Who started both World Wars?

Status
Not open for further replies.
Yawn. TSR refuses to click on the link www.buecher.de, a large German mainstream online book seller, of which TSR opines that it is a 'random link', whatever that may mean. Wonder what TSR has to hide. Is he afraid to fall in the hands of the Nazis or to be otherwise poisecuted again? Diagnosis: terminal paranoid.

Whatever TSR.
.
Given yet another chance, 9/11 *still* refuses to offer a proper citation

Wonder what 9/11 has to hide?

And what substantiation do you offer that I have ever been "poisecuted"?

And you still seem to be running from your accusation that I am somehow an enemy of Europe -- any reason other than the obvious cowardice you have displayed in the past for you to personally attack me and then try to pretend you have no ethical responsibility to make an attempt to justify that attack?
.
 
Here a summary of theses from the book:
- The USSR prepared for an assault against Europe from the beginning of it's existence.

- The Soviet aim behind the non-aggression pact with Germany was it's long term strategy of provoking war in Europe between the 'capitalist states'

The author appears to have made a fundamental error. Trotsky and the international communists were fighting a war of agression against international "whites" in Russian territory in defence. After the "reds" won and Lenin died, Stalin had the internationalists or "Trotskytes" removed and made his famous "Socialism in one country" speech in 1924. This is a policy of "Stalinists" who ran the country rather that "Trotskytes" and the comintern ( international communists following Marxist-Leninism) who were banished. Stalin had Trotsky killed in Mexico in 1940 to regain control of the Comintern but never activated it in full again after the war because his fear of Tito's non aligned communist states.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism_in_One_Country


What exactly does the book say about this?
 
Stalin also had Chine at his back door to worry about as well.

Jon Halliday, (who I think silently co-authored Wild Swans) has a biography on Mao that appears to have been constructed from Russian documents. It is a real funny read. Mao seemed to suffer long period of depression and inactivity and the russians seemed to give financial support to more than just Mao's communist group. The weirdest anecdote was in the 50's, during a meeting all all communist countries in Moscow. Stalin hid Mao in his personal holiday house away from other communist leaders but turned up drunk one night on his own with bottles of vodka and a record player and insisted on dancing with Mao....which they did.

It's a bummer no one filmed that!
 
The author appears to have made a fundamental error. Trotsky and the international communists were fighting a war of agression against international "whites" in Russian territory in defence. After the "reds" won and Lenin died, Stalin had the internationalists or "Trotskytes" removed and made his famous "Socialism in one country" speech in 1924. This is a policy of "Stalinists" who ran the country rather that "Trotskytes" and the comintern ( international communists following Marxist-Leninism) who were banished. Stalin had Trotsky killed in Mexico in 1940 to regain control of the Comintern but never activated it in full again after the war because his fear of Tito's non aligned communist states.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism_in_One_Country


What exactly does the book say about this?

The book is about the developments c.q. poker game that led to the events of 1939 that turned out to be the start of WW2, although Hitler never aimed at a world war. He merely wanted to reverse the results of Versailles and wanted Danzig back. Since the Poles were not willing to cooperate and felt (wrongly) that they were backed by the western powers (and even instructed by the Americans not to give in to any German demand), Poland pokered high and lost.

You want to make the point that Russia really had abandoned it's international goals and was more than happy to enjoy the fruits of communism on it's own territory. It is likely that the Poles, Romanians, Czechs, Slovaks, Bulgarians tend to disagree with that opinion. Oh, and the Afghans. And the people from the Baltic states.

