Ed All 43 videos "Second Hit"" [Explosion]at WTC 2: Plane or No Plane?

[fess]

I can't really comment on this not having thought about it in detail. But if some scenarios indicate that there are missing persons in the 9/11 story maybe they are all on 9/11 Island being waited on hand and foot by semi-naked native girls in grass skrts ?

But that is just speculation you understand ?.

Finally you have gotten something right… you don’t think about anything in detail. Your cousin Jammonius appears to suffer from the same sickness.

 

[jammonius]

Little tidbits like this are death to your "theory" jammonius. Deal with it. Is Wally Miller 'In on it'?

Source your claim and take a look at its actual content. It does not confirm any DNA claims about anyone, let alone Ed Felt. You know that Wally Miller is the local coroner and is not a DNA expert. I addressed his role rather extensively in the Flight 93 and in the Plymouth Wheelcover threads.

 

[jammonius]

Seriously though; is anybody surprised that jammonius cavalierly hand waves away the Moussaoui trial evidence? What else CAN he do?

Are you folks seriously putting forward the Moussaoui trial exhibits as your A-1 proof of the common storyline of 9/11?

One issue I would suggest you consider is this: As the Moussaoui trial exhibits did not materialize for debunker website consumption until 2006, at the earliest, what did you rely on for proof of the common storyline before Zacharias Moussaoui came in and provided you with something you found useful?

Do you celebrate Zacharias Moussaoui's birthday as a debunker high holy day?

 

[fess]

I think some of them were secretly leased to local airlines in selected countries round the world. They say the tail numbers were never retired. Could this possibly be one of the planes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6VLYpKGVBUg

At first, I thought you may be on to something, but then I noticed that Yorkshire Airlines flies B747’s, not 757/767’s.
You even fail when you make an attempt at being humorous.

 

[TJM]

Source your claim and take a look at its actual content. It does not confirm any DNA claims about anyone, let alone Ed Felt. You know that Wally Miller is the local coroner and is not a DNA expert. I addressed his role rather extensively in the Flight 93 and in the Plymouth Wheelcover threads.

Wally Miller says he's identified the passengers and crew of Flight 93. By their DNA profiles.

Wanna try wiggle to out of that one?

 

[dafydd]

Troll.
You seem to think you are funny, but you are anything but...

That's what so funny.Bill really believes that his post are rapier-like in their Wildean wit,but all we see is a lumbering troll.

 

[fess]

I somehow had the impression you are from out in Pennsylvania, somewhere? I accept in principle your invitation to meet and will do so at the first mutually convenient time. You may PM me to discuss this and I will take you up on it without hesitation.

Have you obtained your tickets yet?

 

[Gorgonian]

Are you folks seriously putting forward the Moussaoui trial exhibits as your A-1 proof of the common storyline of 9/11?

One issue I would suggest you consider is this: As the Moussaoui trial exhibits did not materialize for debunker website consumption until 2006, at the earliest, what did you rely on for proof of the common storyline before Zacharias Moussaoui came in and provided you with something you found useful?

Do you celebrate Zacharias Moussaoui's birthday as a debunker high holy day?

Do you realize how far down the list of evidence a sane person accepts we have gone to try find something that even you can accept? It's not like this is the top of the list, bub. I think the sane ones here were ok with seeing the planes with their eyes, watching the parts sprew all over downtown NY, 40+ videos of the plane crashing, phone calls from on-board, DNA evidence, plane parts embedded in the rubble of the collapses and other buildings, on and on and on. Since you are incapable of understanding all of those things, this is where we are. Don't act like that's the first bit of evidence that you have seen. Just because you hand-waved away the rest of it doesn't mean it doesn't actually exist.

 

[triforcharity]

Are you folks seriously putting forward the Moussaoui trial exhibits as your A-1 proof of the common storyline of 9/11?

One issue I would suggest you consider is this: As the Moussaoui trial exhibits did not materialize for debunker website consumption until 2006, at the earliest, what did you rely on for proof of the common storyline before Zacharias Moussaoui came in and provided you with something you found useful?

Do you celebrate Zacharias Moussaoui's birthday as a debunker high holy day?

Nope, but the day that SOB takes his last breath, I will be throwing a HUGE party!! Ever been to NYC on New Years? Bigger.

World Cup Finals soccer match? Childs play compared to the party I will throw.

 

[bardamu]

How about the fact there were were thousands of eye witnesses to the crashes, and plane debris and body parts of the victims from the planes were found at the crash sites?How about the calls made from the planes? Plus the WTC crashes were caught on film..

