John Edward - psychic or what?
- Thread starter RemieV
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The seats were preassigned in the sense that all Vegas show seats are preassigned. If someone at the Rio decided you were a terrorist and must be stopped while you were in the middle of watching Penn & Teller, the casino staff would be able to determine what seat you were sitting in. Penn and Teller, on the other hand, wouldn't have the foggiest.
I almost hate to suggest it, RemieV, but who else knew you were going? Is it possible that someone leaked your plans to go to the show to Edwards?
I really, really hope not
And, hah, you know, I'd never considered that of all the people there the person he might've been trying to impress was ME.
welshdean
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I said 'checking in' as in checking in at the hotel, not buying a ticket. When the minion saw him in line for the show, bingo! A simple stroke of luck, that's why the 'feat' wasn't repeated.
Choices . . .
(1) John Edward is a genuine psychic that can talk to the dead.
(2) John Edward is a liar and cheat with no genuine psychic abilities.
Points to consider . . .
(1) Edward can only provide people with information they already know like their name etc.
(2) Edward chooses to use this amazing ability to make money from entertainment shows but he never uses it for any worthwhile purpose like finding lost bodies, solving crimes, etc.
(3) There are many known and demonstrated ways known information can be gained by non-psychic means.
(4) There are no known or demonstrated ways known or unknown information can be gain by psychic means or that such means even exist.
(5) Strange that only Liam’s “reading” was unbelievable accurate.
Either Liam was a plant or Edward got his information from some source like - Accommodation check-in, rental car hire, relative or friend travelling with Liam, Any other source that contained information about Liam. Perhaps someone picked Liam’s pocket, got information from wallet then replaced it. However unlikely any non-psychic means is it’s infinitely more likely than psychic ability (but you already know that).
Edward is a "What".
(1) John Edward is a genuine psychic that can talk to the dead.
(2) John Edward is a liar and cheat with no genuine psychic abilities.
Points to consider . . .
(1) Edward can only provide people with information they already know like their name etc.
(2) Edward chooses to use this amazing ability to make money from entertainment shows but he never uses it for any worthwhile purpose like finding lost bodies, solving crimes, etc.
(3) There are many known and demonstrated ways known information can be gained by non-psychic means.
(4) There are no known or demonstrated ways known or unknown information can be gain by psychic means or that such means even exist.
(5) Strange that only Liam’s “reading” was unbelievable accurate.
Either Liam was a plant or Edward got his information from some source like - Accommodation check-in, rental car hire, relative or friend travelling with Liam, Any other source that contained information about Liam. Perhaps someone picked Liam’s pocket, got information from wallet then replaced it. However unlikely any non-psychic means is it’s infinitely more likely than psychic ability (but you already know that).
Edward is a "What".
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Apology
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She also said that he wasn't staying at the same hotel where the show was held.
I do know all of this.
I ask because I'd like to trick him and catch him, and it's much easier to do that when I already have an idea what the mechanism IS. Otherwise I'm just blowing hundreds of dollars on tickets that get me nowhere - which I've already repeatedly done.
Tiktaalik
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So Edwards pointed to a section of the audience and said a pretty common name, and at that point "Liam" voluntarily got up and associated himself with it?
What if "Liam" had not moved or responded? It would have been a miss, no confirmation bias possible. When "Liam" volunteered himself, he just gave Edwards a bunch of info: that he really did know someone named Joshua, that because he didn't spontaneously say something like "that's my dead father!" it was more apt to be him, and then when Edwards said, "I'm getting that it's you," "Liam" probably confirmed that with a gesture, nod, or other facial expression. From there Edwards would have been on a roll.
Still guessing and cold-reading.
What if "Liam" had not moved or responded? It would have been a miss, no confirmation bias possible. When "Liam" volunteered himself, he just gave Edwards a bunch of info: that he really did know someone named Joshua, that because he didn't spontaneously say something like "that's my dead father!" it was more apt to be him, and then when Edwards said, "I'm getting that it's you," "Liam" probably confirmed that with a gesture, nod, or other facial expression. From there Edwards would have been on a roll.
Still guessing and cold-reading.
Somehow I'm not sure I'm THAT recognizable.
Additionally, like I said, Liam was IN FRONT of me in line, and no one knew in advance that I would be there (since I was attending under a fake name with a ticket that was paid for in cash by someone else).
You must think Edward has some seriously extraordinary eyesight.
Liam was in the lowest tier of tickets - which meant that he was the furthest from the stage. You expect a performer who has lights in his eyes to see (and correctly read to that extent) the facial expressions of an audience member from at least sixty feet away?
Additionally, Edward instructs his audience not to say anything at all. Liam's not saying, "That's my dead father!" was par for the course in that respect. No one responded with that when Edward said things unless he asked them a direct question.
Get someone to attend one of his shows and make information about that person somehow available to Edward and his minions then see if they take the bait. Not easy to do (or even legal perhaps) but would love to bug the “green room“ of these liars to find out what‘s said behind stage before their performances.I do know all of this.