Whatever Stalin might have said about consolidation of communism in 1924, when internationally the Soviet state was a pariah and very weak and in no position to dream about a 'red planet', that does not mean that in the end Sovietization of the entire planet, to start with Europe, was the final goal of the USSR from the start (slogan: 'workers of all lands, unite!'). There is no difference here with Islam or our 'benevolent hegemon' in the west. The secret annex of the Ribbentrop-Molotov accord, which was a condition imposed by the Soviets on the Germans, who merely wanted a non-aggression treaty, shows that the USSR intended to expand. Internally both Lenin and Stalin wanted to help bring about a war between the capitalist countries in order to weaken them and next bring the blessings of communism to said countries. To Stalin's dismay he succeeded only to Sovietize half of Europe rather than the entire Europe. Stalin was not pleased with the result of WW2. The reason why Stalin 'failed' was that Germany finished off France much faster than anticipated at low cost so it was still strong enough to deal a major preventive strike against Russia and it was only thanks to the Americans and British that this murderous regime survived. The reason why America and Britian choose the side of this murderous regime was because both entities were fighting for Jewish interests. In the case of America it can be argued that America also fought for American interests because thanks to this move America could kill mother Europe and take her place on the world stage. Britain however fought entirely against it's own interests. Reason: Jewish paid (via Focus special interest group) bloodhound Churchill had captured control over the British state and thoroughly ruined it while fighting for Jewish interests (after the war Churchill admitted that he slaughtered the 'wrong pig'). Chamberlain really represented British interests, like the royals and many more within the British establishment. But he was pushed out of office after the disaster in Norway (for which in reality Churchill could be blamed more than Chamberlain) under public pressure and the worst British traitor ever came to power and sealed the fate of Britain and worse, that of Europe.
 
Jon Halliday, (who I think silently co-authored Wild Swans) has a biography on Mao that appears to have been constructed from Russian documents. It is a real funny read. Mao seemed to suffer long period of depression and inactivity and the russians seemed to give financial support to more than just Mao's communist group. The weirdest anecdote was in the 50's, during a meeting all all communist countries in Moscow. Stalin hid Mao in his personal holiday house away from other communist leaders but turned up drunk one night on his own with bottles of vodka and a record player and insisted on dancing with Mao....which they did.

It's a bummer no one filmed that!

Jewish controlled Hollywood shows a remarkable restraint in portraying communism in a negative light. And since it is impossible to portray Jewish initiated communism in a positive light, Hollywood prefers to concentrate on Nazi-Germany instead. Inglorious bastards.

On second thought it is not remarkable at all.
 
Last edited:
Stalin also had Chine at his back door to worry about as well.

No he had not. They were both communist states and according to ideology they were friends. At some point there were talks of a merger of both states but that proved a bridge too far. There were later on some skirmishes at the Amur river, but both states never really were in grave conflict with each other.
 
although Hitler never aimed at a world war. He merely wanted to reverse the results of Versailles and wanted Danzig back.

Yet he didn't just take Danzig he took ALL of Poland to include parts NEVER controlled by the German Empire - gave parts of it away and proceeded with plans to destroy the Polish culture. What did that have to do with regaining Danzig?

What did destroying the Polish state and occupying parts of Poland that had been controlled by the Russian empire up to world war I have to do with Danzig?

So the German's weren't interested in the East - please explain why Hitler who was hyper about reversing Versaille didn't want to regain the lands granted to Germany in the Treaty of Brest-Litovsk?

Why did he not want to do that? Care to explain?

Of course not you have no answer, LOL
 
Winston Churchill latest

Britain tonight is starting a controlled demolition of Winston Churchill by its own. Do the editors of the Independent read this thread? :rolleyes:

Let's annotate this article a bit with the new found knowledge in this thread.

Not his finest hour: The dark side of Winston Churchill

Winston Churchill is rightly remembered for leading Britain through her finest hour

The boys from the Independent probably mean the destruction of Nazi-Germany and the sucking into Europe of 'periferal whites' such as Kozaks and Americans, the same Germany that Britain declared war upon, a nation that had only benevolent intentions towards Britain, including protecting it's empire. Nevermind...

