or by any means common opinion in the western culture that one should get a life in jail for a "thought crime" like this?

 

[Alt+F4]

Not everyone has lied, is corrupt or incompetent. However, Mignini is in fact corrupt or atleast has been judged that way by his own peers. Mignini is the one that also proposed a double body switch to fit his Conspiracy theory that some Masonic cult was behind the murders in florence.

You can call this list a conspiracy theory, but its fact not theory.
There has been alteast one police officer caught lying.
Stefanoni herself has lied and tampered with the lab instruments.
Prosecution has withheld evidence.
Prosecution witnesses have been caught either lying or telling stories that go against the facts of the case or other prosecution witnesses have entered testimony that goes against other prosecution witnesses.
Prosecution witnesses have testified against defense witnesses without even looking at the evidence.

Well then in your opinion Chris, who didn't lie, who isn't corrupt and who isn't incompetent in regard to the prosecution?