9/11-investigator explains the Holocaust

[SanityGap]

You are aware that human bodies, (unlike bread?), consists of 80% water?! These belching flames match the bakery story better than the Krema story.

Whether SanityGap likes it or not, we have proven beyond doubt that the Kremas in Birkenau were seen as bakeries. Even the builder thought it was a bakery. If they were is a different matter altogether.

http://www.nizkor.org/features/dentist/chapter-07.html


Not sure if this is Stammlager or Birkenau.

You have proven nothing other than your ability to quote mine. Having quickly gone through your links it is apparent you have not read them. No surprise there. Most provide damning evidence for genocide.
As for the nizkor link, what is that, the Holocaust according to Mills and Boone?

 

[9/11-investigator]

What was the name of the Soviet plan of attack?

Icebreaker, maybe? That was how Stalin saw Hitler all along. Stalin from the start tried to maneuver Hitler into war with Britain and France, so he could occupy Europe over the dead bodies of both Germany and France and Britain. I have given quotes + links that this was Stalin intention all along. With Europe bolshevized, the rest of the planet would be a snap.

 

[TSR]

We have already seen that the Americans tried to sell the delousing gaschamber in Dachau as a homicidal gaschamber.

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No, it is well known among those who bother to actually educate themselves on the matter that there were *four* delousing chambers in that building at Dachau.

And then there was a fifth, equipped with showerheads that did not actually connect with any plumbing (to fool the clothes, maybe?) and two bins that opened to the outside (because they were concerned the mattresses would run if the cans of Zyklon B were opened in their presence?)

Do tell us why these features were needed in a delousing room, surrounded by other delousing rooms which did *not* have these features?
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They very likely did the same in the other camps.

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Yes, the record shows that the Nazis did construct (or have constructed) other homicidal gas chambers.
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I am puzzled by this testimony from the 'holocaust survivor' Riteman:

http://www.snn-rdr.ca/snn/112001/philipriteman.html

Riteman is saying that when he was constructing these Kremas he thought he was building a bakery.

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Of course, it *also* says that when he was taken from the ghetto, he was told that he was going to be sent to a local farm to work.

AND HE BELIEVED IT.



Seems the Nazis had a habit of lying to those they considered useless eaters.
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This is not hearsay, this is testimony from somebody who actually constructed these Kremas!!

P.S. Looks like Riteman made a career out of his 'survivorship'.

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Might look that way to someone whose only research into the matter consists of what he's been spoon fed by other deniers.

That he had a very successful career as a salesman for 30 some odd years, and only started lecturing about a decade ago doesn't even register on Niney's radar.

This is in contrast to, say, 9/11's favourite source Mark Weber, who has done nothing for the last three decades but spread his neo-Nazi hatred.

But Niney *agrees* with that, so it's okay.
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Next in his speech the bakery-oven-builder-turned-holo-honorary-doctor-of-laws says nothing about what he has seen what nobody should have seen. One big self-serving suggestion show, eagerly swallowed by all these Anglos, patting themselves on the back for succesfully 'combatting evil' (in reality they did nothing more than making the world safe for Bolshevism).

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What happened to Riteman's parents, his 5 brothers and his 3 sisters, and what had each of these personally done to deserve that fate?


Run, little Niney, run.
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[TSR]

TSR, we all are extremely interested in sources/link that 'show that van Roden was talking BS'.

Why should van Roden do such a thing?

To refresh memory, van Roden headed a commission of 3 that should investigate the treatment of German prisoners during the Nuremberg show trials. He concluded that 'nearly all German defendants had been tortured and their testicles kicked beyond repair' (wording by van Roden).

TSR understands very well that all credibility of the Nuremberg show trials vanishes with this kind of statements, so he attempts a vague discrediting of van Roden. We, who are interested in finding out the historic truth, will not let get TSR away so easy with this, so we are going to insist on him backing up his wild statements.

We have learned from credible Anglo sources that 70% of the Nuremberg personel was jewish.

Edited by Tricky: 

Edited for quote of modded post.

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So glad you asked, so I can once again demonstrate the abysmal state of knowledge you have of the history you are so rabid to deny.

Research the Committee on Armed Services over the Judiciary Committee and the Committee on Expenditures in the Executive Departments investigations headed up by Sen. Ray Baldwin and get back to us.

And remind me again -- did van Roden even talk to anyone who had talked to anyone who had talked to anyone involved in the IMT?





No?





So this is "just the sort of thing" the Allies did. Just like Van Anraat shows all Dutch to be money grubbing arms dealers, willing to help out vicious dictators. Which means *you* should be thrown in the slammer for life.



