Amanda Knox guilty - all because of a cartwheel

[Fulcanelli]

I saw the PMF discussion. There were no links given to their pages or names. The only link was a link to a 'group' listed on one child's site that made references to child pornography and suggestions of what would be good things to do to young children. The suggestion on the PMF discussion was maybe the parents ought to 1. check what their children link to on facebook and 2. use facebook privacy features

That's why Bruce never quoted what was said on PMF when he made his accusations.

He's just really ticked off because his 'star expert' Steve Moron...oops...Moore, got totally demolished on PMF today.

 

[el buscador]

You are obsessed with this 'questioning' stuff...questioning to achieve what, exactly?

Why the arrest before the police had ever even questioned Patrick? Never asked him what he was doing that night, or where he was, or who he was with? Why take someone else's word for it?

Let's put it this way, if Meredith had lived and she said Patrick did the deed, hey, run out and arrest the guy with the whole squad in tow. But Amanda had "confessed" to being there, thereby basically saying, I'm not a nice person and I lied before, over and over again, telling you I wasn't there and now you have to believe me that what I'm saying this time is true and Patrick did it because I said so, and you know how truthful I am, that I would never lie, never, never never, and Patrick did it.

 

[Bruce Fischer]

stilicho surprises me a little bit. I know that he doesn't agree with fulcanelli on everything but he fears speaking out because he doesn't want to lose his coveted PMF membership. just my opinion.

 

[Fulcanelli]

Defend it anyway you want. Members of your website stalked little girls and you supported it. You will stop at nothing. You have become so obsessed with this case that logic has left your mind long ago. You are on this thread night and day. You monitor PMF night and day. It's obvious that you spend every hour of your life on your computer trying to stay important. You are losing support and it makes you angry. You come to JREF to lash out. You really need to get some help. Reach out to a family member. Take some time and get away from your computer. This anger cannot be good for your health.

Something's ruffled your feathers today Enough of the pious outrage already.

Me? I don't sleep, I'm not a person, I'm a bot...didn't you know?

 

[Fulcanelli]

Why the arrest before the police had ever even questioned Patrick? Never asked him what he was doing that night, or where he was, or who he was with? Why take someone else's word for it?

Let's put it this way, if Meredith had lived and she said Patrick did the deed, hey, run out and arrest the guy with the whole squad in tow. But Amanda had "confessed" to being there, thereby basically saying, I'm not a nice person and I lied before, over and over again, telling you I wasn't there and now you have to believe me that what I'm saying this time is true and Patrick did it because I said so, and you know how truthful I am, that I would never lie, never, never never, and Patrick did it.

Why is the questioning so important?

Police: "Did you murder Meredith Kercher?"
Patrick: "No, not me gov, I know nuthin' about it"

What now?

 

[Bruce Fischer]

That's why Bruce never quoted what was said on PMF when he made his accusations.

He's just really ticked off because his 'star expert' Steve Moron...oops...Moore, got totally demolished on PMF today.

No one gets demolished on PMF. No one reads it.

I read your post. It was full of lies. Your 10 loyal readers believed it but who cares?

This was the first time Steve has done an interview on the radio and he did an excellent job. There are many time restraints and hard breaks on radio and his thoughts about Mignini were rushed and cut off. He will be on air in the near future to discuss the case further.

You attack Steve Moore because you fear him.

One thing you got completely wrong was in regard to the knife wounds on Meredith. You don't have the autopsy photos or any of the other evidence so you cannot credibly say what Meredith's wounds were.

 

[Fulcanelli]

This thread has lost it's purpose. It should be ended. Fulcanelli will have no idea what to do when it's gone. He can go back and talk to the 4 members that are left on PMF. I like Bard the rabbit. She has no clue what she is talking about but she does one hell of a job kissing PMF butt.

If it's lost it's purpose it's because you are bending over backwards to undermine it. You arrive with nothing but personal attacks and the tone goes right down.

