• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

Continuation - Discussion of the Amanda Knox case

Status
Not open for further replies.
Who was it who said

You can fool all the people some of the time
You can fool some of the people all of the time
But you can not fool all of the people all of the time

If you are right Charlie I think it could take the PMFers 25/26 years to come to terms with their monumental mistake
 
Still no response to the call for a coherent prosecution narrative? Look, I'll sweeten the pot.

I'll give you a general amnesty on "I told you so" responses with regard to any point you've previously argued. I don't care if last week you argued until you were blue in the face that Curatolo was not perjuring himself, Quintavalle was not an opportunist getting in on a good thing, Nara had magical ears and Massei was the love child of Hercule Poirot and Solomon. I won't even bring them up. Just give us a coherent narrative.

Of course I can't guarantee you won't be excommunicated at other sites if you do so, but I don't have much direct control over what they do elsewhere. If this is an issue for you then possibly you should have a quiet word with the powers that be about them issuing some kind of Vatican 2 redefinition of the official doctrine so that we can have an intelligent conversation about the case.

You might want to to read the courts' verdict.
 
Last edited:
Who was it who said

You can fool all the people some of the time
You can fool some of the people all of the time
But you can not fool all of the people all of the time

If you are right Charlie I think it could take the PMFers 25/26 years to come to terms with their monumental mistake

The same president that said this.

It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt.

Abraham Lincoln
 
You might want to to read the courts' verdict.

Is this the verdict which declares that Knox, Sollecito and Guede entered the girls' house "shortly after 11pm" - in direct contrast with the evidence of the three good witnesses in the broken down car, who were there between 10.30pm and around 11.40pm, and who testified that there were no lights or sounds from the house while they were there, and neither did anyone enter or leave the house?

And is this the verdict which declares that Meredith was murdered by Knox, Sollecito and Guede at some point after 11.30pm - in direct contrast with evidence which places Guede in the company of friends by 11.30pm?

And is this the verdict which accepts wholesale the testimony of Toto Curatolo - despite the large number of contradictions between his various "versions of the truth as he saw it", and his insistence that he saw the disco buses on the night in question?

And is this the verdict which says that it accepts Nara Capezzali's "miracle-ear" testimony as reliable, because - and I quote: "If there had not been such a scream, and if Mrs. Capezzali had not actually heard it, then the Court can see no reason why she would have spoken about it"?
 
Is this the verdict which declares that Knox, Sollecito and Guede entered the girls' house "shortly after 11pm" - in direct contrast with the evidence of the three good witnesses in the broken down car, who were there between 10.30pm and around 11.40pm, and who testified that there were no lights or sounds from the house while they were there, and neither did anyone enter or leave the house?

And is this the verdict which declares that Meredith was murdered by Knox, Sollecito and Guede at some point after 11.30pm - in direct contrast with evidence which places Guede in the company of friends by 11.30pm?

And is this the verdict which accepts wholesale the testimony of Toto Curatolo - despite the large number of contradictions between his various "versions of the truth as he saw it", and his insistence that he saw the disco buses on the night in question?


And is this the verdict which says that it accepts Nara Capezzali's "miracle-ear" testimony as reliable, because - and I quote: "If there had not been such a scream, and if Mrs. Capezzali had not actually heard it, then the Court can see no reason why she would have spoken about it"?

The same verdict which states that Meredith, an adult, was idly dialling random numbers on her phone while it connected to a hitherto unused cell tower, instead of calling her mother as she did every night?
 
Who was it who said

You can fool all the people some of the time
You can fool some of the people all of the time
But you can not fool all of the people all of the time

If you are right Charlie I think it could take the PMFers 25/26 years to come to terms with their monumental mistake

Abe Lincoln.

Oddly enough, I was just thinking of writing a post with that quote in mind. I don't know if Amanda can be acquitted in Perugia or not, they were ground zero for the defamation campaign and enough of that might still linger. There's probably still people there that believe in the bleach receipt and that Amanda and Raffaele were caught with mops in hand outside the door by the postal police.