Right?

Edited by Tricky: 

Edited for response to modded post.

 

[TSR]

Interesting testimony by Jews... they were evacuated as far as Kirgyzistan.

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Leaving aside the fact that your (well, not *yours*) excerpt, nor the unreferenced (by you) original source of the article even mentions Kyrgyzstan (note the spelling,) which is by the way is to the *west* of the USSR, which the article mentions *some* of the Jews came from (wasn't your plan deportation to the *East*?), which part of "they were part of the *local* population" is unclear to you? Emphasis mine.

Do tell us: how does one get evacuated to their own place of residence?
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[Wroclaw]

Icebreaker, maybe? That was how Stalin saw Hitler all along. Stalin from the start tried to maneuver Hitler into war with Britain and France, so he could occupy Europe over the dead bodies of both Germany and France and Britain. I have given quotes + links that this was Stalin intention all along. With Europe bolshevized, the rest of the planet would be a snap.

There are a bunch of problems with this theory. Just a few:

(1) If Stalin was preparing an attack on Germany, then why was Germany able to make such enormous gains in the USSR in the first four months? Why were all of the European republics of the USSR and over half of European Russia under occupation by early the following year?

(2) In order to launch a successful military attack, Stalin would have had to have developed an almost entirely new military elite, since the previous military elite had been wiped out in the purges. But there is no indication that this had been done, which is one of the reasons Stalin had to rely so heavily on the weather and on partisans for victory — at least until production of tanks got under way.

(3) Stalin had declared his policy in 1924 as "Socialism in one country." Most of his moves between 1924 and 1941 seemed to indicate that he took the idea seriously. While he did muck around a few places, notably Spain, the communists in Spain had taken a real beating in Spain, and it's not likely that he would have tried his hand in that manner, particularly so soon after defeat in Spain.

(4) It's a hell of a lot more likely that the idea of forming a non-aggression pact with the Nazis allowed Stalin to re-establish Soviet rule in the formerly Russian sphere of influence, rather than to expand it beyond its historical reach. Further, what Hitler gained was the ability to prevent England and France from undertaking an actual war effort against Germany, since the fear of retaliation from the USSR as a possible ally of Germany was too great a risk for either country to take. So they declared war but did nothing other than mine the harbors in Norway — and half-heartedly at that.

I think the evidence for the traditional historical narrative, i.e., that Hitler hit the USSR in a surprise attack that Stalin did not expect, is borne out by all the evidence.

 

[TSR]

Not sure if this is Stammlager or Birkenau.

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Of *course* you're not, because you haven't actually read the d*mned thing, relying instead on another failed attempt at quote mining.

Jacobs is, in this chapter, talking about his time in the Steineck labour camp, well before he was sent to Auschwitz.


Is it a pathological condition that makes you unable to learn from your mistakes and check sources, or is it just politically motivated stupidity combined with laziness?
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[9/11-investigator]

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So glad you asked, so I can once again demonstrate the abysmal state of knowledge you have of the history you are so rabid to deny.

Research the Committee on Armed Services over the Judiciary Committee and the Committee on Expenditures in the Executive Departments investigations headed up by Sen. Ray Baldwin and get back to us.

And remind me again -- did van Roden even talk to anyone who had talked to anyone who had talked to anyone involved in the IMT?

No?

Why should I put a jota of effort in defending your case? You seem to ackowledge that van Roden did indeed report as I have described and I am happy with that testimony as it suits my genda. It is up to you to defend your case and it looks that you cannot defend it. As long as you choose not to seriously attack van Roden we are entitled to throw the entire Nuremberg trial on the scrap heap of history.

Good luck!

 

[dafydd]

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Of *course* you're not, because you haven't actually read the d*mned thing, relying instead on another failed attempt at quote mining.

Jacobs is, in this chapter, talking about his time in the Steineck labour camp, well before he was sent to Auschwitz.


Is it a pathological condition that makes you unable to learn from your mistakes and check sources, or is it just politically motivated stupidity combined with laziness?
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A combination of those plus anti-semitism and being from the lower orders of Dutch trailer trash. I live on the Dutch/Belgian border.I know the type.

 

[Wowbagger]

Keep this in mind, folks: "9/11-investigator" basically already admits that a horrible, holocaust-like event took place at the hands of Nazis, way back around post #4818 of this thread. He simply chooses not to see it called a "holocaust", for some reason.
( http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=6717120#post6717120 )

I think he knows the score, to a certain degree. He just doesn't like playing with a very good rulebook. He seems to be confident that others will see his game is superior in the future, so that keeps him going.