I am certain, the FOA would very much like this thread to be closed. Any discussion not approved by the FOA is considered a threat.

 

[Debunker]

Still 6500 posts to go to reach 20000!

 

[Fulcanelli]

No one gets demolished on PMF. No one reads it.

I read your post. It was full of lies. Your 10 loyal readers believed it but who cares?

This was the first time Steve has done an interview on the radio and he did an excellent job. There are many time restraints and hard breaks on radio and his thoughts about Mignini were rushed and cut off. He will be on air in the near future to discuss the case further.

You attack Steve Moore because you fear him.

One thing you got completely wrong was in regard to the knife wounds on Meredith. You don't have the autopsy photos or any of the other evidence so you cannot credibly say what Meredith's wounds were.

Oh contrare. If nobody reads it, why such violent complaints about what is written there and why such bitter attacks from you against it? It is strange that somewhere so 'insignificant' is your favourite topic of discussion.

I know exactly what Meredith's wounds were. They are described in sickening detail in both the Micheli and Massei Reports.

We fear Steve Moore?

http://www.perugiamurderfile.org/viewtopic.php?p=45800#p45800

The man's an idiot.

 

[Bruce Fischer]

Oh contrare. If nobody reads it, why such violent complaints about what is written there and why such bitter attacks from you against it? It is strange that somewhere so 'insignificant' is your favourite topic of discussion.

I know exactly what Meredith's wounds were. They are described in sickening detail in both the Micheli and Massei Reports.

We fear Steve Moore?

http://www.perugiamurderfile.org/viewtopic.php?p=45800#p45800

The man's an idiot.

Steve Moore is an expert. He viewed the actual photographs and other evidence from the murder room. You are not an expert. You have not viewed any of the evidence and it wouldn't matter if you did.

Calling him an idiot really makes you look silly. You might want to rethink that approach.

 

[el buscador]

Why is the questioning so important?

Police: "Did you murder Meredith Kercher?"
Patrick: "No, not me gov, I know nuthin' about it"

What now?

Say all you want, the police scr*wed up when they arrested Patrick and nothing will change that fact. I know you blame Amanda but that doesn't make the police/prosecutor in Perugia look any smarter. Add in the "case closed" press release and all I see is some rather sloppy police work and not much insight into the crime or those involved, or more to the point, those not involved.

 

[Fulcanelli]

Steve Moore is an expert. He viewed the actual photographs and other evidence from the murder room. You are not an expert. You have not viewed any of the evidence and it wouldn't matter if you did.

Calling him an idiot really makes you look silly. You might want to rethink that approach.

He knows Jack about this case. In one post alone on PMF, 44 reasons are given why.

 

[Fulcanelli]

Say all you want, the police scr*wed up when they arrested Patrick and nothing will change that fact. I know you blame Amanda but that doesn't make the police/prosecutor in Perugia look any smarter. Add in the "case closed" press release and all I see is some rather sloppy police work and not much insight into the crime or those involved, or more to the point, those not involved.

Nothing will change the fact that the police screwed up in arresting Patrick? Not even the fact the police didn't have a choice in the matter and were acting on the orders of a judge?

And it was clearly the right thing to do, since his arrest (and detention) was held up by a court.

Not much insight? I thought that's supposed to come in the trial?

 

[LondonJohn]

So it would be correct and not racist at all to infer a Mr. Lumumba be Negroid and a to infer a Mrs. Lumumba could be ethnically Negroid is somehow "racist".

I must also infer that you know for a fact that all admirers of the name Lumumba are non-white and would never legally change their name to Lumumba. Certainly no Caucasoid male has or could have changed his name to Lumumba.

Now, that strikes me as a slanted thought-process.

It's taken me a while to reply to this, because a) I've been busy; b) it slipped my mind; and c) my incredulity to parts of your argument here might have made something in my brain deliberately make me forget it....

