Continuation Part 2 - Discussion of the Amanda Knox case

[The Third Man]

I believe in the Death Penalty, I just think there should be a higher standard when applying it. The Willingham case would obviously fall short of that standard.

Raindrops on roses and whiskers on kittens
Bright copper kettles and warm woolen mittens
Brown paper packages tied up with strings
These are a few of my favorite things

 

[Justinian2]

A Capitol Hill park that was to be named after Seattle's sister city Perugia, Italy — a name that was quickly withdrawn — now has a new name: Summit Slope Park.

In 2009, the Seattle Parks Department announced that the park at the northeast corner of East John Street and Summit Avenue East would be named Perugia Park, but just a day later, the city backpedaled because of the Amanda Knox murder case in Perugia, Italy.

Next thing you know Rocky will be renamed "The Greek Stallion"

 

[Mary_H]

Next thing you know Rocky will be renamed "The Greek Stallion"

One of our local columnists made this remark:

"Another International Outrage: A Capitol Hill park that was to be named after Seattle's sister city of Perugia, Italy, before the Amanda Knox case has been renamed Summit Slope Park. We're pretty bummed that the alternate name we submitted was rejected out of hand. "Twisted Medieval Jurisprudence System Park" sort of had a nice ring to it."

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/ronjudd/2013940696_judd16.html

 

[Dan O.]

PS: The cord isn't long enough to have been plugged in to any outlet outside the room.

I take that back. There is an outlet right around the corner in the small bath.

But there are traces of blood on the switches there that they might not want to disturb either. The next closest outlet is either the one in Amanda's room just past the door or in the hall also just past Amanda's door.

 

[Katody Matrass]

I take that back. There is an outlet right around the corner in the small bath.

[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=597&pictureid=4223[/qimg]

But there are traces of blood on the switches there that they might not want to disturb either. The next closest outlet is either the one in Amanda's room just past the door or in the hall also just past Amanda's door.

I think that outlet is too high off the ground to be of any use. If you placed the lamp in the room on the floor I doubt the cord would reach it.

I too think the most plausible explanation for the lamp is that ILE brought it into the room at some moment early after the discovery of the murder.

 

[Draca]

I think that outlet is too high off the ground to be of any use. If you placed the lamp in the room on the floor I doubt the cord would reach it.

I too think the most plausible explanation for the lamp is that ILE brought it into the room at some moment early after the discovery of the murder.

I'm not tied to any lamp theory. Why would the ILE need the lamp though? It was daylight when the body was discovered.

 

[CDHost]

windowserver.log

Well if no one minds me going back to Friday's topic.

I've been thinking about trying to put a consolidated post together on the computer forensics.

1. Has anyone else already done this?
2. Is anyone who is a regular FOA a former NeXTStep or OpenStep progammer (windowserver is part of the 4.xx legacy kernel brought over from Rapsidy and I would love to defer to someone more experienced)
3. Does anyone have the text of Raffaele's appeal. In particular what log files he used and what activity they found?
4. Any advice, comments, suggestions, criticisms, ....?

 

[Katody Matrass]

I'm not tied to any lamp theory. Why would the ILE need the lamp though? It was daylight when the body was discovered.

I guess at some point more light was needed. Using the light from Amanda's room is the same logic as using gift wrapping paper found at the scene to "secure" a piece of evidence - Stafanoni did it without restraints, I see no reason they wouldn't use Amanda's lamp if it was at hand.

 

[Kestrel]

I'm not tied to any lamp theory. Why would the ILE need the lamp though? It was daylight when the body was discovered.

Meredith's body wasn't found outside in the sunshine. Her room had plenty of dark spaces (i.e. under the bed) where more light was needed for a close examination.

 

[Chris C]

I'm not tied to any lamp theory. Why would the ILE need the lamp though? It was daylight when the body was discovered.

I believe Meredith's shutters were closed.

 

[RoseMontague]

Well if no one minds me going back to Friday's topic.

