Merged Israel Attacks Palestinian Aid Flotilla, According To Reports

[doobiedoright]

You don't think the US Navy and Coast Guard do just that every single day?

Gee the War on Drugs comes to mind!

 

[TragicMonkey]

certain right-wing extremists find it much easier to attack the JREF member, rather than actually debating the topic.

Very true.

yes. derail the thread again. favorite tactic of Neo-Zionists.

and accuse anyone who dares to challenge Holy Israel, of being a Holocaust denier.

 

[Superacid]

You don't think the US Navy and Coast Guard do just that every single day?

Drugs are a SPECIFIC exception written in the law.

 

[yairhol]

Israel had no right to act the way they did - noone could have predicted that the IDF would go mental and start killing people for no reason.

From your post I can only say that either:
1. You're blind and deaf for not seeing what happened aboard the ship.
or
2. You're deluded and live in your own lala land.

Open your eyes and ears.

This is all before any shots were fired.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_k4pG2Fs2Q

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A6wKvKjoepI&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JaiMjAULWn0

 

[Bluegill]

Welcome to the forum, Superacid.

 

[doobiedoright]

I've decided to boycott all Israeli made goods, until Israel (and Egypt) ends the blockade of Gaza. This thing has gone too damn far. It has not forced the Palestinian people to rebel against Hamas. Instead, it has turned the Palestinians of Gaza into victims of a political game, and turned Hamas into David against Israeli Goliath.

Nevermind the fact that Israel has taken all the activitists on these boats hostage, will not let them talk to any media, and refuse to allow any reporters to see injuries done to them by the IDF.

Israel has gone too far.

Man and all hamas has to do is release the kidnapped solider and stop lobbing missiles....sure dosent sound to hard to me!
By the way.........Where was the world and the U.N with the over 200 acts of terror by islamic nut jobs in the past 2 months. Sure is weird we didnt here squat from all of them then huh?

 

[Skeptic]

The right of return threatens the idea of a religiously/racially pure state.

From Israel's declaration of independence:

The state of Israel... will uphold the full social and political equality of all its citizens, without distinction of race, creed or sex; will guarantee full freedom of conscience, worship, education and culture; will safeguard the sanctity and inviolability of the shrines and Holy Places of all religions...

From the Palestinian covenant:

Article 6:The Jews who had normally resided in Palestine until the beginning of the Zionist invasion will be considered Palestinians.

"The beginning of the Zionist invasion" is 1917 (the date of the Balfur declaration). All Jews in the country afterwards are "zionists" and must leave. By now this means practically 100% of the Jewish population.

SOMEBODY wants a "religiously and racially pure state", all right, but it's not the Jews.

 

[Diazo]

Alright, having read the entire thread, most topics have been covered reasonably well with people advocating both sides.

However, one topic I haven't seen is the fact that, regardless of how legal or how right the blockade is, Israel had to stop those ships due to politics.

The blockade is a line that Israel drew in the sand, and has put considerable weight behind. If they backed down on this simply because the ships were carrying international humanitarian aid supplies, Israel's words would have lost considerable weight which is a huge deal in the talks in the peace process that is still struggling along.

A quote I saw on another forum sums up what I'm trying to say:

A nation does not survive by setting an example, a nation survives by making examples of others.

Do not mistake this for me cheering for Israel and it's actions, but I don't forget that first responsibility of the Israel government (and military) is the protection of the country of Israel, everything else comes after that.

Ultimately, despite how bad this incident is, I don't see it being big (or bad) enough to change the status quo. People will cry foul, Israel will apologise and six months from now the incident will have been mostly forgotten.

I'm actually scared to contemplate how bad an incident will be required to change the status quo. With how bad events have been in that region for as long as they have, all I can think of is that it will be really, really, bad.

D.

 

[TragicMonkey]

I think that's kind of what I've been saying for a while now, actually.

 

[Thunder]

at the very least, Israel is going to have to moderate the embargo to allow in MUCH more food, supplies, and other goods. Israel obviously does not have to let weapons get into Gaza, especially through their own territory.

