The Electric Comet theory

[Reality Check]

OK Ben, RC and DD can you explain these (my bold):-
....

Both attachment and separation are explained by ordinary physics. I suggest that you try to learn it.

Neither can be explined by a physically impossible, debunked idea: The totally stupid electric comet idea that has been debunked!

 

[Reality Check]

The Thunderbolts can explain it very well as electric comets
...
http://thunderbolts.info/tpod/2009/arch09/090505filaments.htm

Thunderbolts is a crank web site set up primarily to sell crank books. Citing it is evidence of your gullibility or ignorance of science.

I suggest that you try learning some science rather than continyuing to parrot this crank web site without any thought of your own.

To address your quotes: They show that the author is abysmally ignorant of physics: Cometary material subliminates (not melts).
The rest is just the fantasies of a crank.

 

[Reality Check]

The lies, failures and successes of Thunderbolts Deep Impact predictions

This is a summary of the lies, failures and confirmations of the prediction of the Thunderbolts web sit about the Deep Impact mission.
The sloppiness of the author is obvious when you look at what they call results. They are all dated a few days or weeks after the impact and so must be based on press releases and news reports. There is no citation at all to any scientific literature.

The lies

• ThunderBolts Deep Impact predictions: Lying about flashes
• ThunderBolts Deep Impact predictions: electrical energy release
• ThunderBolts Deep Impact predictions: Lying about the energetic effects

The failures

• ThunderBolts Deep Impact predictions: missing water non-prediction
• ThunderBolts Deep Impact predictions: Sheath around impactor
• ThunderBolts Deep Impact predictions: Comet breakup
• ThunderBolts Deep Impact predictions: System failure
• ThunderBolts Deep Impact predictions: Water in coma
• ThunderBolts Deep Impact predictions: Multiple craters
• ThunderBolts Deep Impact predictions: Surface geology
• ThunderBolts Deep Impact predictions: Surface arcing

Confirmed but also confirming the mainstream

• ThunderBolts Deep Impact predictions: Fine dust
• ThunderBolts Deep Impact predictions: Possible new jet

 

[Dancing David]

Haig,

Why only five asteroids showing comas? Why not the rest?

 

[Haig]

Both attachment and separation are explained by ordinary physics. I suggest that you try to learn it.

Can't you explain why a comet with a tiny nucleus can have a coma the diameter of the Sun and a tail longer than 1AU? Then explain, why a passing CME removes the coma and tail only for the coma and tail to reappear shortly after?

Really RC, what is the explanation of ordinary physics, please state it.

why do they stay attached and not dissipate?
http://www.solarviews.com/thumb/comet/comet.gif

Why can CME do this?
This event was observed by the STEREO space probe
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9e/Encke_tail_rip_off.ogg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comet

Neither can be explined by a physically impossible, debunked idea: The totally stupid electric comet idea that has been debunked!

So you keep saying but straw men don't count as a debunk.

Thunderbolts is a crank web site set up primarily to sell crank books. Citing it is evidence of your gullibility or ignorance of science.

I suggest that you try learning some Thunderbolts rather than continyuing to parrot this crank science without any thought of your own.

You might learn something RC

To address your quotes: They show that the author is abysmally ignorant of physics: Cometary material subliminates (not melts).
The rest is just the fantasies of a crank.

It's not so long since mainstream science denied the aurora could be powered by the Sun now it's fact.

Birkeland currents in the Earth's magnetosphere
The presence of Birkeland currents has been absolutely confirmed with satellite-borne particle and magnetic field experiments conducted over the past two decades. These satellite observations have determined the large-scale patterns, flow directions, and intensities of Birkeland currents in the auroral and polar regions, and their relationship to the orientation and magnitude of the interplanetary magnetic field. The Birkeland currents are directly associated with visible and UV auroral forms observed with satellites.
http://www.springerlink.com/content/h5771446ux3xh584/

Haig,

Why only five asteroids showing comas? Why not the rest?

Well DD, as I understand it, the five have sufficiently eccentric orbits, the rest don't.

Here, this explains it better and in more detail:

an 'asteroid' on a sufficiently elliptical orbit will do precisely what a comet does—it will discharge electrically. What distinguishes the cometary 'asteroids', observed by the University of Hawaii astronomers, are the paths they follow, moving them through the radial electric field of the Sun to a greater extent than is typical of other bodies in the 'asteroid belt' (See chart above). Cometary effects may also be expected from an asteroid if it passes through the huge electric comet tail [called the magnetosphere] of a giant planet.