I've been thinking about trying to put a consolidated post together on the computer forensics.

1. Has anyone else already done this?
2. Is anyone who is a regular FOA a former NeXTStep or OpenStep progammer (windowserver is part of the 4.xx legacy kernel brought over from Rapsidy and I would love to defer to someone more experienced)
3. Does anyone have the text of Raffaele's appeal. In particular what log files he used and what activity they found?
4. Any advice, comments, suggestions, criticisms, ....?

I have both the Italian and Google translated test of Raffaele's appeal listed on my docstoc page:

http://www.docstoc.com/profile/rosemontague

The additional appeal filing regarding the computers in Italian are here:

http://translate.google.com/transla...diaset.it/fotogallery/fotogallery8914.shtml?1

The English summary of these pages is located here:

http://www.internationalskeptics.co...light=additional+appeal+documents#post6545612

 

[el buscador]

From Franks most recent post:

"What is this new report? Just like the fax that arrived on November 6, that assured that Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito called the police after the postal police arrived? (Which was revealed a lie. We pay them to lie against us).
This lie was at the base of the whole case against Amanda and Raffaele. Because if the lovebirds had called the police before the postal police arrived, which in fact they did, they couldn’t, as we shall see in details, be responsible for the murder, and the case against them couldn’t have even started. And, as we shall see, when this lie is discovered the whole case against Amanda and Raffaele, in fact, collapses.
That lie, which was initiated, coincidentally, just after the arrests -- and was believed by Mignini, Matteini, Micheli, Court of Freedom, even the Supreme Court-- was defended by them at the trial, using other lies, until the last day. That lie caused a little disaster it seems, don’t you think?"

Fax? From who? November 6th? Assuring that the two had called the police after the postals had arrived?

 

[billyryan]

I just read Frank Sfarzo post on the Sabrina Misseri case ,she was/is been railroaded by the police and prosecutors and judges just like Amanda and Raffaele,according to Frank Italy's best lawyer is now defending her and he has just won a tactical battle by getting the real killer Sabrina father Michele Misseri to verify the authenticity of a letter he sent to his daughter of how the police forced him to implicate her

The important point here as far as Amanda and Raffaele are concerned is that one of the DNA experts appointed by the court to independently review the DNA evidence,is a consultant for Sabrina,with her experiences of this case fresh in her mind there has to be a good chance she will not be fooled by the crude attempt of the peruvian police to plant Meredith's DNA on the knife blade and Raffaele's DNA on the bra clip

 

[Dan O.]

Well if no one minds me going back to Friday's topic.

I've been thinking about trying to put a consolidated post together on the computer forensics.

1. Has anyone else already done this?
2. Is anyone who is a regular FOA a former NeXTStep or OpenStep progammer (windowserver is part of the 4.xx legacy kernel brought over from Rapsidy and I would love to defer to someone more experienced)
3. Does anyone have the text of Raffaele's appeal. In particular what log files he used and what activity they found?
4. Any advice, comments, suggestions, criticisms, ....?

1. There have been discussions in the previous thread. Try searching for "screen saver".

2. I can't think of anything that would be gained by going back to the history of windowserver. The log file is a report of specific events that came from specific pieces of code at specific times. You need to analyze this with regard to the same OS version that Raffaele was running. I'm pretty sure we have that piece of information. The part we don't have is which screensaver he was running. I tried the current set under 10.5 and couldn't find one that created a log entry. It's also quite likely that he could have been running a third party screen saver module.