But it is clear based on the words of Israel's own politicians, that the main goal of the embargo is NOT to keep out weapons, but to intimidate the civilian population of Gaza into rebelling against Hamas.

This needs to stop now.

 

[Thunder]

The "Right of Return" is simply an attempt to make the Jews into a prosecuted minority in Israel en route to the final goal of expelling them, as they were expelled from most of the Arab world.

lie. outright lie.

no one believes that 4 million Palestinians are going to pour into Israel. no one believes 4 million Palestinians WANT to move to Israel.

maybe 100,000 or so Palestinian refugees will come back to Israel, and the rest who wish to return to Palestine will do so in the West Bank. All others will receive monetary compensation for their losses.

now stop with the lies, please.

 

[doobiedoright]

withholding food, fuel, and other humanitarian supplies from 1.5 million people, in order to intimidate them into rebelling against Hamas or voting out Hamas, is an act of terrorism. State-sponsored terrorism.

and trying to stop this terrorism, by bringing in food and supplies, is not a criminal act.

OOPPPSSS................................


http://undhimmi.com/2010/05/31/gaza-do-these-people-look-like-they-need-an-aid-flotilla/

So what can be done to thwart this cynical exercise from reinforcing the dominant narrative not only in the Arab and Muslim world, but in mainstream Western media, that Gaza is “under siege” by callous Israel?

For starters it can tell an indifferent world what actually entered Gaza legally from Israel just this last week of the “siege”: 637 truckloads, consisting of 14,069 tons of humanitarian aid.

Among the goods for Gaza civilians were 810,209 liters of heavy duty diesel fuel; 21 truckloads of milk powder and baby food; 897 tons of cooking gas; 66 truckloads of fruits and vegetables; 51 truckloads of wheat; 27 truckloads of meat, chicken and fish products; 40 truckloads of dairy products; 117 truckloads of animal feed; 36 truckloads of hygiene products; 38 trucks of clothing; 22 trucks of sugar and 4 trucks of medicine and medical equipment.

snip


And if their stories aren’t enough, maybe Sderot’s Amar family should join the flotilla. You remember the Amars. During the 2008 US presidential campaign, they were visited by candidate Barack Obama. He visited their family’s home, which sustained a direct hit by a Qassam rocket. They could hold up Mr. Obama’s quote, who said at the time, “if missiles were falling where my two daughters sleep, I would do everything in order to stop that.”

There is some talk that the international humanitarian aid may be off-loaded in Ashdod and transferred into Gaza. Fair enough, but Israelis should demand that a special care package to Gilad Shalit be added to be delivered by UNRWA.
You remember him right parky? If they would just release him all this goes away!


It is Israel’s fear that her civilian population centers in the South will have to face another 7,000 terrorist missiles that had has led her to try to prevent the influx into Gaza of weapons but not food, fuel, or medical supplies. No other government, not Turkish, Swedish, Irish or American would act any differently.


This is nothing to do with ‘aid’. The ‘NGOs’ that are sponsoring the ‘flotilla’ stunt number among them hardline terror supporting groups, hard left militants and leftist-led charities. There is a political narrative that left-leaning, anti-Israel media such as the BBC are hiding from you.

‘Palestine’ is among the world’s largest recipients of international aid.
The aim of this cynical stunt is to further the marginalisation of Israel, the only democratic, free and stable democracy in the Middle East (Leftists hate democracies); where Arabs enjoy rights and freedoms unheard of in Muslim countries.

Turkey, increasingly a prominent actor in the region, is a leading contributor to the flotilla, although there is no evidence of official government involvement, the stunt will help further the ruling AK Party’s recent objectives of increasing the Muslim country’s influence in the Middle East at the expense of Israel.

We are also hearing unconfirmed chatter that Turkey is warning Israel against any action against the seaborne stunt, threatening ‘reprisals’.

Sounds like a self-fulfilling prophecy, mixed in with more than a little wish-fulfillment, to us.

 

[Eddie Dane]

To all those who think Israeli troops went in shooting even before being confronted by the activists:

Do you really think that the troops boarding that ship had such different orders than th troops boarding the other ships?
What possible strategic objective could that have?
And what would those instructions have been? Squeeze off a couple of shots, then go in with paintball guns?
Do you really think that elite troops go in firing live ammunition and then get beaten up by a guy with a pipe?

