single bullet theory is not true says Soily

[tsig]

The single bullet theory was the absolute essence of the Warren commission, without it they believed there had to be more than one gunman. The only evidence ever offered by the warren commission for the single bullet theory was essentially the endorsment of the reputable and respected men on the committee that it was likely. That 3 of those men and the president of the united states actually did not believe the single bullet theory and kept that from the American people was a cover-up pure and simple.

And the single bullet theory is not true, thats a fact not an opinion and I'll happily prove it if you want, although this is probably not the right thread.

The above was a post by Soily since he has expressed his willingness to prove it I have provided a thread for him.

 

[Soily]

Thanks very much!

This one is really easy. There's a whole list of reasons why it's false which we can go through if you want but they're largely irrelevant because of one simple fact. There is no single bullet theory because there is no single bullet. The bullet found at parkland hospital was absolutely not the same bullet entered into evidence as CE399. If anyone has proof it was I'd contact the authorities as you have a major new breakthrough on your hands!

 

[dafydd]

Thanks very much!

This one is really easy. There's a whole list of reasons why it's false which we can go through if you want but they're largely irrelevant because of one simple fact. There is no single bullet theory because there is no single bullet. The bullet found at parkland hospital was absolutely not the same bullet entered into evidence as CE399. If anyone has proof it was I'd contact the authorities as you have a major new breakthrough on your hands!

So we can take it that you have no concrete proof,only questions and speculation?

 

[The Platypus]

Anyone who blatantly states "it's a fact", or uses words like "fact" repeatedly, without backing it up, is making a sales pitch and trying to be convincing without actually meeting their burden of proof...

 

[FreshHat]

The above was a post by Soily since he has expressed his willingness to prove it I have provided a thread for him.

[leslie neilson mode] Yes, you did... and don't call him Soily.[/leslie neilson mode]

 

[Soily]

I was hoping someone would post the proof that CE399 was found at parkland, but i'm not holding my breathe.

Neither the 3 civilians who found the bullet at parkland or the 2 secret service agents they gave it could ever identify CE399 as the bullet they found. Nathan Pool, Darrel Tomlinson and OP wright, the men who actually found the bullet all seperetly described the bullet they found as a point nose hunting round, not CE399. The only evidence in existence that CE399 was the bullet found at parkland was an FBI memo presented to the Warren Commission describing a interview by FBI agent Bardwell Odum of Wright and Tomlinson where they identified the bullet as CE399. Unfortently, Odum himself has confirmed that this meeting never happened, it was fabricated by Hoover. There is not the slightest shred of evidence CE399 was the bullet found at parkland, all the available evidence we have shows it was a point nosed hunting round which could not have been fired by Oswald. There are a whole list of corroborating points that CE399 was never fired at Kennedy which we can go through too, but the main point is the legendary magic bullet is not only magic but non existent.

 

[Soily]

Anyone who blatantly states "it's a fact", or uses words like "fact" repeatedly, without backing it up, is making a sales pitch and trying to be convincing without actually meeting their burden of proof...

Well of these 2 statements:
1 Dogs definitely exist
2 Santa Clause definitely doesn't exist

Only 1 of them is actually a fact, but most reasonable people would regard them both as true. The magic bullet is like Santa, there's no evidence it exists and plenty of evidence it doesn't but of course you can't definitively proof it.

 

[riptowtan]

"all the available evidence we have shows it was a point nosed hunting round which could not have been fired by Oswald."
Where is this evidence? Are you claiming that they found a bullet fired from a completely different gun? How dumb could the conspirators be?
You should read through Mcadam's site, or check out Case Closed by Gerald Posner. The conspiracy arguments are all logically flawed and lacking positive evidence.
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/sbt.htm
From the site:

"Anybody who wants to posit that CE 399 was faked and planted by conspirators needs to supply plausible answers to all of the following questions. Why did the conspirators . . .

1. Plant it in a location where it could easily have been lost?
2. Plant a bullet that was only "slightly" damaged if its role was to have passed through at least the President? Why not shoot up some livestock and get a bullet a bit more mangled?
3. Plant it before it could have been known how many other bullets would be recovered? How could they have known that CE 399 would not be the "one bullet too many" that would blow the whole plot?
4. Plant the bullet so it was found before it was known how much lead was in JFK's neck/upper back? What if a big chunk of lead was found in JFK's neck or upper back, a chunk too big to have come from CE 399? "

 

[The Platypus]

I was hoping someone would post the proof that CE399 was found at parkland, but i'm not holding my breathe.

Neither the 3 civilians who found the bullet at parkland or the 2 secret service agents they gave it could ever identify CE399 as the bullet they found. Nathan Pool, Darrel Tomlinson and OP wright, the men who actually found the bullet all seperetly described the bullet they found as a point nose hunting round, not CE399. The only evidence in existence that CE399 was the bullet found at parkland was an FBI memo presented to the Warren Commission describing a interview by FBI agent Bardwell Odum of Wright and Tomlinson where they identified the bullet as CE399. Unfortently, Odum himself has confirmed that this meeting never happened, it was fabricated by Hoover. There is not the slightest shred of evidence CE399 was the bullet found at parkland, all the available evidence we have shows it was a point nosed hunting round which could not have been fired by Oswald. There are a whole list of corroborating points that CE399 was never fired at Kennedy which we can go through too, but the main point is the legendary magic bullet is not only magic but non existent.

So you, like many CTers i've encountered, think that people, when asked to recall something they experienced during a traumatic situation, never ever make mistakes when asked to describe what they remember?

Hate to bust your bubble, but they simply could have been mistaken. It's not a big secret these days that peoples recollections and witnesses perceptions are more often flawed than not, especially when the experience was stressful and chaotic or happened very quickly.