3. The appeals can be found at http://www.injusticeinperugia.org/Appeal.html

4. Good luck.

 

[RoseMontague]

I just read Frank Sfarzo post on the Sabrina Misseri case ,she was/is been railroaded by the police and prosecutors and judges just like Amanda and Raffaele,according to Frank Italy's best lawyer is now defending her and he has just won a tactical battle by getting the real killer Sabrina father Michele Misseri to verify the authenticity of a letter he sent to his daughter of how the police forced him to implicate her

The important point here as far as Amanda and Raffaele are concerned is that one of the DNA experts appointed by the court to independently review the DNA evidence,is a consultant for Sabrina,with her experiences of this case fresh in her mind there has to be a good chance she will not be fooled by the crude attempt of the peruvian police to plant Meredith's DNA on the knife blade and Raffaele's DNA on the bra clip

There are many similarities in these 2 cases. The biggest difference is the recording of the interrogation. Questions about the interrogation came up almost immediately and both Frank and katy_did pointed out how the transcripts showed how the police were leading him to accuse his daughter of murder. The reason Sabrina Misseri will go free comes back to this. Unfortunately for Amanda, no such record exists of her interrogation.

 

[katy_did]

2. I can't think of anything that would be gained by going back to the history of windowserver. The log file is a report of specific events that came from specific pieces of code at specific times. You need to analyze this with regard to the same OS version that Raffaele was running. I'm pretty sure we have that piece of information. The part we don't have is which screensaver he was running. I tried the current set under 10.5 and couldn't find one that created a log entry. It's also quite likely that he could have been running a third party screen saver module.

In the pages from the defence document on this it says: "both the file “windowserver.log” and the log file of the screensaver “com.apple.screensaver.0016cba0b7.plist” were completely ignored in the Postal Police's analysis". So I guess the latter is the screensaver he was running? The defence claim that the windowserver file recorded the times when the screensaver activated and deactivated.

 

[katy_did]

There are many similarities in these 2 cases. The biggest difference is the recording of the interrogation. Questions about the interrogation came up almost immediately and both Frank and katy_did pointed out how the transcripts showed how the police were leading him to accuse his daughter of murder. The reason Sabrina Misseri will go free comes back to this. Unfortunately for Amanda, no such record exists of her interrogation.

Very interesting development, isn't it? Frank must be quietly pleased, having been one of the few to say from the start that Sabrina was innocent. Part of the text of Michele's letter to Sabrina is here; he says that he was forced to accuse Sabrina because the police said they would arrest his wife and brother otherwise.

Can't be a bad thing for the defence in this case: the girl who was likened everywhere to Amanda Knox shown to be innocent, while her father states the police pressured him into making false accusations... I'm amazed the letter ever made it to Sabrina's lawyer.

 

[Malkmus]

Meredith's body wasn't found outside in the sunshine. Her room had plenty of dark spaces (i.e. under the bed) where more light was needed for a close examination.

Doesn't Amanda's lamp in ILE photos have a big #4 marker in front of it in photos? Or is that marker for something else nearby? If it's for the lamp then I can't see how they would be the ones to bring it in there, then put an evidence marker in front of it as if it were part of the crime. Please, correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[RoseMontague]

Very interesting development, isn't it? Frank must be quietly pleased, having been one of the few to say from the start that Sabrina was innocent. Part of the text of Michele's letter to Sabrina is here; he says that he was forced to accuse Sabrina because the police said they would arrest his wife and brother otherwise.

Can't be a bad thing for the defence in this case: the girl who was likened everywhere to Amanda Knox shown to be innocent, while her father states the police pressured him into making false accusations... I'm amazed the letter ever made it to Sabrina's lawyer.

Wow. The lengths they go to to get an innocent person accused of murder. They already have the guilty party and they know it. Why go after an innocent girl, the cousin and friend of the victim. I do not understand this.

 

[Kaosium]

Hi Mary H, Chris C, and others,
I was just watching 'High Noon' again, an old black+white cowboy movie from back in 1952 wherein the clock winds down to noon, the train comes in and Will Kane must head out to battle Frank Miller and his gang. And a whole lot goes down in the 1+1/2 hour timeframe from when Kane 1st hears that Miller is coming at High Noon...

That's one of those movies I've never seen, though I've heard it was a great movie. I'm not generally much of a fan of westerns, thought I count "The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance" and "Unforgiven" amongst my favorite movies. It is one of those movies that I've always intended to see some day because of the notoriety, much like "Twelve Angry Men" which is another that's supposed to be a classic, but has thus far escaped my intentions.