I ask because I'd like to trick him and catch him, and it's much easier to do that when I already have an idea what the mechanism IS. Otherwise I'm just blowing hundreds of dollars on tickets that get me nowhere - which I've already repeatedly done.
Ah, but as I said, I did that the second time around. I attended under someone else's identity (which, no, is not legal), bought the ticket far in advance, and additionally e-mailed Edward's staff and told them all KINDS of things to see if it would make them call on me during the readings.
No dice.
Perhaps it was too obvious a set-up. Being a liar doesn’t make him stupid.
Depends on how you look at it. By all appearances, I was just another fan wanting to reach out to my dead... I can't remember what I said. I think it was sister.
By the by, the audiences at these things go HYSTERICAL. There were some incredibly serious tragedies in that audience, and people were sobbing all over the place by the end of it. Quite depressing, really, that they believe in him so much.
welshdean
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Tiktaalik
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You must think Edward has some seriously extraordinary eyesight.
Liam was in the lowest tier of tickets - which meant that he was the furthest from the stage. You expect a performer who has lights in his eyes to see (and correctly read to that extent) the facial expressions of an audience member from at least sixty feet away?
Additionally, Edward instructs his audience not to say anything at all. Liam's not saying, "That's my dead father!" was par for the course in that respect. No one responded with that when Edward said things unless he asked them a direct question.
OK. But Liam did confirm it by standing up. I wasn't aware that the lowest tier was in the back; usually the lowest part of an audience is in the front, must have been a weird set-up with Edwards at the top of some cake-like stage.
And I've seen a bunch of his shows on TV, and people do definitely say stuff. He probably knows they will, whether he "instructs" them not to or not. It just makes him look good. He could also have some helpers in the audience who signal him electronically or otherwise when they get an affirmative gesture or response.
There are a bunch of good choices here for how it could have happened. I gave you a couple more options; it seems like you're discounting them all. Seems like either you have an alternative rational explanation that you're holding onto, or you want to believe he's psychic.
If I were Edward or any other “entertainment psychic” the biggest fear I would have would be being exposed. I would therefore only use cold reading or hot reading I was fully in control of and could completely trust. Forget the law (as you already have) and bug his green room.
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welshdean
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This
I don't think Remie is trying to prove psi; she's investigating and has hit what appears to be a brick wall.
I will do a version of what others have done and list options:
1. JE has the paranormal powers he claims. I will discount this for the moment.
2. You (Remie) did not observe as accurately as you think. I am speaking not of what was said, but of the physical indications, especially where JE pointed. Was it indisputably to Liam's table? But I will discount this option for the moment, too.
3. Liam was somehow made into a stooge. I'll discount this for the moment, too.
4. Liam was not a stooge, but an in-place mechanism used by JE and staff uncovered the information. This is not unheard of, though difficult in these circumstances if Liam's memory is as trustworthy as yours. It is this part that I seriously doubt. Plus, you have overlooked something obvious: Liam perhaps did not speak to anyone in line besides you, but he did speak to people at his table, enough so that they knew he called himself Liam and not Joshua. Did they share stories? Show pictures of children out of their wallets? Leave their wallets in coat pockets draped carelessly over the backs of chairs? What is the likelihood that JE had a plant at some or all of the tables and that the plants could communicate even during the show if they discovered something actionable?
5. Liam was not a stooge and JE had no plant at his table. Then we are left with something unplanned somehow dropping the info into JE's lap. The fact that such a hit is rare or unheard of lends credence to this. This hit is far less remarkable than Harry Kellar's reading of a traveling actor in the orient which I have described more than once on this forum. If this is the case, we will likely never know how it happened.
It should be obvious that I lean to number 5 or number 6. As improbably as they may seem, they are still more probable than number 1.
I will do a version of what others have done and list options:
1. JE has the paranormal powers he claims. I will discount this for the moment.
2. You (Remie) did not observe as accurately as you think. I am speaking not of what was said, but of the physical indications, especially where JE pointed. Was it indisputably to Liam's table? But I will discount this option for the moment, too.
3. Liam was somehow made into a stooge. I'll discount this for the moment, too.
4. Liam was not a stooge, but an in-place mechanism used by JE and staff uncovered the information. This is not unheard of, though difficult in these circumstances if Liam's memory is as trustworthy as yours. It is this part that I seriously doubt. Plus, you have overlooked something obvious: Liam perhaps did not speak to anyone in line besides you, but he did speak to people at his table, enough so that they knew he called himself Liam and not Joshua. Did they share stories? Show pictures of children out of their wallets? Leave their wallets in coat pockets draped carelessly over the backs of chairs? What is the likelihood that JE had a plant at some or all of the tables and that the plants could communicate even during the show if they discovered something actionable?
5. Liam was not a stooge and JE had no plant at his table. Then we are left with something unplanned somehow dropping the info into JE's lap. The fact that such a hit is rare or unheard of lends credence to this. This hit is far less remarkable than Harry Kellar's reading of a traveling actor in the orient which I have described more than once on this forum. If this is the case, we will likely never know how it happened.
It should be obvious that I lean to number 5 or number 6. As improbably as they may seem, they are still more probable than number 1.