 

[Reality Check]

Really RC, what is the explanation of ordinary physics, please state it.

No. Do your own research. I am not going to do that work of someone who is being so folled by a crank web site. It is now obvious that nothing I say can change your delustion that ~0.6 g/cc is ~3.0 g/cc.

...snipped off topic stuff...
Well DD, as I understand it, the five have sufficiently eccentric orbits, the rest don't.

Wrong yet again Haig. Learn to read The totally stupid electric comet idea that has been debunked! or other posts in this thread. I will emphasis the numbers for you.

There are 5 observed main-belt comets with a minimum eccentricity of 0.1644 (133P/Elst-Pizarro). So the EC minimim must be this (or lower!).

There are at least 173,583 asteroids (rocky bodies) that have an orbit with an eccentricity above that EC minimum value that are not comets. This includes asteroids that have been observed for decades.
There are 459,893 asteroids with eccentricities greater than the minimum observed eccentricity of comets (0.0279).
Also see EC predicts that 100,000's of asteroids should be comets

Good examples of the asteriods that should be comets according to the EC idea are many of the named asteroids:

• Juno (e=0.2553, observed over a span of 67,610 days).
• Pallas (e=0.2309, observed over a span of 64,291 days)
• Astraea (e=0.1917, observed over a span of 59,759 days)
• ...More than 46 other named asteroids observed 1000's of times over decades.
• Vera (e=0.1939, observed over a span of 45,191 days)

~

 

[Haig]

Can "dirty snowball" comets do this? Perhaps this is evidence for electric comets?

Comet McNaught, also known as the Great Comet of 2007
SWICS found that even at 160 million miles from the comet's nucleus, the tail had slowed the solar wind to half its normal speed. The solar wind should usually be about 435 miles (700 km) per second at that distance from the Sun, but inside the comet's ion tail, it was less than 250 miles (400 km) per second.
"This was very surprising to me. Way past the orbit of Mars, the solar wind felt the disturbance of this little comet. It will be a serious challenge for us theoreticians and computer modellers to figure out the physics,"
—space science professor, Michael Combi


The Explosive Demise of Comet Linear
A comet nucleus can be compared to the insulating material in a capacitor. As charge is exchanged from the comet’s surface to the solar wind, electrical energy is stored in the nucleus in the form of charge polarization. This can easily build up intense mechanical stress in the comet nucleus, which may be released catastrophically, as in a capacitor when its insulation suffers rapid breakdown. The comet will explode!

 

[Tubbythin]

Can "dirty snowball" comets do this? Perhaps this is evidence for electric comets?

Comet McNaught, also known as the Great Comet of 2007
SWICS found that even at 160 million miles from the comet's nucleus, the tail had slowed the solar wind to half its normal speed. The solar wind should usually be about 435 miles (700 km) per second at that distance from the Sun, but inside the comet's ion tail, it was less than 250 miles (400 km) per second.
"This was very surprising to me. Way past the orbit of Mars, the solar wind felt the disturbance of this little comet. It will be a serious challenge for us theoreticians and computer modellers to figure out the physics,"
—space science professor, Michael Combi


The Explosive Demise of Comet Linear
A comet nucleus can be compared to the insulating material in a capacitor. As charge is exchanged from the comet’s surface to the solar wind, electrical energy is stored in the nucleus in the form of charge polarization. This can easily build up intense mechanical stress in the comet nucleus, which may be released catastrophically, as in a capacitor when its insulation suffers rapid breakdown. The comet will explode!

No.

 

[Reality Check]

Can "dirty snowball" comets do this? Perhaps this is evidence for electric comets?

Comet McNaught, also known as the Great Comet of 2007
SWICS found that even at 160 million miles from the comet's nucleus, the tail had slowed the solar wind to half its normal speed. The solar wind should usually be about 435 miles (700 km) per second at that distance from the Sun, but inside the comet's ion tail, it was less than 250 miles (400 km) per second.
"This was very surprising to me. Way past the orbit of Mars, the solar wind felt the disturbance of this little comet. It will be a serious challenge for us theoreticians and computer modellers to figure out the physics,"
—space science professor, Michael Combi


The Explosive Demise of Comet Linear
A comet nucleus can be compared to the insulating material in a capacitor. As charge is exchanged from the comet’s surface to the solar wind, electrical energy is stored in the nucleus in the form of charge polarization. This can easily build up intense mechanical stress in the comet nucleus, which may be released catastrophically, as in a capacitor when its insulation suffers rapid breakdown. The comet will explode!

