Oystein
Penultimate Amazing
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Was Dick Oliver confused about what he heard on 9/11
- Thread starter DGM
- Start date
I_Gaze_At_The_Blue
Student
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I swear to Spaghetti Monster, that was what I guessed you'd serve!
Maybe its the German thing, my partner is German ...
Welcome
Funnily enough the whisk(e)y thread over thataway turned into a running advert for Islay malts. mmmmmmm.....
I Ratant
Penultimate Amazing
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- Apr 8, 2008
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....
Hey jammo, this all word salad, worthless, but you sure coloured and sized it impressively.
I can do that too!
The local loon that writes outraged letters to the city council does that also.
It's a well-known sign of mental instability when used all the time in rambling incoherent rants, as jammy does.
Kinda an Internet signature for the disturbed.
ElMondoHummus
0.25 short of being half-witted
Well, those of us who've been here a while have sorta grown numb. If not from the repetition of lunatic displays (while special in his own way, Jam is yet to reach Christophera's level of sheer obstinacy), then from PMs from JimBenArm containing naughty imagry of himself*
... 
. Which itself is a sort of lunatic display, but I digress... Anyway, thanks for the sentiment. 
And welcome! I now need to go and beat my forehead with a bat in order to resuppress the memory of those PMs...
*Context: http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=4463301#post4463301
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sheeplesnshills
Illuminator
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What program????? please state where we can see your verification as requested.
Your posts are descending (from an albeitly already low level) to either meaningless drivel (word salad) or bold assertions without any attempt at proof. Since no rational person could possibly mean what you say you are either a nasty liar or insane. I understand you probably do not realize that you are mentally ill but if you take a copy of this thread to a doctor, I sure he can explain what is wrong and can direct you to where you might get treatment.
Last time I lived in the UK such treatment was free.
sheeplesnshills
Illuminator
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Yes, even for us "lurkers" ... he is just another deluded, overly self-superior twoof engaging in endless semantics.
Thanks for welcome, been following you all for quite some time, but I have been doing my own wee bit of de-bunking before, firstly on Bebo, which was easy as they mostly ill-informed teenagers ... whom wholly sucked up all the LC and Zeitgeist guff.
I have even (shameless claim to fame here) engaged with the infamous Heiwa, over at TruTV,... where he was very quickly banned and is now reduced to ATS, and the cesspit that is AWE ... shame that ...
If you like debunking go try that on P4T or 911oz......it fun to see how short a time it is before they accuse you of being a Gov. Shill (man I wish I could get paid for this! I keep asking them where to go but they never tell me
) and then ban you....I lasted a couple of weeks on both.........word of caution though Balsamo, Aldo and Ranke on P4T are nasty pieces of work and there are a lot of nasty types on 911oz too.Welcome to the thread and thank you for your contribution.
Many take solace in almost identically worded claims that THOUSANDS ... jam, THOUSANDS ... of people witnessed LIVE with their own eyes and ears those events ..., as you put it.
However, almost all such reporting of such accounts fails and fails utterly to satisfy ordinary standards of reliablility.
When it comes to specific accounts from people verifiably present, having both an advantaged viewing perspective and a duty to be observant, the reporting is quite different.
See, for instance, the account of Asst. Commissioner Stephen Gregory, the highest ranking firefighter on duty who said and I quote:
Q. Did you see or hear the second plane before
it hit the World Trade Center?
A. I never actually saw the plane, but l heard
it. You could hear it coming in and then we heard the
explosion and you could hear the roar of the plane
coming in. At first I didn't realize it was a plane.
I thought it was like the roar of fire, like something
had just incinerated, like a gas tank or an oil tank.
It sounded like a tremendous roar and then you heard
boom and then there was a big fire, a lot of fire, a
big fireball. I never actually saw a plane hit the
building. I never saw that. I saw it on television,
but I never saw it while I was standing there.
You may find Commissioner Gregory's account, listed in alphabetical order, at:
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packag...12_WTC_GRAPHIC/met_WTC_histories_full_01.html
Those 500 accounts of First Responders confirm that almost no one saw and heard any jetliners among those who were verifiably present and who had both a capacity to observe and a duty to report accurately on what they saw and heard.
The conclusion that must necessarily and objectively be drawn from what verifiable witnesses saw and heard is this:
The claim that there are 1000s of witnesses to jetliners hitting the WTC is either false, or, at best, unconfirmed and is merely a matter of folklore and/or what people want to believe as a substitute for not actually knowing with any certainty what happened.
The Dick Oliver videos are a perfect confirmation of the foregoing. Those videos show that the claim a jetliner hit the WTC at 500mph is not confirmed by anyone in those videos. Not one single person.
Thanks again for your post,
all the best
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Jammonius, when someone tells he didn't see the plane, this does not mean s/he looked up at where AA11 was supposed to be, and all they saw was empty blue sky. It means they either didn't have a line of sight, or only looked up on or after the moment of impact.