It's ironic that perhaps the best proof of innocence is the document that was supposed to condemn her. If you want to believe in guilt after you read it you have to accept that the laws of physics, biology, logic and just plain common sense are different in Perugia, Italy.
 
Looks like Barbie Latza Nadeau's latest article on the Daily Beast site is causing widespread confusion amongst those people who previously believed that she was a) a good journalist, and b) staunchly pro-guilt. It's quite interesting to see such people attempt a rationalisation of this situation: trying to reconcile their support for Nadeau with some of the language and opinion within this latest article of hers....
 
Yes, so probably he left Perugia in the morning on the 4th, and arrived in Munich in the evening.

It's an 11 hour trip, door to door.

I doubt he took the overnight train due to cost.

You're still talking about this...? No, he left on the 3rd. By midnight on that day he was in Milan. He took several trains to get there and was asked to leave one of them (just after Bologna) because he didn't have a sufficient ticket, so then had to wait for another. He skipped town less than 48 hours after the murder, by his own account.

It might be an 11 hour trip door to door, but understandably, Rudy's trip was somewhat circuitous...
 
Oh dear. Machine / Harry Rag doesn't seem to have realised that the interview with Edda Mellas on ITV1's Daybreak breakfast show - which airs this Monday - is a pre-record. John Stapleton has already conducted the interview in Seattle, and the whole piece will have been edited into a segment by now. Still, no harm in bombarding the Daybreak inbox with cut-and-paste emails, eh....?
 
You're still talking about this...? No, he left on the 3rd. By midnight on that day he was in Milan. He took several trains to get there and was asked to leave one of them (just after Bologna) because he didn't have a sufficient ticket, so then had to wait for another. He skipped town less than 48 hours after the murder, by his own account.

It might be an 11 hour trip door to door, but understandably, Rudy's trip was somewhat circuitous...

Nice use of "circuitous" :D
 
And in the same vein, here's the latest article from the Daily Mail:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ched-international-law.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

(Looks like Machine / Harry Rag has been pushing those "like/dislike" arrows in the comments section until his fingers have bled :D )

:) That's for sure, but I think some of the disparity between that arrow "poll" and the dailybeast online poll (75% for innocence) may be attributed to the specific target demographics of the Daily Mail.
 
:) That's for sure, but I think some of the disparity between that arrow "poll" and the dailybeast online poll (75% for innocence) may be attributed to the specific target demographics of the Daily Mail.


I dont know about the Daily Beast but your understanding of the Daly Mail demographics appears somewhat confused (to put it mildly) I'm afraid.

In the the Daily Mail worldview ......... The African emigrant or the black guy is always guilty & should be deported when he finishes his sentence - he shouldn't even be in the country in the first place as he & his ilk are diluting our anglo-saxon culture or something (when they are not eating swans or lowering house prices)
Naturally all foreigners are corrupt & untrustworthy etc etc etc.
An earlier posters [ Withnail ? ] 'Thank God I'm British..' would be at the core of this worldview.

If the FOAkers cant get the DM readers, natural allies one would have thought, on board then all is lost.

ETA Why isn't there a chest puffed out smilie :)

.
 
Last edited:
I dont know about the Daily Beast but your understanding of the Daly Mail demographics appears somewhat confused (to put it mildly) I'm afraid.

In the the Daily Mail worldview ......... The African emigrant or the black guy is always guilty & should be deported when he finishes his sentence - he shouldn't even be in the country in the first place as he & his ilk are diluting our anglo-saxon culture or something (when they are not eating swans or lowering house prices)
Naturally all foreigners are corrupt & untrustworthy etc etc etc.
An earlier posters [ Withnail ? ] 'Thank God I'm British..' would be at the core of this worldview.

If the FOAkers cant get the DM readers, natural allies one would have thought, on board then all is lost.

.

Oh, but in this case they get to have it both ways. Salacious sex murder with an attractive female protagonist to titillate the readership, but the black guy still did it (as well). You seem to be under the impression they've been campaigning for Rudy's innocence.
 
If you are right Charlie I think it could take the PMFers 25/26 years to come to terms with their monumental mistake

They will never face the facts. If they did, they would have to admit not only that they are wrong, but that they have spent three years piling hate and hostility on a perfectly innocent woman.
 