– but what if he also led the country through her most shameful hour? What if, in addition to rousing a nation to save the world from the Nazis, he fought for a raw white supremacism and a concentration camp network of his own? This question burns through Richard Toye's new history, Churchill's Empire, and is even seeping into the Oval Office.

George W Bush left a bust of Churchill near his desk in the White House, in an attempt to associate himself with the war leader's heroic stand against fascism. Barack Obama had it returned to Britain. It's not hard to guess why: his Kenyan grandfather, Hussein Onyango Obama, was imprisoned without trial for two years and was tortured on Churchill's watch, for resisting Churchill's empire.

...

As soon as he could, Churchill charged off to take his part in "a lot of jolly little wars against barbarous peoples". In the Swat valley, now part of Pakistan, he experienced, fleetingly, a crack of doubt. He realised that the local population was fighting back because of "the presence of British troops in lands the local people considered their own," just as Britain would if she were invaded. But Churchill soon suppressed this thought, deciding instead they were merely deranged jihadists whose violence was explained by a "strong aboriginal propensity to kill".

He gladly took part in raids that laid waste to whole valleys, destroying houses and burning crops. He then sped off to help reconquer the Sudan, where he bragged that he personally shot at least three "savages".

We remember that Jewish paid Churchill insisted on starting a world war including the participation of Americans and Soviets because the Germans wanted the German town of Danzig back that was stolen from them by the allies after the Germans were defeated in WW1, another war organized by Britain and France to curtail the rising German power and for nothing else. Before that out noble 'liberator' had a good time shooting 'darkies' and other 'pickaninees'. And not to forget my ancestors the Boers in South-Africa, after gold was discovered there.

The young Churchill charged through imperial atrocities, defending each in turn. When concentration camps were built in South Africa, for white Boers, he said they produced "the minimum of suffering". The death toll was almost 28,000, and when at least 115,000 black Africans were likewise swept into British camps, where 14,000 died, he wrote only of his "irritation that Kaffirs should be allowed to fire on white men". Later, he boasted of his experiences there: "That was before war degenerated. It was great fun galloping about."

A lot of people like Lloyd George, Chamberlain and many others have said that Churchill was a little bit too fond of war. We can safely conclude that our noble fat drunkard was an outright sadist.

Then as an MP he demanded a rolling programme of more conquests, based on his belief that "the Aryan stock is bound to triumph". There seems to have been an odd cognitive dissonance in his view of the "natives". In some of his private correspondence, he appears to really believe they are helpless children who will "willingly, naturally, gratefully include themselves within the golden circle of an ancient crown"... and when the Kurds rebelled against British rule, he said: "I am strongly in favour of using poisoned gas against uncivilised tribes...[It] would spread a lively terror."

Despite this reference to 'Aryan stock' Churchill saw no obstacle in saturation bombing of all major German cities, in a war he had helped declaring. Give the man money and he will bomb his mother. It will not be for long if many people around the globe will start to wonder whether perhaps the wrong party won the war. :rolleyes:

Of course, it's easy to dismiss any criticism of these actions as anachronistic. Didn't everybody think that way then? One of the most striking findings of Toye's research is that they really didn't: even at the time, Churchill was seen as at the most brutal and brutish end of the British imperialist spectrum. Prime Minister Stanley Baldwin was warned by Cabinet colleagues not to appoint him because his views were so antedeluvian. Even his startled doctor, Lord Moran, said of other races: "Winston thinks only of the colour of their skin."

More colorful details from our finest liberator:

Many of his colleagues thought Churchill was driven by a deep loathing of democracy for anyone other than the British and a tiny clique of supposedly superior races. This was clearest in his attitude to India. When Mahatma Gandhi launched his campaign of peaceful resistance, Churchill raged that he "ought to be lain bound hand and foot at the gates of Delhi, and then trampled on by an enormous elephant with the new Viceroy seated on its back." As the resistance swelled, he announced: "I hate Indians. They are a beastly people with a beastly religion." This hatred killed. To give just one, major, example, in 1943 a famine broke out in Bengal, caused – as the Nobel Prize-winning economist Amartya Sen has proved – by the imperial policies of the British. Up to 3 million people starved to death while British officials begged Churchill to direct food supplies to the region. He bluntly refused. He raged that it was their own fault for "breeding like rabbits". At other times, he said the plague was "merrily" culling the population.