Also, can you respond to this post please?
CompusMentus
Waiting for the Worms
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IN The military, "is this real or an exercise" is serious question as we are armed and killing is serious, it is not a good thing to shoot people and kill in an exercise, so checking an input is real or an exercise is what you might HEAR in the military since we train much more than we are actually used in the real world. Many in the USAF are in the business of nuclear war, it would be a horrible mistake to launch nukes on an exercise. So your speculation about the statement is delusional claptrap, your lack of logic and practical experience make it clear why to you jet engines are Plymouth Wheel Covers.
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sheeplesnshills
Illuminator
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In what way. Do you imagine that if there was a trial for example and an appeal for witnesses to one or other of the planes that there would not be that many coming forward? Plus the witnesses who saw smoke and flames (like in the oliver video
)? plus the witnesses who saw debris, plus the witnesses that were operating the Radar and air traffic control? The witnesses who picked up the body parts and personal papers of passengers?The DNA expert who identified those body parts as being from those passengers?, The families and friends of those passengers and crew of the aircraft who kissed them goodbye that morning when they headed of for that almost routine flight for business or plaesure and never saw them again.
Do you not imagine for one second all that is going to blow your "it could have been a bus or train" evidence completely out of the water?
You have not shown that any witness was not exactly who and where they said they were. Provide proof that they were all lying or even evidence that they might be..............
He heard a plane, what more do you want???? most folks do not spend their time looking up and in any case as I have explained before to you, the sound of the plane would reach bystanders on the ground about the same instant the plane hit the building. unless a person was further away (like Naudet or Rosa Cardona Rivera)they would only see the plane if they happened to be looking at exactly the right place at exactly the right time.
See above....firefighters did see the first aircraft (those with Naudet) and it was no ones job to keep staring at the Towers watching for jets!!!)
And millions saw the second one on multiple channels in Hi Def, plus thousands more on the ground and a few more on home video.
T
No call ever went out asking ALL witnesses to come forward and record statements. The evidence for there being two planes was overwhelming and BEYOND ANY REASONABLE DOUBT.
They were never offered as definitive proof there was a plane. Nothing in them definitely proofs or disproves anything. They are merely minor evidence that there was a noise that some thought was an aircraft at exactly the time there was expected to be such a noise if there was a plane.
The later interviews shows that a least some people did see a plane and others did not (note those who did not were not asked if they were looking up at the north side of the north tower before and as the explosion occurred, so them not seeing it is meaningless in terms of evidence.)
dafydd
Banned
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Well, those of us who've been here a while have sorta grown numb. If not from the repetition of lunatic displays (while special in his own way, Jam is yet to reach Christophera's level of sheer obstinacy), then from PMs from JimBenArm containing naughty imagry of himself*
And welcome! I now need to go and beat my forehead with a bat in order to resuppress the memory of those PMs...
*Context: http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=4463301#post4463301
Thank you for the link.Jammonious has not reach those dizzy heights of lunacy,but he's well on the way.Medical help is free in the UK,if I were you I would take advantage of it Jammy.
CompusMentus
Waiting for the Worms
And:
- Why a passing bus sounds like a jet.
- Why someone in an underground train station should be able to see an aircraft at 1000'.
- Why any eyewitness to a plane on that day is a "bozo", "liar" or "psyops".
- Why any image of a plane on that day is fake.
- Why China bought 300,000 tons of dust.
(Feel free to add to the list)
Compus
TJM
Potsing Whiled Runk
Posters / Lurkers:
Just a quick reminder that the reason why jammonius appears to be upset is it's been proven that his star witness, Dick Oliver, did in fact hear what he correctly believed upon his impression, an airplane. Having his argument destroyed in such a manner didn't sit well him, the poor thing. Now he's taken to creating new characters in his fantasy, like Our Lady of the Subway, who we were fortold would rise from the tunnel on the eleventh day and not see a Boeing.
I think jammonius has written her part as some kind of metaphor, perhaps a deeper meaning to 9/11 that's beyond us mortal, plane spotting louts.
Just a quick reminder that the reason why jammonius appears to be upset is it's been proven that his star witness, Dick Oliver, did in fact hear what he correctly believed upon his impression, an airplane. Having his argument destroyed in such a manner didn't sit well him, the poor thing. Now he's taken to creating new characters in his fantasy, like Our Lady of the Subway, who we were fortold would rise from the tunnel on the eleventh day and not see a Boeing.
I think jammonius has written her part as some kind of metaphor, perhaps a deeper meaning to 9/11 that's beyond us mortal, plane spotting louts.
X
Slide Rulez 4 Life
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- Oct 17, 2007
- Messages
- 4,127
A very good point.
Didn't see a plane != Saw no plane
I didn't see the person who tried to steal my sister's car a few days back.
Jammonius would interpret this as me saying I saw no one trying to steal my sister's car.
TJM
Potsing Whiled Runk
And Dick Oliver is under it.