Health care - administrative incompetence

Garrison0fMars said:
What would you add to the PPACA that'd make it "all good"?
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Take away just about everything besides what I've already mentioned.

Add in a phased dismantling of Medicare and make everyone transfer over to a private insurance by 2014.

Give low-incomes a sliding-scale subsidy to pay for insurance.

Give tax breaks for all health care costs.

Give doctors a tax break for the free care they provide.
 
Isn't that essentially just passing tax dollars to insurance companies? They're already making money hand over fist from us, they need more?

As long as insurance encourages, even demands abuse, it will be abused and we will get screwed.
 
xjx388 said:
OK, so we've all agreed that Medicare sucks.

Why in the world would we expand it to everyone. :boggled:
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MediCARE actually works ok a vast majority of the time (for patients).
MedicAID is what totally sucks most of the time (again, for patients).

Under my proposal, there is no pressure on MDs to ration at the bedside covertly. MDs simply tell patients what they recommend, and see if it's covered by Medicare. If it is (and it should be, a vast majority of the time), great! If it's not, the patient can pay out of pocket or accept the covered treatment.

All without raising taxes one cent.

All the while increasing/restoring the classic doctor/patient relationship compared to what it is now. No third party payer coersion of MDs.

Most of the more difficult rationing decisions are left in the hands of the patients themselves.

Why isn't this a right wing dream?
 
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kellyb said:
And look...the number of uninsured has grown under Obama/Romney/xgx-care since passage:
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Which of course, has everything to do with the passage of the reform bill, which became law on March 23, 2010.

I suppose we'll ignore the fact that most of the bill will not (and may not) be in force until 2014, while the job market has not significantly improved.

:rolleyes:
 
xjx388 said:
Take away just about everything besides what I've already mentioned.

Add in a phased dismantling of Medicare and make everyone transfer over to a private insurance by 2014.

Give low-incomes a sliding-scale subsidy to pay for insurance.

Give tax breaks for all health care costs.

Give doctors a tax break for the free care they provide.
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It does have a sliding scale subsidy for "low incomes" above 133% of the poverty level. (Everyone below such a level gets on Medicaid starting 2014) It does give tax breaks for health care costs (I dunno all, certainly not breasts implants, though, that'd certainly be helpful I suppose lol...) (the subsidy is a tax credit, albeit also refundable for lower income), You essentially like the PPACA, you just also want to dismantle Medicare (and I guess leave old sick people to private insurance, be careful what you wish for there) as well. Keep in mind, when you give a private industry free government money without any conditions, abuse will become well, rampant.
 
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Silly Green Monkey said:
Isn't that essentially just passing tax dollars to insurance companies? They're already making money hand over fist from us, they need more?

As long as insurance encourages, even demands abuse, it will be abused and we will get screwed.
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It's essentially an extra 400 billion dollars going to the private insurance industry, without much in term of changes in conditions (there's a pre existing condition ban yes, which is good, but it's teeth will inevitably vary between states, which often have very pro industry regulation boards..)
 
xjx388 said:
Take away just about everything besides what I've already mentioned.

Add in a phased dismantling of Medicare and make everyone transfer over to a private insurance by 2014.

Give low-incomes a sliding-scale subsidy to pay for insurance. Give tax breaks for all health care costs.
Give doctors a tax break for the free care they provide.
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You think Obamacare doesn't do that?
 
Emet said:
Which of course, has everything to do with the passage of the reform bill, which became law on March 23, 2010.

I suppose we'll ignore the fact that most of the bill will not (and may not) be in force until 2014, while the job market has not significantly improved.

:rolleyes:
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It's been law for almost a year now.
Any signs of improvement yet?
 
kellyb said:
It's been law for almost a year now.
Any signs of improvement yet?
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Well to be fair, Emet has a point, most of the provisions don't become law until 2014. But to me, that's another sign it was shoddy legislation, 4 years?! We were able to roll out Medicare in 10 months, without computerization!
 
Garrison0fMars said:
Well to be fair, Emet has a point, most of the provisions don't become law until 2014. But to me, that's another sign it was shoddy legislation, 4 years?! We were able to roll out Medicare in 10 months, without computerization!
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I'm not happy with the bill, nor what may lie ahead in regards to attempts to repeal or defund. I can only dream it may be improved.

But considering the political climate, I can't imagine how a better bill could have been passed.

But that's just me.
 
Garrison0fMars said:
It does have a sliding scale subsidy for "low incomes" above 133% of the poverty level. (Everyone below such a level gets on Medicaid starting 2014) It does give tax breaks for health care costs (I dunno all, certainly not breasts implants, though, that'd certainly be helpful I suppose lol...) (the subsidy is a tax credit, albeit also refundable for lower income), You essentially like the PPACA, you just also want to dismantle Medicare (and I guess leave old sick people to private insurance, be careful what you wish for there) as well. Keep in mind, when you give a private industry free government money without any conditions, abuse will become well, rampant.
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I wonder if he'd advocate at least bringing back the poor houses and poor farms from the pre-New Deal era...where the retarded were paid by the government to provide "nursing" for the familyless elderly?

Probably not.
 
Garrison0fMars said:
Well to be fair, Emet has a point, most of the provisions don't become law until 2014. But to me, that's another sign it was shoddy legislation, 4 years?! We were able to roll out Medicare in 10 months, without computerization!
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I see it as evidence that the POTUS expected it to have ill effects. Color me a conspiracy theorist.
 
Emet said:
I'm not happy with the bill, nor what may lie ahead in regards to attempts to repeal or defund. I can only dream it may be improved.

But considering the political climate, I can't imagine how a better bill could have been passed.

But that's just me.
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I don't think you can really improve a turd :P

It depends on what you mean by political climate. If the majority that actually wanted a robust public option actually organized for such an action, rather than being apologetic, I think the "political climate" would be very different, on this issue at least.

As it stands, it's really just a mimic of what Romney did in Massachusetts, and may very well set back the mindset for health reform in the future because people will associate that with all "GUBMINT RUN HEALTHCARE!"
 
kellyb said:
You think Obamacare doesn't do that?
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It does not do that.

It only let's you deduct healthcare expenses over 10% of your AGI. This is an increase over what we can currently deduct, but we should be able to deduct much more than that. 50% I say. More, maybe.

It puts more people on Medicaid/Medicare. This is bad. The government has no incentive to fight fraud and abuse. Thus, we have our current system. The private sector has every incentive to reduce waste. Get rid of the government programs, get rid of the waste.
 
xjx388 said:
The government has no incentive to fight fraud and abuse. Thus, we have our current system. The private sector has every incentive to reduce waste. Get rid of the government programs, get rid of the waste.
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picard-facepalm.jpg
 
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