Skeletal, half-dead people were streaming into the cities and dying on the streets, but Churchill – to the astonishment of his staff – had only jeers for them. This rather undermines the claims that Churchill's imperialism was motivated only by an altruistic desire to elevate the putatively lower races.

Of course we remember the naval blockade that Britain organized after WW1 in order to bring Germany to it's knees and the resulting famine lead to 1 million deaths in Germany.

Many of the wounds Churchill inflicted have still not healed: you can find them on the front pages any day of the week. He is the man who invented Iraq, locking together three conflicting peoples behind arbitrary borders that have been bleeding ever since... Rule Britannia would inexorably produce a Cruel Britannia.

So how can the two be reconciled? Was Churchill's moral opposition to Nazism a charade, masking the fact he was merely trying to defend the British Empire from a rival?

Bingo, that was the motivation of the British, not just Churchill but others like Eden, Cooper and most of all Vansittart.

The US civil rights leader Richard B. Moore, quoted by Toye, said it was "a rare and fortunate coincidence" that at that moment "the vital interests of the British Empire [coincided] with those of the great overwhelming majority of mankind". But this might be too soft in its praise. If Churchill had only been interested in saving the Empire, he could probably have cut a deal with Hitler.

That was what the majority of the British establishment wanted but a very vocal minority around Churchill (Focus), financed by Jews, wanted war with Germany. But the Independent will never Name the Jew so their endeavour to understand this sorry part of history will be futile.

No: he had a deeper repugnance for Nazism than that. He may have been a thug, but he knew a greater thug when he saw one – and we may owe our freedom today to this wrinkle in history.

Greater thug? Because of the 'holocaust', right? Subtract that from the equation and the morality of the entire enterprise will be reversed, maybe not 180 degrees, but 150.


This, in turn, led to the great irony of Churchill's life. In resisting the Nazis, he produced some of the richest prose-poetry in defence of freedom and democracy ever written.

Yeah, yeah, 'freedom and demokressie', the sort of democracy that will lead to a direction the population does not want to go. Some democracy. Britain is not a democracy, neither is America. Listen to what these British veterans have to say about the outcome of WW2:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...Britain-fought-say-unknown-warriors-WWII.html
 
Last edited:
After the demolition of Churchill it will be only a matter of time before the holocaust will come crashing down as well as the house of cards that it is.

Talking about Churchill, here is one of the most intriguing pictures from after the war, Churchill and Baruch. You don't need to be a great psychologist to see who is the master and who the servant in their relationship. Baruch had given his friend Churchill investment advice and as a result Churchill was nearly bankrupted. Only financial backing from Jewish sources kept Churchill afloat.

The idea that Baruch maybe tricked Churchill into financial dependency is a thought only staunchest anti-semites can come up with. This idea will hence not be further pursued here.
 
Last edited:
Last edited:
No he had not. They were both communist states and according to ideology they were friends. At some point there were talks of a merger of both states but that proved a bridge too far. There were later on some skirmishes at the Amur river, but both states never really were in grave conflict with each other.

I have never read such rubbish in my life. Please please please let me know more about the "merging" of "both" states. ( Ever heard of Mongolia?) and please let me know why Stalin was financially supporting the KMT and not Mao?
 
No: he had a deeper repugnance for Nazism than that. He may have been a thug, but he knew a greater thug when he saw one – and we may owe our freedom today to this wrinkle in history.

Greater thug? Because of the 'holocaust', right? Subtract that from the equation and the morality of the entire enterprise will be reversed, maybe not 180 degrees, but 150.