 

[carlitos]

Anyone who blatantly states "it's a fact", or uses words like "fact" repeatedly, without backing it up, is making a sales pitch and trying to be convincing without actually meeting their burden of proof...

Well of these 2 statements:
1 Dogs definitely exist
2 Santa Clause definitely doesn't exist

Only 1 of them is actually a fact, but most reasonable people would regard them both as true. The magic bullet is like Santa, there's no evidence it exists and plenty of evidence it doesn't but of course you can't definitively proof it.

The highlighted portion appears to have gone over your head. Your statements 1 and 2 do not contain the word "fact."

 

[The Platypus]

Well of these 2 statements:
1 Dogs definitely exist
2 Santa Clause definitely doesn't exist

Only 1 of them is actually a fact, but most reasonable people would regard them both as true. The magic bullet is like Santa, there's no evidence it exists and plenty of evidence it doesn't but of course you can't definitively proof it.

Trying another sales pitch technique isn't very convincing and just hurt your credibility even more...

 

[Soily]

So you, like many CTers i've encountered, think that people, when asked to recall something they experienced during a traumatic situation, never ever make mistakes when asked to describe what they remember?

Hate to bust your bubble, but they simply could have been mistaken. It's not a big secret these days that peoples recollections and witnesses perceptions are more often flawed than not, especially when the experience was stressful and chaotic or happened very quickly.

Sorry to burst your bubble but that highly contensious statement doesn't magically make evidence that CE399 was the parkland bullet appear out of the ether. There is no evidence CE399 was the Parkland bullet, do you understand what that means? Not even circumstantial evidence. And all the physically evidence also rules out CE399 been that bullet. The single bullet theory is an entirely evidence free fantasy that is utterly unbelievable on every single level. It's a sort of intellectual benchmark for me, if you believe the SBT you will literally believe anything.

 

[The Platypus]

Sorry to burst your bubble but that highly contensious statement doesn't magically make evidence that CE399 was the parkland bullet appear out of the ether. There is no evidence CE399 was the Parkland bullet, do you understand what that means? Not even circumstantial evidence. And all the physically evidence also rules out CE399 been that bullet. The single bullet theory is an entirely evidence free fantasy that is utterly unbelievable on every single level. It's a sort of intellectual benchmark for me, if you believe the SBT you will literally believe anything.

Wow, that's quite the emotional investment you attach to this... which again doesn't help your credibility and is also quite bizarre...

You can insist on your opinion all you want, but that's all you have shown is your opinion and you are just using weak tricks to try and sell it...

 

[Soily]

Wow, that's quite the emotional investment you attach to this... which again doesn't help your credibility and is also quite bizarre...

You can insist on your opinion all you want, but that's all you have shown is your opinion and you are just using weak tricks to try and sell it...

Again you just huff and bluster. Care to actually address the issues? Do you support the sbt? And if so on what evidence?

 

[Sword_Of_Truth]

The single bullet theory was the absolute essence of the Warren commission, without it they believed there had to be more than one gunman. The only evidence ever offered by the warren commission for the single bullet theory was essentially the endorsment of the reputable and respected men on the committee that it was likely. That 3 of those men and the president of the united states actually did not believe the single bullet theory and kept that from the American people was a cover-up pure and simple.

And the single bullet theory is not true, thats a fact not an opinion and I'll happily prove it if you want, although this is probably not the right thread.

The above was a post by Soily since he has expressed his willingness to prove it I have provided a thread for him.

He doesn't repeat the tired false claim that the recovered bullet was "pristine", does he?

 

[carlitos]

I could understand it if Soily couldn't get through all of Bugliosi's book and all of the supporting documentation included, but what about Posner's Case Closed? It's only 600 pages or so, and you can get a used paperback copy for cheap.

 

[CurtC]

Well, all the wounds line up to have originated somewhere high in the southeast corner of the Book Depository building, so if the CE399 bullet wasn't the actual item, and another one was, you're still left with a slightly different single bullet theory with Oswald as the source.

 

[The Platypus]

Again you just huff and bluster. Care to actually address the issues? Do you support the sbt? And if so on what evidence?

I not claiming support of anything nor do i need evidence, i simply am listening to what you have given which is only your opinion of the story and i not convinced by what you are trying to push by on just your say so.

Cope. nobody is obligated to just take your word for anything you claim, if you can't back yourself up with anything more then song and dance sales pitches that's your problem. You can say "it's a fact" and try to pigeon hole people into your version of reality all you want with lame statements like "if you believe the SBT you will literally believe anything", and it may work for you on some people, but that doesn't work on everyone...

 

[Soily]

I could understand it if Soily couldn't get through all of Bugliosi's book and all of the supporting documentation included, but what about Posner's Case Closed? It's only 600 pages or so, and you can get a used paperback copy for cheap.

Sounds like you haven't read bugliosi's epic book yourself, since even he trashes case closed in it.

 

[riptowtan]

Sounds like you haven't read bugliosi's epic book yourself, since even he trashes case closed in it.

Bugliosi does not trash Cased Closed. He says that Posner made some minor omissions and distortions but that overall it's a good book. He also agrees with Posner's conclusion, which is that Oswald did it alone. The site I linked before goes over the chain of evidence for the bullet(CE399). Buglosi does a much better job in his book "Reclaiming History", which I am currently reading. Again this whole switched bullet claim has a hidden premise. The conspirators would be both incredibly sneaky and competent but also incomprehensibly stupid at the same time. How is this possible? If someone were to plan a conspiracy to kill Kennedy and to blame it all on Oswald, why use different guns, or too many bullets? This would blow their cover and risk themselves to jail time.