Amanda Knox guilty - all because of a cartwheel

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Mary_H said:
The journalist who published the book containing the whole diary, including the "unhelpful bits," lost the lawsuit brought by Amanda's lawyers against publication. I don't think they would have given her the diary and then sued her for publishing it.
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That is true. I am still trying to get to the bottom of that one. Very likely they were not handed the diary by Amanda's side. It's a pity we don't know more about that case, it might reveal a lot about the way this story has developed. The early newspaper leaks however were small fragments from what I can tell, 2 weeks after she finished it there is a newspaper article that talks about another, or some more "chunk" being released by her lawyers. Like I say, it's a complicated business and it's certainly not true to say that either side is solely responsible for the diary being out there.
 
stilicho said:
They would sue and would win the lawsuit if the conditions of the diary's release were not met. In fact that's exactly what happened. If you don't obtain permission to publish then you are liable.
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Since when did you become an expert in Italian defamation and contract law? And how do you know that's exactly what happened? Did you read the judge's justification?
 
Mary_H said:
I don't understand why they or you find it incredibly stupid. Do you have a lot of knowledge about knife murderers?
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Maybe some statistics on the backgrounds of knife murderers would be a good idea? Anyway, do you think Raffaele having a combat knife, two flick knives and regularly carrying flick knives around is relevant, if we are discussing risk indicators for knife crime? The man carried a knife into an police station knowing he was going to be interviewed about a fatal stabbing.
 
Mary_H said:
The discussion started with a quote I posted from the blog of a former prosecutor. He stated:

"...Stabbing someone to death is not an “entry level job”; the people who perpetrate such crimes have worked their way up to such deeds by committing school yard fights, animal cruelty, brandishing weapons, unlawful threats, etc.....”



A few people disagreed with it, but so far they haven't provided any evidence to the contrary.
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I think several of us believe that we are not talking about knife novices, especially Raffaele and we perhaps are already talking about troubled people.
 
stilicho said:
They would sue and would win the lawsuit if the conditions of the diary's release were not met. In fact that's exactly what happened. If you don't obtain permission to publish then you are liable.
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The only possible reason they could have for allowing the journalist to have parts of Amanda's diary that she didn't want published would be to purposely cause a scandal and ask for the trial to be thrown out because of it. In fact, they did ask for the trial to be thrown out because of the book, but purposely causing such a scandal seems to me to be an extremely dangerous gamble that they were likely to lose. I also can't believe Amanda was on board for the whole world knowing about her sexual history.

I can't find anything that says Amanda's lawyers and the journalist, Fiorenza Sarzanini, had some kind of arrangement that she violated. If they gave it to her with the sole purpose of causing a scandal, then why would they bother to sue her? Do you think they just asked her to go through with the suit and then they gave the settlement money back to her in secret?

Claim filed:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/wor...ial-thrown-court-damaging-book-published.html

Claim settled:
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/international/knox_wins_suit_over_sex_claims_ZsVcjEO9M6sWmQhGZlkpYM

Here is an article about the luridly editorial aspect of the book:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article5258040.ece
 
Personally I would imagine most knife crime is committed by people with violent backgrounds, I could be wrong of course. Having said that you do see on the news, previously mild mannered husbands stabbing their families to death due to pressure at work or some other stupid reason. Not all knife crime is carried out by people with a history of biting the heads of puppies.
 
stilicho said:
Get real.

They all barely had time to sit down and adjust their chairs before AK blurted out that Patrick had murdered Meredith.
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stilicho - your comment is more ridiculous that the 53 hour interrogation claim. Amanda was under a lot of pressure. It was coming from multiple people and she was scared. In fact, the interrogators lied to her and scared the hell out of her.
 