Hitler ignited a war that killed 60 million people and also allowed the USSR to expand causing great harm for over 50 years. Europe was devastated by that mad man.

Churchill on the other hand was a typical European Imperialist - rather common at the time and not remarkable. He was also not a dictator like Hitler he had to get his actions approved by the cabinet, parliament and some by the King. Hitler had no such constraints.

I find it remarkable that 9/11 continues to whine about the Allies using tactics against the Germans that they themselves used first.

Sorry that the allies did it better than the nazis but that is what happens when you declare war on an enemy that has greater production, population and wealth than you


Despite this reference to 'Aryan stock' Churchill saw no obstacle in saturation bombing of all major German cities, in a war he had helped declaring.

Was that maybe because of German attacks on British, Polish and Dutch cities? Nay probably not, LOL

I have noticed that you still have not answered the following questions

Why did the Germans invade the rest of Poland when all they wanted was Danzig? Why did they start a reign of terror against the Polish people if they only wanted Danzig?

What did old Hitler say in Mein Kampf and lebenstraum again?

Why did Hitler say repeatedly that he wanted to reverse Versailles but for some odd reason you seem to believe he didn't want to bring back the Brest-Livotsk treaty?

Oh and my favorite the one you keep fleeing from - why agains did the Germans invade Luxembourg - then keep it after any possible need for 'military' reasons was long past??
 
Last edited:
After the demolition of Churchill it will be only a matter of time before the holocaust will come crashing down as well as the house of cards that it is.

Since Britain is a democracy the press can say anything they want and have been 'attacking' Churchill since before WWI.

Wait a minute didn't you say before that the Jews controyed the press ---- so how did this article get out (ignore for a moment 90 years of other comments)?

This seems to contradict your claim that the Jews control the press? Please explain

You appear to be a bit delusional when it comes to the holocaust there would have to be some evidence the holocaust hadn't happened all you've done is deny the existing evidence.

An old question you never answered. Is there anything the great 'forgers' got right? Do you mean that ever single piece of evidence was forged badly? Ever single piece there is not a single thing you cannot deny.....LOL
 
Last edited:
After the demolition of Churchill it will be only a matter of time before the holocaust will come crashing down as well as the house of cards that it is.

Talking about Churchill, here is one of the most intriguing pictures from after the war, Churchill and Baruch. You don't need to be a great psychologist to see who is the master and who the servant in their relationship. Baruch had given his friend Churchill investment advice and as a result Churchill was nearly bankrupted. Only financial backing from Jewish sources kept Churchill afloat.

The idea that Baruch maybe tricked Churchill into financial dependency is a thought only staunchest anti-semites can come up with. This idea will hence not be further pursued here.

So Churchill is both the victim and the planner of WWII? Can you get your story straight?
 
Of course we remember the naval blockade that Britain organized after WW1 in order to bring Germany to it's knees and the resulting famine lead to 1 million deaths in Germany.

Just in case any of us forgot the details, when you say "after WW1" you actually mean "until the peace treaty was signed". That kind of "after".
 
Fortunately our blockade of Germany starved them into peace before their blockade of the UK starved us into peace.

It was a close thing though.
 
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/new...-rescue-service-during-Battle-of-Britain.html

British pilots relied on German sea rescue service during Battle of Britain

RAF pilots shot down over the Channel during the Battle of Britain had to rely on German search and rescue services to save them from drowning, new research has unveiled.

But, but... I thought the Germans were the evil ones?!

Here we see again the real intentions of both war parties in action: Germany desperately wanted peace with their 'racial brothers', where the British goal (under Churchill) was, the total destruction of Germany. And if the price is to suck Americans and Soviets into Europe, then so be it. Next time the English will bring the Chinese in. We Europeans from Norway to Spain to Russia should realize that. We kindly advise the Scots and Welsh to distance themselves from London, before the US will retreat from the world stage in this decade, in their own interest and go 'Europe-direct'.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top Bottom