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Repeal Don't Ask Don't Tell

thaiboxerken

Penultimate Amazing
thaiboxerken
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Sep 17, 2001
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http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/05/28/AR2010052804063.html

Well, the House passed a bill with an ammendment to repeal DODT. Republicans, predictably, said this is the wrong time since we're at war. Isn't this an argument that they use for most things they don't like? Such excuses are just silly. They claim that our military is stretched out, so we need to keep kicking homosexuals out of the military.... Huh?!
 
thaiboxerken said:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/05/28/AR2010052804063.html

Well, the House passed a bill with an ammendment to repeal DODT. Republicans, predictably, said this is the wrong time since we're at war. Isn't this an argument that they use for most things they don't like? Such excuses are just silly. They claim that our military is stretched out, so we need to keep kicking homosexuals out of the military.... Huh?!
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From the linked article:
But opponents, including some within the military, question changing the policy during wartime, arguing that it would put added strain on troops stretched by wars in Afghanistan and Iraq.
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The bolded word does not necessarily mean Republicans. And what do ya know? The very next sentence in the article talks about a Democratic opponent of the bill, specifically Jim Webb.

Sen. James Webb (D-Va.), who voted against the legislation Thursday in the Armed Services Committee, said it was untimely for Congress to take up the issue when the Pentagon review is still in progress.
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Unfortunately, some Republicans are indeed in opposition.

Republicans, gearing up for congressional elections in November, are rallying around the issue. They have accused Obama of pandering to gay rights advocates and ignoring the pressures on troops.
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I really hope that these legislators support the bill. They need to go further than just allowing gays to openly serve in the military; sodomy needs to be removed as a criminal offense from the UCMJ.
 
Webb is partly right. The Republicans I have heard on the issue are totally wrong.

And most of them never served a day in the military. (But they are the ones who know most about what a good defense policy is. Riiight.)

Military stretched too thin? I'll tell you one segment that is really stretched thin.

Arabic linguists.

We've lost about twenty to DADT, last I heard.

That we are at war is irrelevant. Webb is right in so far as the DoD's needing time to sort out how to make the transition and what regs they will have to change.

The rest is bull flops.
 
I don't think that the general opinion of serving members of our armed forces would be against allowing openly gay personnel, but this quote from Gates in the OP article still caught my eye.

"Every man and woman in uniform is a vitally important part of this review. We need to hear from you and your families so that we can make these judgments in the most informed and effective manner," Gates said. "So please let us know how to do this right."
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I don't recall anyone seeking the opinions of "every man and woman in uniform" when the decisions to integrate our military were being made. Did I miss something? Was there a poll? My grandfather, my Dad, and my uncle were all officers when that was going on, in two different branches of the Service. They never mentioned anyone officially asking for general opinions to me, and we discussed the subject of integration in the military. (FWIW, none of them had been against the idea, even my grandfather the Admiral, who was from Mobile. :))
 
leftysergeant said:
Webb is right in so far as the DoD's needing time to sort out how to make the transition and what regs they will have to change.
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What exactly does that entail? I don't understand what more is involved beyond no longer discharging people who are gay.

And even if there is some lag time in the implementation of a new policy, I don't understand why it has taken Congress so long to get around to passing the legislation. I also don't understand why Obama waited so long to ask Congress to change this legislation.
 
It's funny how some resist repealing something as pointless as Don't Ask Don't Tell but it's good to see an attempt being made. Progressive politics in the works. :cool:
 
Seems like the GOP and conservatives usually end up on the side against civil rights. Why is that?
 
We are a nation at war. In two countries.

This is TOTALLY the wrong time to be kicking out qualified, dedicated, patriotic, skilled, and hard-working soldiers....just because of their sexual orientation. We need everyone we got.
 
thaiboxerken said:
Seems like the GOP and conservatives usually end up on the side against civil rights. Why is that?
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Because your "rights" are limitations on my "freedoms." If you have the "right" to be paid for your work, I don't have the freedom to enslave you. If you have the "right" to vote, I don't have the freedom to take decisions as I see fit (and in my best interests) without taking your opinion into account. If you have the "right" to act immorally, I don't have the freedom to arbitrarily punish you without due process.
 
drkitten said:
Because your "rights" are limitations on my "freedoms." If you have the "right" to be paid for your work, I don't have the freedom to enslave you. If you have the "right" to vote, I don't have the freedom to take decisions as I see fit (and in my best interests) without taking your opinion into account. If you have the "right" to act immorally, I don't have the freedom to arbitrarily punish you without due process.
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Good stuff, dr. k. Nicely put.
 
drkitten said:
Because your "rights" are limitations on my "freedoms." If you have the "right" to be paid for your work, I don't have the freedom to enslave you. If you have the "right" to vote, I don't have the freedom to take decisions as I see fit (and in my best interests) without taking your opinion into account. If you have the "right" to act immorally, I don't have the freedom to arbitrarily punish you without due process.
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Sounds like you're getting a raw deal.

But yeah, who cares what the troops think -- let's gay up the military. I'm sure social engineers and Democrat politicians know what's best.
 
Cain said:
Sounds like you're getting a raw deal.

But yeah, who cares what the troops think -- let's gay up the military. I'm sure social engineers and Democrat politicians know what's best.
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... What? I can assure you that gays have been in the military since at least 1996. I had to explain several times I wasn't gay at Ft. Lewis & Ft. Campbell to soldier that were confused by my....

Oh, wait. You ment "gay up" as in not having to hide what you are even though what you are does't hurt anybody... (well, I suppose it could sting a bit if said anybody believed that God, Jesus, yadda told them it would, or maybe they'll find that their First Why is gay and it'll give them the willies if they call him "Top" or may... meh) anyway, sorry about the misunderstanding.
 
Redtail said:
sorry about the misunderstanding.
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You don't sound sorry.

Let's get back to the main point. The troops are precious... I mean, they're the troops. Just look at those two words, "the troops." As far as I know, a clear majority of them wants to keep Don't Ask, Don't Tell in place. Now let me get this straight: you and others are saying the troops are mistaken. You better apologize.
 
Cain said:
Sounds like you're getting a raw deal.

But yeah, who cares what the troops think -- let's gay up the military. I'm sure social engineers and Democrat politicians know what's best.
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I find it hard to believe that social engineering was the motivation for Israel, Switzerland, South Africa, and Russia allowing gays to serve.

Every Western democracy on Earth (expect for us) allows them to serve.
 
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