Yes: "dirty snowballs" or even "icy dustballs" can do that.
No: It is not evidence for electric comets since they do not exist: The totally stupid electric comet idea that has been debunked!

 

[Haig]

No. Do your own research. I am not going to do that work of someone who is being so folled by a crank web site.

Disappointing RC. I thought you could do better than that.

It is now obvious that nothing I say can change your delustion that ~0.6 g/cc is ~3.0 g/cc.

If you calculate the density, without taking into account the effects of a charged body moving through an electric field, your results are prone to error.

The charge of a body is NOT dependant on its density, is it?

Wrong yet again Haig. Learn to read

Wrong yet again RC. Learn to read

So an 'asteroid' on a sufficiently elliptical orbit will do precisely what a comet does—it will discharge electrically

and

Cometary effects may also be expected from an asteroid if it passes through the huge electric comet tail [called the magnetosphere] of a giant planet.

http://thunderbolts.info/tpod/2006/arch06/060407cometasteroid.htm

 

[Haig]

No.

Thanks

Yes: "dirty snowballs" or even "icy dustballs" can do that.
No: It is not evidence for electric comets since they do not exist: The totally stupid electric comet idea that has been debunked!

Yes: "dirty snowballs" or even "icy dustballs" can do that, really RC? Could you tell me how?

What's in a Comet's Tail?

When comet Shoemaker-Levy 9 broke apart, astronomers reasoned that the fractured nucleus would expose fresh ices that would sublimate furiously. So several ground-based telescopes and the Hubble Space Telescope trained their spectroscopes on the tails of the fragments of SL-9, looking for traces of volatile gases. None of the gases were found.

 

[Tubbythin]

Disappointing RC. I thought you could do better than that.
If you calculate the density without taking into account the effects of a charged body moving through and electric field your results are prone to error.

Does the density of a proton change when it moves through an electric field?

 

[Tubbythin]

Thanks

Just to clear up any confusion, that was an answer to your second question not your first.

 

[Haig]

Does the density of a proton change when it moves through an electric field?

uncertain.

Just to clear up any confusion, that was an answer to your second question not your first.

oh! never mind, thanks anyway

 

[Haig]

Does the density of a proton change when it moves through an electric field?

Mmm,Tubbythin maybe you could give answers to these questions that RC refused to?

Can't you explain why a comet with a tiny nucleus can have a coma the diameter of the Sun and a tail longer than 1AU? Then explain, why a passing CME removes the coma and tail only for the coma and tail to reappear shortly after?

Really RC, what is the explanation of ordinary physics, please state it.

why do they stay attached and not dissipate?
http://www.solarviews.com/thumb/comet/comet.gif

Why can CME do this?
This event was observed by the STEREO space probe
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9e/Encke_tail_rip_off.ogg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comet

 

[Zeuzzz]

Found this awesome picture that seems to involve some sort of electric engine and a comet behind it. Could be relevant.

Note how some of its yellow. The color yellow means complete confirmation of surface electricity and the whole "electric universe" theory.

....

Is there a link to the most complete "electric comet" theory? I know a few publications in IEEE journals that I cant access but they are by Thornhill, and his work tends to be (although sometimes intriguing) lacking specifics and maths, so im dubious of them. Preferably one with some basic EM and maths in would be great.

 

[Reality Check]

Disappointing RC. I thought you could do better than that.

Disappointing Haig. I thought that you had the ability to do your own thinking rather than being totally fooled by a crank web site.

If you calculate the density, without taking into account the effects of a charged body moving through an electric field, your results are prone to error.

Show me the calculation of the effect of the solar electric field on the mass of an comet. The volume is calculated from looking at the comets. Dividing the two gives the density.

Also show why asteroiids in similar orbits as comets have different densities:

There are at least 173,583 asteroids (rocky bodies) that have an orbit with an eccentricity above that EC minimum value that are not comets. This includes asteroids that have been observed for decades.
There are 459,893 asteroids with eccentricities greater than the minimum observed eccentricity of comets (0.0279).
Also see EC predicts that 100,000's of asteroids should be comets
​

The charge of a body is NOT dependant on its density, is it?
Wrong yet again RC. Learn to read
and
http://thunderbolts.info/tpod/2006/arch06/060407cometasteroid.htm

And another link to the crackpot Thunderbolts web site that lies to its readers: The lies, failures and successes of Thunderbolts Deep Impact predictions

Wrong yet again Haig. Learn to read that crank web site and understand that it is just spouting fantasies and lying to its readers.