 

[dafydd]

Keep this in mind, folks: "9/11-investigator" basically already admits that a horrible, holocaust-like event took place at the hands of Nazis, way back around post #4818 of this thread. He simply chooses not to see it called a "holocaust", for some reason.
( http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=6717120#post6717120 )

I think he knows the score, to a certain degree. He just doesn't like playing with a very good rulebook. He seems to be confident that others will see his game is superior in the future, so that keeps him going.

His denier and anti-Semitic beliefs prevent him from writing or saying that word. There is only one rule in his rulebook,and all his threads can be summed up by it. Hate all Jews.

 

[TSR]

Why should I put a jota of effort in defending your case? You seem to ackowledge that van Roden did indeed report as I have described and I am happy with that testimony as it suits my genda. It is up to you to defend your case and it looks that you cannot defend it. As long as you choose not to seriously attack van Roden we are entitled to throw the entire Nuremberg trial on the scrap heap of history.

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Okay, the Congressional investigation I cited completely refuted van Roden on the question of "kicking testicles" and indeed, most of what would be considered torture. Enough of an "attack" for you?


And even supposing it had not, van Roden did not speak with anyone who had spoken with anyone who had spoken with anyone who had anything to do with Nuremberg, so, no, you are not entitled to do any such thing.





There's a reason you keep running from my invitation to cite a *single* defendant at the IMT who was improperly convicted, and everyone knows why that is, including yourself. That's why you refuse to do so.
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[Tricky]

Please stop personalizing the discussions.

Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: Tricky

 

[dafydd]

Ok.

 

[tsig]

The video was made by the newspaper, I doubt they followed up on their little project of 'exposing neo-nazi lunacy' by writing about it in their newspaper since it turned into a PR-meltdown for the poor lefty Danes. But TSR is trying to obfuscate because you see, this newspaper angle is completely irrelevant. Do you deny that mr. Gross was once interned in Birkenau? Of course not, he said so himself! Does not make that an anti-semite of you? Oh, wait, you have not yet revealed your own identity to us (TSR: 'not relevant'). And if you refrain from attempts to deny that he was in Birkenau, would you not agree that he is making a fool of himself with his incoherent statements?

No?



Define 'primary source'. There is nothing more 'primary' than the video. That is all there is and need to see through the entire scam. By pressing with his questions the Danish youngster makes mr Gross admit that he has everything out of third hand. He saw nothing himself. Well, he was in a gaschamber, but he... 'delayed'. Priceless. What really happened is that mr Gross got his 'extermination wisdom' from Nuremberg and subsequent media and movie exposure. And mr Gross thought, 'my God, poor little me was their as well... I am an heroic survivor!'. Mr Gross has no incentive of doubting the story and he interprets his personal experiences into the big story as handed over to him by the outside world.



Not at all. My goals make me feel a little bit like a grey-haired male version of Jeanne d'Arc defending Europe against oversees predators. And what a story it is! The roles are now entirely reversed. Evil USSR and USA, both tools of Jewish globalist policies, conspiring to destroy mother Europe. USSR dead, only the US remains with a rule morally based on a completely flawed interpretation of history. Fortunately we have nein-11 on his white horse rescuing Europe in the last moment. You really think I am getting tired of that role?



In Auschwitz there were between 30-46 ovens. How on earth can you 'process' 397,000 people in merely 6 weeks with that sort of capacity. Please give us a calculation showing us that it is possible in the first place.

More on the Hungarian Jews from page 185 onwards.

Just like your hero. Oh wait...Hitler failed, the Jews were too smart for him and he became their puppet.

 

[tsig]

Can somebody help me identify the source of this drawing?

If that from Olere's collection?

The caption of the first picture says:




http://www.amazon.co.uk/Chasing-Shadows-Naomi-Gryn/dp/0140286616



http://www3.sympatico.ca/mighty1/essays/canada2.htm



http://isurvived.org/Survivors_Folder/Weissova_Helga-artworkExp.html



http://faculty.virginia.edu/wwii/hilberg.pp618-629.destruction-of-the-european-jews.pdf



http://www.theverylongview.com/WATH/testimonies/sidonia.htm



http://www.theboot.it/sedici_ottobre.html



http://www.fpp.co.uk/Auschwitz/docs/PWEDoc180545.html
This is from a 'A May 1945 Report by U.S. Psychological Warfare on the Auschwitz Camp, on the basis of prisoners and other Intelligence'



http://www.snn-rdr.ca/snn/112001/philipriteman.html



http://romove.radio.cz/en/article/20088

They baked Jews.

