Insane Clown Posse's song about 'Miracles' called worst song ever

[luchog]

So if people take your ideas and act like idiots with them, it is your fault, okay. Cool, i understand. I mean i always thought it was the persons fault for doing it, but i can dig the idea of the person who put out the idea being responsible.

And thank you for aggravating my straw allergy; your post is going to keep me sneezing for a week.

I'll say it again, since you seem to have been incapable of normal reading comprehension: If more people take your work seriously than recognize it as satire, you fail.

 

[dafydd]

Leonard Nimoy's Ballad of Bilbo Baggins

trust the Monkey

Not to mention The Shaggs.

 

[Robo Sapien]

No offense to anyone, but intellectually scrutinizing ICP is about as ridiculous as the band itself. Come on skeptics, you are better than this.

I hate ICP music, but I respect that they found a niche and ran with it. They did what they wanted instead of conforming to be more appealing to a label, and it worked for them. Juggalos may be idiots, but they account for a lot more fans than any of you critics have.

What's more, holding an artist responsible for the stupidity of others is contrary to the First Ammendment. The US Constitution > your opinion.

 

[Drudgewire]

What's more, holding an artist responsible for the stupidity of others is contrary to the First Ammendment. The US Constitution > your opinion.

So voicing an opinion runs contrary to the 1st Amendment?








Really?

 

[Robo Sapien]

So voicing an opinion runs contrary to the 1st Amendment?

You misunderstand. It is not the voicing of opinions, but the assertion that an artist is responsible for the actions of his/her fans. That kind of thinking leads to censorship. Remember the whole Dee Snyder fiasco?

 

[badnewsBH]

This writer has got to be from around here. The Tea Party are from LaSalle and the general consensus around here was that they sucked. They were playing big shows in Australia and couldn't fill a bar here. Jeff Martin went all rock star and started wearing puffy shirts. We'd see him at the gas station pumping gas in his moms cars and make fun of him. Sad thing is the Tea Party really did suck. When they started saying they were from Toronto we couldn't have been happier. Next time I see any of them I'll have to remember this article. I think with a couple phone calls we could actually book an ICP/Tea Party battle of the worst bands

I liked the Tea Party. I mean, they were quite hit and miss at times, but I've always thought The Edges of Twilight was a pretty good album; had a few tunes really worth listening to.

Anyway, I don't listen to rap at all, really, so ICP isn't my thing, but the "throwdown" with Eminem was definitely funny. As for worst song ever, well, there are too many candidates to select just one, I think. Don't be disrespecting Leonard, though; his version of Ruby is hawt.

 

[Drudgewire]

Remember the whole Dee Snyder fiasco?

Actually Snider was never a target. He just testified at the hearings like John Denver did.

 

[sadhatter]

If this song was supposed to be satire, the group failed fantastically. And if, as has been suggested, the public's misidentifying ICP songs that are supposed to be satire is an ongoing and consistent problem, obviously ICP needs to re-evaluate their music.

I would agree if icp were making music for the public, that would be an issue. But you might as well say the same thing of The sex pistols or the ramones. Icp is not all about having vast commercial success.

 

[Cavemonster]

You misunderstand. It is not the voicing of opinions, but the assertion that an artist is responsible for the actions of his/her fans. That kind of thinking leads to censorship. Remember the whole Dee Snyder fiasco?

Holding them legally responsible would be contrary to the first amendment, unless their message was a clear and unironic "Go kill Irish people right now".

But holding them partly causally responsible is just a true observation. If any action I take has X effect, and I can observe X effect over time, and have reason to believe that my continued action will continue X effect, then my continued action makes me at least knowledgably complicit in creating X effect.

 

[sadhatter]

If this song was supposed to be satire, the group failed fantastically. And if, as has been suggested, the public's misidentifying ICP songs that are supposed to be satire is an ongoing and consistent problem, obviously ICP needs to re-evaluate their music.

And as an addendum, listening to one icp song and going " this isn't satire" is equivalent to expecting to be able to tell "blazing saddles " is satire from the " the sherif is a N!" scene alone. Or from the " sing an N work song!" bit, soley. ( before the song the actually sing)

In all seriousness, any satire when chunked up small enough can seen legitimate, especially for those who are not familiar with the source.

 

[sadhatter]

And thank you for aggravating my straw allergy; your post is going to keep me sneezing for a week.

I'll say it again, since you seem to have been incapable of normal reading comprehension: If more people take your work seriously than recognize it as satire, you fail.