Let me deal with your points in order:

1) No, it would not (I believe) be at all racist to create a working hypothesis that an adult man in Italy with the surname "Lumumba" was of African origin. See earlier posts for my argument about this.

2) By the way, the word "Negroid" - which you employ here as an ethnic classification - is usually only applied in anthropological or forensic archaeology. And even in these areas it's increasingly being abandoned, owing to its etymological association with pejorative ethnic terms ("negro", and the even more dreaded "n"-word). It really should never be used to describe the ethnic origin of someone from sub-Saharan Africa.

3) Yes, it could indicate a significantly higher degree of racial bias to assume that an adult woman in Italy with the surname "Lumumba" was of African origin. I've argued why before, but just to recap: An adult female "Lumumba" resident in Italy could bear that name by one of two ways: either she was born with the name - which would imply that she WAS of African origin (to the same degree of certainty as our adult male Lumumba). Or she could have married (or even just partnered) with a Mr Lumumba, and could have chosen to take his name. In this instance, she might also be of African origin, but she might equally be of any other racial origin. Of course, given that this was Italy, it's likely that if she were not of African origin she'd be white Caucasian.

4) Your suggestion that non-African males might change their surname to "Lumumba" is......ermmmm.........interesting (it's the part of your post that may have made my head spin out of control). I think I could say with near certainty that I could count on the fingers of one hand the number of male residents of Italy who aren't of African origin who have changed their names to one that has conspicuously African cadences and overtones. And that's not because I have any racist prejudice. It's precisely because (among other factors mitigating against a name change of this sort) unfortunately, a small - and diminishing - number of other people have a provable racial prejudice (however subliminal or subtle).

If you wanted me to check, I can try. But I know that I'd find a LOT more people in any European country (or the USA for that matter) who'd changed their name FROM one that implied membership of an ethnic minority (e.g. Cohen, Patel, Lumumba) TO one with a more "European" cadence (possibly, in a mapping of my previous examples: Cane, Porter, Lombard) than the other way round.

 

[LondonJohn]

Oh, by the way, as a postscript to my point (2) above: What I wrote reminded me as soon as I'd written it of a quote from "The Big Lebowski" - one of my all-time favourites. Please indulge me, since I've pathetically looked up the whole area around the quote to place it in context. Basically, Walter interrupts himself in the midst of an impassioned argument, in order to correct a specific term of racial classification that had been introduced into the conversation by The Dude:


The Dude: Walter, what is the point? Look, we all know who is at fault here, what the **** are you talking about?

Walter Sobchak: Huh? No, what the **** are you... I'm not... We're talking about unchecked aggression here, Dude.

Donny: What the **** is he talking about?

The Dude: My rug.

Walter Sobchak: Forget it, Donny, you're out of your element!

The Dude: Walter, the Chinaman who peed on my rug, I can't go give him a bill, so what the **** are you talking about?

Walter Sobchak: What the **** are you talking about? The Chinaman is not the issue here, Dude. I'm talking about drawing a line in the sand, Dude. Across this line, you DO NOT... Also, Dude, "Chinaman" is not the preferred nomenclature. "Asian-American", please.

The Dude: Walter, this isn't a guy who built the railroads here. This is a guy...

Walter Sobchak: What the **** are you...?

The Dude: Walter, he peed on my rug!

Donny: He peed on the Dude's rug.

Walter Sobchak: Donny you're out of your element! Dude, the Chinaman is not the issue here!

Edited by LashL: 

To properly mask profanity. Please see Rule 10 and the explanatory notes thereto regarding the auto-censor.

 

[Amazer]

You know that Charlie has access to all of the vital information regarding this case. After reviewing this information, Charlie beleives that Amanda and Raffaele are innocent. Do you feel that Charlie is being dishonest when he says that he believes that Amanda and Raffaele are innocent?

Till Charlie releases that 'vital' information to the public, where I can access it, it is difficult to determine if Charlie is being dishonest. But considering that Charlie is trying to change peoples minds about Amanda's guild; i'd say he's doing it all wrong.