Teamwork pays off - that's it in a nutshell.

Oh, but in this case they get to have it both ways. Salacious sex murder with an attractive female protagonist to titillate the readership, but the black guy still did it (as well). You seem to be under the impression they've been campaigning for Rudy's innocence.


I'm not under any impression :) - merely correcting Katody Matrass & pointing out that the FOAkers and Daily Mail readership have a lot in common ;)


ETA

Your
Salacious sex murder with an attractive female protagonist [railroaded by corrupt & untrustworthy foreigners] to titillate the readership, but the black guy still did it.

with my addition sums up the FOAker appeal quite succinctly.

Now I hope I am impervious to being described as "circuitous" :cool: or not using 'clear declarative statements', on this occasion.

.
 
Last edited:
I'm not under any impression :) - merely correcting Katody Matrass & pointing out that the FOAkers and Daily Mail readership have a lot in common ;)

.

The Daily Mail's attitude to sexually active women is no more positive than it is towards immigrants, as I'm sure you're aware. ;) But it's that combination of overt moral horror and covert fascination for said scarlet women which sells their papers, especially when they can link that supposed promiscuity (i.e. at least one sexual partner) to eeeeevil. This is a dream story for them, and fulfills all their prejudice quotas.
 
The trouble is it's so difficult to make anything fit the 'facts' given the hodgepodge of lying or unreliable 'witnesses' dredged up by Mignini.

How come eagle eye Curatolo doesn't see Rudy with Amanda and Raff? At what point in the evening did they get incredibly drunk and high given that they were at the basketball court for at least 2 hours? How come during the period they were at the basketball court Meredith's phones ping a previously unused cell tower? Wasn't the tow truck near the cottage until at least 11:30? why didn't they hear Nara's scream and running on leaves?

etc etc. This is why the guilters mostly resort to sarcasm and evasion. There are simply no sensible answers to these questions.

I think you've hit the nail on the head there.

Rationalists see the ability to turn on an intellectual dime as a virtue. In theory if you show a good skeptic ironclad proof that they have been arguing the wrong side of a case vigorously for years they will immediately say "Well it turns out I was wrong, thanks for letting me know".

However most people who aren't trained to think that way don't, and even confronted with such proof they will take some time to very gradually rearrange the internal landscape of their mind to take this new proof into account. They'll say "Yeah well you think you're all clever and stuff with your proof, but you're a bad person, so I'm not going to believe it".

These people have been arguing for years that Curatolo was a reliable witness, and despite the fact that we now have ironclad proof that he couldn't possibly have seen both Amanda and Raffaele at 21:27 (since at the very least one of them was punching keys on Raffaele's computer from 6pm to 1am) they can't let go of their attachment to that position.

These people have been arguing for years that Nara was a reliable witness, and despite the fact that we now have ironclad proof that Meredith couldn't possibly have died at 23:30 they can't let go of that either.

They've been arguing for years that Massei was a really smart guy with access to all the relevant facts and so he couldn't possibly be wrong, and despite the fact that we have Massei's own words to prove that he's a culpably poor thinker they can't let go of that either.

So when we ask them to come up with a theory of the crime that actually fits the facts as we know them now, they can't let go of Nara and Curatolo and Massei, admit that they were wrong all along to put these various colourful characters on pedestals, and start afresh to find a story that actually makes some sense.

It probably doesn't help in the least that on certain other boards the moderators will take it as a personal affront if you so much as attempt to revise the official doctrine on Quintavalle even in a way designed to be compatible with guilt. So people who value their continued ability to post there have excellent reason not to even touch the idea that established guilter doctrine might be wrong on even one of these points. Seriously engaging with the idea that Meredith might have died at 21:10 while one or both of Raffaele and Amanda were at home from 6pm to 1am would probably make you persona non grata permanently.
 
May I say how much i resent platonov's ludicrous attempt to paint me as some kind of Daily Mail reading racist just because I said 'Thank God I'm British, for the legal system if nothing else'.

It was hardly a ringing endorsement of little England fascism, was it?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top Bottom