Do you think this is the only evidence of planes?

Well,seeing them crash into the buildings was a big clue.

If you think you have good evidence of planes crashing into buildings, why don't you use it in your arguments instead of posting lists of missing persons?

 

[bardamu]

Where are the planes if they didn't crash? What happened to them. They were certainly built and sold to the airlines. They were operated by the airlines and all have service recordds from both the operators and contractors that exchange and service parts. All the pilots have logged hours on the aircraft.

Where are they?

Do you seriously think no planes were involved?

You think a list of missing planes is good evidence of planes crashing into buildings?

 

[TSR]

You think a list of missing planes is good evidence of planes crashing into buildings?

.
You think that list is the only evidence we have that those planes craashed into buildings?
.

 

[Andy_Ross]

I can't really comment on this not having thought about it in detail. But if some scenarios indicate that there are missing persons in the 9/11 story maybe they are all on 9/11 Island being waited on hand and foot by semi-naked native girls in grass skrts ?

But that is just speculation you understand ?.

OK, that tells me where you are coming from. Can I now safely assume you are just trolling?

I think I will anyway until I see some evidence that you aren't.

 

[Andy_Ross]

You think a list of missing planes is good evidence of planes crashing into buildings?

So if they didn't crash into buildings where are they?
What happened to hem?
What happened to all the passengers and crew?

Do you seriously believe that aircraft didn't hit the buildings?

What happened instead? 'Death Rays'? Holograms? Bombs? Mass Hypnotism?

If not Planes what ?

 

[dafydd]

If you think you have good evidence of planes crashing into buildings, why don't you use it in your arguments instead of posting lists of missing persons?

I saw one plane crash into a building on TV.Where is Ed Felt?

 

[bill smith]

OK, that tells me where you are coming from. Can I now safely assume you are just trolling?

I think I will anyway until I see some evidence that you aren't.

Have a look at this video from around the 50 second mark until about the 01:30 mark.

http://www.veoh.com/browse/videos/category/news/watch/v224407KjaBKxn6#

Do you think that shock was playing a part when the lady seemed sonfused about whether the explosion (interestingly another explosion)really was in the other building ? And the other lady too when she said '' Apparently it is in the other building ' '' We just saw....(other lady interrupts)...another live picture...of.......(first lady very hesitantly) a..a..plane crashing into.....another plane ''...Around the 1:26 mark there is a clear uplift in their confidence presumably when they got confirmation on their earpieces.

Do you agree that it looks as if the ladies had been told to expect a plane and when it didn't appear on their screen made a very poor job of covering ?

 

[Oystein]

You think a list of missing planes is good evidence of planes crashing into buildings?

The owners and operators of these planes publicly declaring they crashed into buildings is a good enough hint for me. You'd have to declare then how airline carriers could be that much wrong about their property and their passengers. Or you'd have to give me some evidence that implicates the airlines themselves as conspirators to mass murder.

You think your JAQing off is good enough for anything?

 

[jammonius]

I challenge CompusMentus' Post as being pure PROPAGANDA, bordering on a PSYOP example

On the morning of September 11 2001, United Airlines Flight 175 was flying to Los Angeles from Boston and was hijacked by Islamic terrorists. Shortly after taking off it was deliberately flown into the South Tower of the World Trade Centre, New York.

59 passengers and crew were on board (not counting the hijackers).

All were killed.

UNITED AIRLINES FLIGHT 175 CREW

Captain Victor Saracini, 51, was the pilot of Flight 175. He lived in Lower Makefield Township, Pennsylvania. He was a veteran of the Navy. He left behind a wife, Ellen; and two daughters, Kirsten and Brielle.

On Aug. 29, Saracini celebrated his 51st birthday, his 13-year-old daughter Kirsten wrote her father a poem, “Years Gone By,” which ended:

“And for all the years that come, I know one thing will never change,
You will always be my daddy and I will always feel the same. I love you.”


[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehosting/344914c4cb2bd0ea50.jpg[/qimg]


Sources:- HERE HERE


Immutable facts. Unassailable reason.


Compus

Greetings Victims' Family Members,

I'm sure I don't have to tell you that Compus' claim of "Immutable facts. Unassailable reason." is both wrong and insulting to the memory of victims.

I am here addressing this reply specifically to the Family Members of 9/11 victims and most especially to that specific category of them who family members of passengers onboard Flight 175, thus making this specifically relevant to this thread.

Compus' above quoted post is blatant propaganda, completely and utterly running rough shod over any semblance of respect for victims, most especially victims of alleged Flight 175.