HumanityBlues said:
Since when did you become an expert in Italian defamation and contract law? And how do you know that's exactly what happened? Did you read the judge's justification?
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The case was for invasion of privacy and levelled against both the author and the publisher according to her own lawyer. Isn't that sufficient?
 
shuttlt said:
Maybe some statistics on the backgrounds of knife murderers would be a good idea? Anyway, do you think Raffaele having a combat knife, two flick knives and regularly carrying flick knives around is relevant, if we are discussing risk indicators for knife crime? The man carried a knife into an police station knowing he was going to be interviewed about a fatal stabbing.
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I assume the former prosecutor has experience that informs his claim.

Most knife collector (and there are thousands) do not commit murder with their collectible knives.
 
stilicho said:
The case was for invasion of privacy and levelled against both the author and the publisher according to her own lawyer. Isn't that sufficient?
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If the source of the diary was the family I find it difficult to believe the case went ahead without that laundry getting a public airing.
 
Mary_H said:
I assume the former prosecutor has experience that informs his claim.

Most knife collector (and there are thousands) do not commit murder with their collectible knives.
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I wonder how many post pictures of themselves on social networking sites with knives and dressed in costume?
 
stilicho said:
The case was for invasion of privacy and levelled against both the author and the publisher according to her own lawyer. Isn't that sufficient?
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No it's not at all. Reread what you wrote. You took quite a few more liberties with that one. From how you described it, one would think you were privy to the proceedings, arguments of lawyers, all the legal claims for relief (it might not just be invasion of privacy), etc. You don't have 1/100 of the necessary info to have made your earlier statement.
 
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Bruce Fisher said:
You don't know what drives us? The question is much more relevant when asked about you. We are fighting for two people that we feel have been wrongly convicted. It's very simple. No need to complicate everything.
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I vote they have issues with status, authority. Some may just be short.
 
Mary_H said:
I assume the former prosecutor has experience that informs his claim.
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I think he is being a little too absolute in his statements. Are you really saying that I can't find any examples of people who killed somebody, with a knife, who didn't have a background worse than a divorce, and some risk taking behaviour?

Mary_H said:
Most knife collector (and there are thousands) do not commit murder with their collectible knives.
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Most burglars don't kill people either.
 
Mary_H said:
I can't find anything that says Amanda's lawyers and the journalist, Fiorenza Sarzanini, had some kind of arrangement that she violated.
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So, we have two claims. The Daily Mail explains that Knox released her diary through her lawyer (on at least two occasions). The lawsuit explains that elements of the diary were not meant to be published and therefore constituted invasion of privacy.

I suppose we each reconcile these things differently. I took the direct route from release to publishing through Knox herself. You suggest that the prosecutors or the police were somehow involved.

So, I have to ask you, why weren't the authorities named in the lawsuit? My interpretation reconciles the claims while yours includes undocumented allegations.
 
HumanityBlues said:
No it's not at all. Reread what you wrote. You took quite a few more liberties with that one. From how you described it, one would think you were privy to the proceedings, arguments of lawyers, all the legal claims for relief (it might not just be invasion of privacy), etc. You don't have 1/100 of the necessary info to have made your earlier statement.
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I wasn't claiming to have knowledge that you don't have to arrive at a conclusion. We both have the same information. We each know that Knox released her diaries through her lawyers. We each know that some of that which was released was not intended for publication.

What's so difficult about that?
 
stilicho said:
I wasn't claiming to have knowledge that you don't have to arrive at a conclusion. We both have the same information. We each know that Knox released her diaries through her lawyers. We each know that some of that which was released was not intended for publication.

What's so difficult about that?
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"They would sue and would win the lawsuit if the conditions of the diary's release were not met."

What legal precedent in Italy are you using? That would be a legal contract. Are you familiar with Italian contract law?

"If you don't obtain permission to publish then you are liable."

Is this codified by statute? Where are you getting this?
 
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HumanityBlues said:
"They would sue and would win the lawsuit if the conditions of the diary's release were not met."

What legal precedent in Italy are you using? That would be a legal contract. Are you familiar with Italian contract law?

"If you don't obtain permission to publish then you are liable."

Is this codified by statute? Where are you getting this?
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Do you have more information? I'd be interested in reading it.
 
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