 

[Reality Check]

Thanks
Yes: "dirty snowballs" or even "icy dustballs" can do that, really RC? Could you tell me how?

Yes (not that your obsession with this crackpot web site will allow you to understand): Comet tail.

 

[Reality Check]

Really RC, what is the explanation of ordinary physics, please state it.

Since you are too lazy to even use Google: Comet tail.

why do they stay attached and not dissipate?

Because they are refreshed from the coma which is refreshed from outgassing from the nucleus.
Comet tail.

In the outer solar system, comets remain frozen and are extremely difficult or impossible to detect from Earth due to their small size. Statistical detections of inactive comet nuclei in the Kuiper belt have been reported from the Hubble Space Telescope observations,[5][6] but these detections have been questioned,[7][8] and have not yet been independently confirmed. As a comet approaches the inner solar system, solar radiation causes the volatile materials within the comet to vaporize and stream out of the nucleus, carrying dust away with them. The streams of dust and gas thus released form a huge, extremely tenuous atmosphere around the comet called the coma, and the force exerted on the coma by the Sun's radiation pressure and solar wind cause an enormous tail to form, which points away from the sun.

Why can CME do this?
This event was observed by the STEREO space probe
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9e/Encke_tail_rip_off.ogg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comet

Comet tail.

If the ion tail loading is sufficient, then the magnetic field lines are squeezed together to the point where, at some distance along the ion tail, magnetic reconnection occurs. This leads to a "tail disconnection event".[4] This has been observed on a number of occasions, notable among which was on the 20th. April 2007 when the ion tail of comet Encke was completely severed as the comet passed through a coronal mass ejection. This event was observed by the STEREO spacecraft.[9]

 

[Haig]

Found this awesome picture that seems to involve some sort of electric engine and a comet behind it. Could be relevant.

[qimg]http://www.thegreencarwebsite.co.uk/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/06/comet112.jpg[/qimg]

Note how some of its yellow. The color yellow means complete confirmation of surface electricity and the whole "electric universe" theory.

Now we're getting somewhere

Is there a link to the most complete "electric comet" theory? I know a few publications in IEEE journals that I cant access but they are by Thornhill, and his work tends to be (although sometimes intriguing) lacking specifics and maths, so im dubious of them. Preferably one with some basic EM and maths in would be great.

If your really looking ... ask your questions on the Thunderbolt forum . you'll find those at your level and above.

Disappointing Haig. I thought that you had the ability to do your own thinking rather than being totally fooled by a crank web site.

I'm just a numpty

Show me the calculation of the effect of the solar electric field on the mass of an comet. The volume is calculated from looking at the comets. Dividing the two gives the density.....snip the usual rant .....
EC predicts that 100,000's of asteroids should be comets

Do your own math and research.

Wrong yet again Haig. Learn to read that crank web site and understand that it is just spouting fantasies and lying to its readers.

Yes (not that your obsession with this crackpot web site will allow you to understand): Comet tail.

Yes, read that .... surely your not taken it by this:-

If the ion tail loading is sufficient, then the magnetic field lines are squeezed together to the point where, at some distance along the ion tail, magnetic reconnection occurs. This leads to a "tail disconnection event".[4] This has been observed on a number of occasions,

understand that it is just spouting fantasies and lying to its readers.

Exocomets

Astronomers observed what appears to be a gas giant planet with a cometary tail around a distant star.

According to Jeffrey Linsky of the University of Colorado, "We found gas escaping at high velocities, with a large amount of this gas flowing toward us at 22,000 miles per hour. This large gas flow is likely gas swept up by the stellar wind to form the comet-like tail trailing the planet."

In an Electric Universe, comet tails are produced when electric discharges reach a critical point and the plasma sheath surrounding the nucleus starts to glow. Irrespective of composition, comets obey the fundamental behavior of charged objects interacting with one another.

A comet's tail is created when its electrically charged substance is struck by solar discharge plasma, conventionally called the "solar wind," similar to what has been observed around a star 153 light-years from Earth. The faster a comet's electrical environment changes, the more likely that flaring will occur.

Exoplanet HD 209458b is orbiting so close to its star that it completes one revolution in a mere 3.5 days. It seems probable that it is traveling through conductive strands of plasma that are energizing it enough for its Langmuir sheath to enter a discharge state. Its "atmospheric steamers" are significant evidence for that contention.