In a similiar time frame as the movie, Rudy Guede says he was at Meredith Kercher's apartment about 8:30 or so, and then left her place after 10:00pm

What was he doing in her apartment for so long?
It does appear that Meredith was attacked right after arriving home. If the attack escalated quickly, it was finshed just as fast, I would imagine. And in my humble opinion, afterwards Rudy should have left the scene and walked or ran away, fast.

Besides drinking orange juice, cleaning himself up and dropping the kids off at the pool,
what was Rudy Guede doing in Meredith Kercher's apartment for so long?
Raping Meredith?

This is an interesting question, and being as I've not spent much time at all reviewing the Guede trials I was kind of hoping someone who has might chime in, as there's elements of Rudy's time at the cottage that puzzle me as well. One is this very question you ask, what in the hell was he doing there for so long? It suggests that perhaps he 'knew' that no one was going to be at the cottage that night, as what kind of burglar heads for the fridge for refreshment and takes a dump on the 'clock' so to speak?

I don't think I've ever seen anything about this brought up, but is it possible that due to his connections with the boys downstairs that somehow Rudy was aware that it was highly likely both their apartment and the girls' was going to be empty that night? I recall reading that Meredith went home unexpectedly early the night of November first, thus perhaps the reason Rudy apparently was so nonchalant about his burglary efforts is he thought he had plenty of time?

Being an innocentisti, well I would luv to see another pro-innocence believer post a speculative timeline laying out what what they believe to be the exact times that Rudy Guede did anything and everything in the 1 to 1+1/2 hours he was in Meredith Kercher's apartment that night she had her life brutally ended...

I wonder if perhaps the answer here is they just moved the time of death back in his trial too, thus Rudy wasn't really there for ninety minutes or so, they just didn't want to contradict the time given in the other trial by too much...

PS-Thanks for the laugh, guys+gals, your earlier exchange today was too funny...
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=197280
Too bad we all can't get together in person to eat, drink and shoot the feces about this horrible, bloody murder case we are interested in. If I sometimes come off the wrong way, well I do better in person.
Some of you guys might find me a bit off the wall, so to say.
BUT I gotta tell ya, after being diagnosed with a rare tumor called Recurrent Respiratory Papallomatosis back in 2003, and dealing for a short time* with doctors that were speaking to me about Chemo, Radiation and a Hole in my Throat, I'm happy to be still be alive, and, as many of my friends know, speaking!
Peace, RW

*No health insurance + I have a rare desease...
Hmmm...

Thank you for all the laughs you've given me reading this thread initially and since I've started posting. You offer a unique perspective, and it just so happens your tales bring back fond memories being as I once spent a fair amount of time in your general area, both north and south of where you reside. If you take the El Camino Real north about an hour from the LAX region you pass a (big!) rock where that "dark desert highway" now goes inside rather than outside, which supposedly was because before it was re-routed that stretch had gained a reputation. If you know the name of that rock, and oddly enough if you follow that link about a minute in you see something in Italy that looks very much like it, you know where I resided. We were told that the surfer dudes all hated us because we had access to a beach restricted to everyone else that we seldom used that just happened to be right up the coast from some of the most expensive beachfront property in the world.

When I was south of where you are now, a few hours or so, if I got onto a different highway I could go to a place named after Jack Murphy (at least then) a few minutes farther south and find wholesome, good old American fun with hot dogs and Cracker Jacks. However if one continued in that direction a while longer there was 'entertainment' available that wasn't nearly as innocent and which I'm pretty damn sure would outrage some, but going from what I saw fairly recently in this thread, and elsewhere in venues interested in this case, I couldn't help but snicker as I'm virtually certain they were worried about the fate of the wrong party involved.

Which just made me laugh like hell, as some obviously had no clue what they should have been getting their knickers in a twist about...