Health care - administrative incompetence

TFian said:
Until they cut funding for it.
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Evidence that this has happened or acknowledgment that it's pure conjecture. Which is it, sir?

In the meantime, and just to ensure you don't miss it:

1. Evidence of your claim regarding 1970s standards of clinical treatment in the UK?

2. Evidence of your claim that clinical outcomes in the UK are below US standards, including alternative measures to admittedly rough and ready IM and LE as suggested elsewhere?

Come on, should be a dawdle given your confident views.
 
Architect said:
I see. And did you just think of it all by yourself? Not considered what other countries might be doing, eh?
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Nope. It's a well known fact here illegals are eligible for all sorts of social benefits. Welfare, food stamps, and Medicaid. Our immigration policy "Hop over the border, get a free check".
 
TFian said:
Nope. It's a well known fact here illegals are eligible for all sorts of social benefits. Welfare, food stamps, and Medicaid. Our immigration policy "Hop over the border, get a free check".
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1. Evidence of healthcare costs so arising, including sources?

2. Evidence that this represents a substantive proprotion of US healthcare spending, including sources?

Come on, man, are you just making this stuff up or do you have something besides empty rhetoric?
 
One thing that everyone agrees on is that an aging population, advancements in technology and other factors will make health care costs continue to rise. In Single-Payer systems like the NHS, how will these costs be contained? It seems to me the only choices are increased rationing of care, raising taxes or privatization. Indeed, most countries with UHC use some mix of private/public funding. Even in the UK, the current thinking is that privatization will have to increase. So maybe, just maybe, America has more right with the healthcare system than it does wrong. The key is going to be to figure out how to make HC more U, without overburdening the already busted federal budget. I don't see how we can do this without making people more responsible for their own healthcare costs.
 
Architect said:
1. Evidence of healthcare costs so arising, including sources?

2. Evidence that this represents a substantive proprotion of US healthcare spending, including sources?

Come on, man, are you just making this stuff up or do you have something besides empty rhetoric?
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Wait, what? Are you now disputing that US healthcare costs are rising?
 
XJX, there is nothing to suggest that the proprotional increase in costs so arising will be any greater the UHC and the US systems. We have the advantage that our costs start from a much lower baseline. No-one is seriously talking of rationing.

Likewise we have no evidence that privatisation does, in fact, reduce costs. Going by the US example, it seems to be a blank cheque for fat cats.

Back to the matter in hand. Does TF intend to actually produce any evidence to back up his wild claims? Or is it just more hot air?
 
TFian said:
Wait, what? Are you now disputing that US healthcare costs are rising?
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I'm sorry, but you seem to confuse the words "arising" and "rising". I had assumed English was your first language, apologies if I misunderstood. Let me rephrase the response.

You seek to claim, if I understand your rambling assertions correctly, that illegal immigrants are pushing up US health costs and this provides an avenue for easy savings.

In that case provide evidence that this is a significant proportion of US healthcare costs. You may also wish to look at other nations with illegal immigration issues, such as France, and draw conclusions as to the proprotion of costs they expend on said persons.
 
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I see. That's your one source? No facts, no figures? Don't you want to look at that Texan cost of $1.6b in 2006, find out a bit more? It might support your argument.

In the meantime, you might want to note this quote from the article inasmuch as it contradicts your earlier claim regarding welfare:
Illegal immigrants can get emergency care through Medicaid, the federal-state program for the poor and people with disabilities. But they can't get non-emergency care unless they pay. They are ineligible for most other public benefits.
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Back to the previous questions put to you:

1. Evidence of your claim regarding 1970s standards of clinical treatment in the UK?

2. Evidence of your claim that clinical outcomes in the UK are below US standards, including alternative measures to admittedly rough and ready IM and LE as suggested elsewhere?
 
TFian said:
Sure.

Can you tell me how the UK will deal with the increasing pressure of an aging population?
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This is an issue that is facing nearly every single developed country in the world.

Why are you focusing on the UK?

Is there some special sort of situation that only exists in these countries?
 
Tatyana said:
This is an issue that is facing nearly every single developed country in the world.

Why are you focusing on the UK?

Is there some special sort of situation that only exists in these countries?
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Architect is from the UK, so I focused there.
 
Architect said:
In the meantime, you might want to note this quote from the article inasmuch as it contradicts your earlier claim regarding welfare:
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States spend around 22 billion on welfare for immigrants, so I find that hard to believe.
 
TFian said:
States spend around 22 billion on welfare for immigrants, so I find that hard to believe.
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Illegal immigrants can get emergency care through Medicaid, the federal-state program for the poor and people with disabilities. But they can't get non-emergency care unless they pay. They are ineligible for most other public benefits.
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Seriously, are you reading the material you're citing here?

TFian said:
The French immigration system doesn't particularly interest me no.
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Hint: We're discussing healthcare and you claim that illegal immigrant costs are skewing US costs, although you now think it's not by very much. And the French have already started looking at this issue. You really should look into it.
 
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You're still carefully avoiding the previous questions put to you:

1. Evidence of your claim regarding 1970s standards of clinical treatment in the UK?

2. Evidence of your claim that clinical outcomes in the UK are below US standards, including alternative measures to admittedly rough and ready IM and LE as suggested elsewhere?

Come on, put up or shut up (as they say)!
 
Architect said:
You're still carefully avoiding the previous questions put to you:

1. Evidence of your claim regarding 1970s standards of clinical treatment in the UK?
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I never claimed that. Standards and technology available are two different things.
 
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