Charlie has been kind enough to show me much of this information. When you look at the actual facts of this case it becomes very clear that Amanda and Raffaele have been wrongly convicted.

Good for you, I'll for now go with the information that I have access to and then the only conclusion I can reach is that they are guilty.

Do you think that I am being dishonest?

Yes

The general accusation is that people that support Amanda and Raffaele know they are guilty but defend them anyway. Is this how you feel?

No

 

[LondonJohn]

Nothing will change the fact that the police screwed up in arresting Patrick? Not even the fact the police didn't have a choice in the matter and were acting on the orders of a judge?

And it was clearly the right thing to do, since his arrest (and detention) was held up by a court.

Not much insight? I thought that's supposed to come in the trial?

You keep seeming to be referring to Mignini as a "judge". He was, and is, a public prosecutor. Or are you referring to someone else altogether who ordered the police to arrest Lumumba at 6am on the 6th?

 

[Amazer]

So we now have Fulcanelli openly admiring that members of PMF went to facebook and searched for Amanda's little sisters facebook accounts.

This is very disturbing.

This has nothing to do what so ever with the guild or innocence of Amanda. Can you please get back on track?

 

[LondonJohn]

Oh contrare. If nobody reads it, why such violent complaints about what is written there and why such bitter attacks from you against it? It is strange that somewhere so 'insignificant' is your favourite topic of discussion.

I know exactly what Meredith's wounds were. They are described in sickening detail in both the Micheli and Massei Reports.

We fear Steve Moore?

http://www.perugiamurderfile.org/viewtopic.php?p=45800#p45800

The man's an idiot.

It's a bit extreme and unjustified to call Steve Moore an idiot, I'd argue. He was a long-serving FBI agent with very strong testimonials. I happen to disagree with certain parts of his analysis. I also happen to believe that he might, to a small degree, have allowed himself to become too subjective in parts, and that he might be enjoying his renaissance a bit too much sometimes. That doesn't make him an idiot. Far from it.

And again, no "we" please. That implies some sort of collective with collective thought - and I doubt that even you would want that image implied to PMF. You might write "I (and, I believe, many other posters on PMF)" instead.....

PS just as a small point: The opening phrase that I think you might have been searching for is "Au contraire". It's French in origin.

And now THAT'S made me think of Stephen Fry in Blackadder 2, saying, with great gravity and piety: "Au contraire, Blackadder", before revealing an impressive pair of golden false breasts under his Archbishop's robes.......

 

[BobTheDonkey]

Say all you want, the police scr*wed up when they arrested Patrick and nothing will change that fact. I know you blame Amanda but that doesn't make the police/prosecutor in Perugia look any smarter. Add in the "case closed" press release and all I see is some rather sloppy police work and not much insight into the crime or those involved, or more to the point, those not involved.

How did the Police screw up?

Bottom line: if you were the Police and you suspect Patrick of being the rapist/murderer, would you expect a bit of questioning to result in his admission of guilt?

Honestly?

The Police had good reason to believe Patrick was a violent rapist/murderer - an eyewitness account and a text message that fell in line with the account...

LJ can try to butter it up however he may like, but the bottom line is that the Police had good reason to suspect Patrick was a violent/dangerous criminal. At that point, he was arrested - in the manner safest for the Officers performing the arrest. It happens all the time, ever watch any of the SWAT shows?

Unless, of course, you want to call Amanda unreliable... And, yes, I know...the response is going to be: But she was interrogated and confused. Perhaps...but 20mins of being asked "who sent you this text" and "who are you protecting" is not going to brainwash someone into making an accusation like Amanda made. Additionally, the Police suspected she was hiding something. When she accused Patrick, the Police then believed she'd come "clean" about the night's happenings. Again, no reason to believe Patrick was not a violent, dangerous man who needed to be apprehended in a safe and expedient manner. Which is precisely what happened.