Really?

Can we at least put this idiotic claim to rest?

 

[Safe-Keeper]

But it is clear based on the words of Israel's own politicians, that the main goal of the embargo is NOT to keep out weapons, but to intimidate the civilian population of Gaza into rebelling against Hamas.

This needs to stop now.

Or, you know, the civilian population could actually rebel against HAMAS, a terrorist organization that has as its goal the complete destruction of Israel.

 

[Superacid]

Or, you know, the civilian population could actually rebel against HAMAS, a terrorist organization that has as its goal the complete destruction of Israel.

Indeed, and the American population should have rebelled against George W. Bush, otherwise terrorists who attack us for our involvement in the Middle East are totally in the right!

Fourth Geneva Convention- read it. No collective punishment.

 

[doobiedoright]

I take it you missed the earlier posting I made where aid workers cited the numerous problems with being arbitrarily turned away by Israel or having the costs of getting the aid to gaza grossly inflated to millions of bux per year.

Collective punishment is illegal, as is outlined by the United nations. Blockading aid to an entire population in response to the extremists there is illegal and morally reprehensible. If Israel really cared they'd be doing everything in their power to get the aid safely to the people who need it - but they aren't, and its frustrated aid workers and humanitarians to the point that it's come to this.

Well either you are a poor researcher or a liar...which is it

Per my post above nearly 15 thousand tons of aid was delivered just last week!

 

[Thunder]

Or, you know, the civilian population could actually rebel against HAMAS, a terrorist organization that has as its goal the complete destruction of Israel.

more confirmation as to the TRUE purpose and goal of the Israeli blockade upon the Gaza Strip.

criminal, illegal, immoral, and a down right act of state-sponsored terrorism.

 

[Superacid]

Well either you are a poor researcher or a liar...which is it

Per my post above nearly 15 thousand tons of aid was delivered just last week!

Stop saying that like you know how much that is.

 

[doobiedoright]

Gaza flotilla raid: 'We heard gunfire – then our ship turned into lake of blood'

Activists aboard Mavi Marmara speak of shock at rapid attacks and deny assaults on Israeli commandos

Extract:

Iara Lee, a Brazilian filmmaker who was also on board the Mavi Marmara, claimed the Israeli troops had invaded the ship after cutting all communications and "started shooting at people". She spoke to Brazil's TV Globo from the prison in southern Israel where an estimated 600 foreign activists, including around 40 Britons, were being held. Israeli officials said tonight that they would all be freed immediately.

Lee said: "[The attack] was a surprise, because it happened in the middle of the night, in the darkness, in international waters, because we knew there would be a confrontation but not in international waters. Their first tactic was to cut all of our satellite communications and then they attacked. All I witnessed first hand was the shooting. They came onboard and started shooting at people."

She said the commandos then sent the women to a lower level of the ship.

"They said we were terrorists – it was absurd. They came into the part where the women were, lots and lots of them, dressed in black and with gigantic weapons as if they were in a war. They confiscated all of our telephones and all of our luggage and took everything out of the bags and put it on the floor."

"We expected them to shoot people in the legs, to shoot in the air, just to scare people, but they were direct," she said, in a separate interview with the Folha de São Paulo newspaper. "Some of them shot in the passengers' heads. Many people were murdered – it was unimaginable."

....

This person is not credible!
I may be out of my league here but to my knowledge there is no way short of taking out a satalite that the IDF could of cut off their sat!
Also when there are no people shot in the head what is she gonna say?

 

[Safe-Keeper]

more confirmation as to the TRUE purpose and goal of the Israeli blockade upon the Gaza Strip.

The posts of a Norwegian civilian not involved in any way with Israeli politics or the IDF confirm that the intent of the blockade is to intimidate the Palestinian populace? Has someone made me Prime Minister of Israel without telling me?

Indeed, and the American population should have rebelled against George W. Bush, otherwise terrorists who attack us for our involvement in the Middle East are totally in the right!

Wha'?