Compus has completely disregarded all of real facts concerning victims and, in particular, the way in which the family members of victims were COMPENSATED (or not, as the case may be).

The most important thing to victims family members is the showing of genuine respect, consisting in integrity in determining what happened, fairness in compensating them and non-exploitation of their losses.

Let me put that in list form so that it is easier for resistant posters to grasp:

Elements of Genuine Respect for Victims Family Members:

1--Integrity in determining what happened.
2--Fairness in compensating victims families.
3--Non-exploitation of their losses.

There is not a single, solitary hint of recognition of any of those 3 elements in anything that Compus posted.

The overall sentiment that is usually expressed by Victims Family Members, according to a legitimately conducted study, and not some stupid daily newspaper article, is as follows:

"I’ve discovered the system doesn’t work. I’m outraged. Not just that
my husband was murdered, but that three years later, nothing has
been done . . ..What 9/11 represented was a massive example of how
things don’t work. We have to be willing to stand up and fix this."

Source: http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/cgi-bin/fulltext/121394143/PDFSTART
pg 18/38

The above is an expression of where Victims Family Members are really coming from.

As to the specific subset of such victims consisting in Flight 175 victims family members, there are a lot of anamolies that are unresolved, as far as I can tell.

I here encourage discussion amongst posters, lurkers and victims family members on the following questions:

Is it true that of the 65 people who are listed as dying on Flight 175, only 18 are listed in the Social Security Death Index (SSDI) (28%)?

Is it true that of those 65 victims, only three are on the 9-11 Compensation Fund list:

Michael C. Tarrou
Gloria Debarrera
Timothy Ward

Source: http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/article.asp?ID=7199

The same source mentioned immediastely above also references Flight 175 victim family member Ellen Mariani. She is someone who bypassede the 9-11 Victims Compensation Fund and brought suit. She apparently encountered enormous resistance and did not get compensated.

She tells her own story at the following link:

http://www.911truth.org/article.php?story=20070213192528280

For those posters who are interested in actual fact-based discussion, you might find of interest what Ellen Mariani has to say about the way in which the 9-11 Victims Compensation Fund served mostly as a way to keep victims quiet.

Excerpt:

"With the help of lobbyists, these people presented a bill called The Air Transportation Safety and Stabilization Act. On September 22, 2001, President Bush signed it into law. The Act established an Air Transportation Stabilization Board that could issue up to $10 billion in Federal credit. Most officials never read the bill, but were encouraged to sign it.

On December 21, 2001, the same Washington DC officials had also put together a September 11th Victim Compensation Fund to pay us for the terrible losses of the lives of loved ones on that tragic day. No court trials would be needed and there would be no attorney fees, so they said. But to receive “compensation,” the victims’ families must sign off that they would never sue the airlines or the government. This rule did not take into account whatever facts the future might reveal as to what really happened or why their loved ones were not protected from the air disasters. After all, incidents of terror and plane crashes had been going on since the 1970’s. To me and many others that “compensation” appeared to be “hush money,” not “help money."

Ms. Mariani's calling attention to the airlines receiving public money to the tune of $10billion is very interesting. Small wonder, then, that the airlines haven't said much. They, too, received "hush money."

Compus didn't post any of this information.


Extra added bonus question:

Is Ed Felt listed on the 9-11 Compensation Fund list?

Come on Victims Family Members, please speak up.

 

[Andy_Ross]

What happened to the aircraft, crews and passengers?

Where did they go if the aircraft didn't crash?

 

[X]

Face [Jammonius] like a man with solid arguments if you think you have any. Otherwise it will inevitably be assumed that you do not.

We'd face him if we thought he had any valid points at all.
He doesn't.
We've tried explaining where he is wrong before, but he is so attached to his delusion that he takes eyewitness testimony of people who saw the aircraft crashes as evidence that they didn't see a plane, and he interprets videos of the aircraft impacts as evidence of there not being a plane.
He believes Directed Energy Weapons are responsible, despite the fact that weapons capable of such a feat are provably impossible. He thinks that SAIC controlled security at Ground Zero.

Jam is either a troll (and a better one than you), or he seriously believes his ravings. In which case he needs professional help.



I am surprised that Jam has brought more no-planers crawling out of the woodwork. There seem to be more than I thought existed.

s-75 (or whatever his name was, a nutter who got banned rather quickly), Bill Smith (no-plane claim being a new development on his part, but if he wants to troll by associating with Jammonius' insanity, let him) and bardamu (who seems to be unaware of a video, eyewitness, DNA, wreckage and radar evidence which show irrefutably that aircraft crashed into the Twin Towers that day).