 

[tsig]

Bakeries? Really?
I look forward to seeing the pictures of freshly baked bread and muffins at Auschwitz, fresh from the ovens.
Photoshopping the bodies out of it may be a problem though...
And this-
"great flames belching from the chimneys and smelt the strange sickening odour of the bakery (crematoriums) "
I've worked near to a bakery, the smell is delightfully enticing, not sickening. As for the flames belching forth

Must have been baking matza balls.

 

[tsig]

Icebreaker, maybe? That was how Stalin saw Hitler all along. Stalin from the start tried to maneuver Hitler into war with Britain and France, so he could occupy Europe over the dead bodies of both Germany and France and Britain. I have given quotes + links that this was Stalin intention all along. With Europe bolshevized, the rest of the planet would be a snap.

It's a shame Hitler was too stupid to see it isn't it? Maybe he had a more sinister motive?

 

[Wroclaw]

I'm sorry but in what universe is it a logically sound form of argumentation to extrapolate from the fact that one judge reported that some defendants had been tortured — even if they had been tortured — that therefore no testimony was reliable?

It's important to bear in mind that if the Malmedy defendants were tortured, it was by Americans because they had killed Americans. This was decidedly not the case with most Nuremberg defendants regarding crimes against humanity.

Even if it were, however, it would not be sufficient case to discard the whole trial as worthless.

Which reminds me that niner has already admitted the Einsatzgruppen proceedings at Nuremberg were judicially valid.

 

[9/11-investigator]

I'm sorry but in what universe is it a logically sound form of argumentation to extrapolate from the fact that one judge reported that some defendants had been tortured — even if they had been tortured — that therefore no testimony was reliable?

It's important to bear in mind that if the Malmedy defendants were tortured, it was by Americans because they had killed Americans. This was decidedly not the case with most Nuremberg defendants regarding crimes against humanity.

Even if it were, however, it would not be sufficient case to discard the whole trial as worthless.

To be fair, the van Roden statements referred to the Dachau trial, not Nuremberg:

The American Judge Edward L. van Roden, one of the three members of the Simpson Army Commission which was subsequently appointed to investigate the methods of justice at the Dachau trials, revealed the methods by which these admissions were secured in the Washington Daily News, January 9th, 1949. His account also appeared in the British newspaper, the Sunday Pictorial, January 23rd, 1949. The methods he described were: "Posturing as priests to hear confessions and give absolution; torture with burning matches driven under the prisoners finger-nails; knocking out of teeth and breaking jaws; solitary confinement and near starvation rations." Van Roden explained: "The statements which were admitted as evidence were obtained from men who had first been kept in solitary confinement for three, four and five months ... The investigators would put a black hood over the accused's head and then punch him in the face with brass knuckles, kick him and beat him with rubber hoses ... All but two of the Germans, in the 139 cases we investigated, had been kicked in the testicles beyond repair. This was standard operating procedure with our American investigators." The "American" investigators responsible (and who later functioned as the prosecution in the trials) were: Lt.-Col. Burton F. Ellis (chief of the War Crimes Committee) and his assistants, Capt. Raphael Shumacker, Lt. Robert E. Byrne, Lt. William R. Perl, Mr. Morris Ellowitz, Mr. Harry Thon, and Mr. Kirschbaum. The legal adviser of the court was Col. A. H. Rosenfeld. The reader will immediately appreciate from their names that the majority of these people were "biased on racial grounds" in the words of Justice Wenersturm -- that is, were Jewish, and therefore should never have been involved in any such investigation. Despite the fact that "confessions" pertaining to the extemination of the Jews were extracted under these conditions, Nuremberg statements are still regarded as conclusive evidence for the Six Million by writers like Reitlinger and others, and the illusion is maintained that the Trials were both impartial and impeccably fair. When General Taylor, the Chief Public Prosecutor, was asked where he had obtained the figure of the Six Million, he replied that it was based on the confession of S.S. General Otto Ohlendorf. He, too, was tortured and his case is examined below. But as far as such "confessions" in general are concerned, we can do no better than quote the British Sunday Pictorial when reviewing the report of Judge van Roden: "Strong men were reduced to broken wrecks ready to mumble any admission demanded by their prosecutors."

We should abandon the idea that the alllies were carrying out justice. They organized a show trial, tortured the Germans into confessions in order to give the alllied victory a patina of moral justification. In reality it was a scam.