Or how many people understand it?

By that logic Andy Kaufman was a hack.


I would say that people not getting it is the person not getting it's fault. Especially when said people have listened to maybe 1, 2 maybe a max of 10 songs. And then claim that there is nothing to get.

I mean seriously would you get blazing saddles was satire if all i showed you was the scene in which the white guy demands the black workers to sing a " N work song"?

 

[Tatyana]

The part where you say " its crap" is where it ceases to become subjective.

I think it is crap.

I dislike them.

Their music, in my opinion is tripe.

Would all be acceptable, the phrase, simply " it's crap" denotes objectivity not subjectivity. As in it is crap, and music can then be classified into " crap" and " not crap" from an objective standpoint. Which is simply not the case.

[I think] its crap is implied.

Meh, semantics.

I THINK it is all just a diversion to avoid discussion how absolutely rubbish this band is, and how lucky they are that this crap song is actually giving them some media attention.

I call swan song.

 

[Robo Sapien]

Holding them legally responsible would be contrary to the first amendment, unless their message was a clear and unironic "Go kill Irish people right now".

But holding them partly causally responsible is just a true observation. If any action I take has X effect, and I can observe X effect over time, and have reason to believe that my continued action will continue X effect, then my continued action makes me at least knowledgably complicit in creating X effect.

That is a reasonable and ethical purview, but I still can't agree with that. Regardless of whether or not one acknowledges that their message of "kill irish people" invariably led do the death of the entire O'Malley clan, they are not complicit. As cold as it seems, I still support the artist's freedom of speech and expression. People are responsible for their own actions. Is this concept exploitable? Certainly. Religion has taught us this many times over.

 

[Cavemonster]

That is a reasonable and ethical purview, but I still can't agree with that. Regardless of whether or not one acknowledges that their message of "kill irish people" invariably led do the death of the entire O'Malley clan, they are not complicit. As cold as it seems, I still support the artist's freedom of speech and expression. People are responsible for their own actions. Is this concept exploitable? Certainly. Religion has taught us this many times over.

Then you disagree with the law, and believe that Charles Manson should be out of prison. He never killed anyone, he just told people to.

Obviously nothing ICP, or even any band I've ever heard of rises to the level of legal responsibility, and that's as it should be. But it does reach a practical responsibility. If a band tells people not to study science, with a reasonable expectation that many people will follow their command literally, then they have made a poor choice.

If a singer sends out a message that teenage girls should become anorexic to be beautiful with a reasonable expectation that this will be listened to and acted on, then that is again a very damaging choice.

 

[Furcifer]

Obviously nothing ICP, or even any band I've ever heard of rises to the level of legal responsibility, and that's as it should be. But it does reach a practical responsibility. If a band tells people not to study science, with a reasonable expectation that many people will follow their command literally, then they have made a poor choice.

If a singer sends out a message that teenage girls should become anorexic to be beautiful with a reasonable expectation that this will be listened to and acted on, then that is again a very damaging choice.

You agree there's a difference between the message of say "smacking my bitch up" than "science sucks" right? Especially tongue in cheek messages like this.

I think the practical responsibility is with the listener. A band can't ensure everyone is going to get what they are laying down. The listener can.

 

[Furcifer]

I honestly never thought I wold see an intellectual debate on the merits of ICP's lyrics in this forum.

 

[Cavemonster]

You agree there's a difference between the message of say "smacking my bitch up" than "science sucks" right? Especially tongue in cheek messages like this.

I think the practical responsibility is with the listener. A band can't ensure everyone is going to get what they are laying down. The listener can.

It's a shared practical responsibility.
Yes, a band can't be certain of or control the broader reaction. But to the extent that anyone is aware of the consequences their actions are likely to cause, then they choose those consequences, even if the more direct agents are more directly responsible and are idiots.

If I'm in a band, and I make a song advocating suicide with full knowledge that a significant portion of my fanbase takes me literally and someone will die, then I have participated in ending that life in an active way. I have made a decision, knowing the consequences.

If I walk into a biker bar and scream at the biggest guy there that I banged his mom, it is his action and decision of beating me that directly caused my pain, but I am also responsible because I initiated my act of speech with full knowledge of the likely consequences. I can't pretend I didn't know what the results of my speech would be, so getting beat up would be largely my own damned fault.

 

[rustypouch]

It still amuses me immensely that people take ICP seriously.

One of the worst groups ever.

 

[Furcifer]

It's a shared practical responsibility.
Yes, a band can't be certain of or control the broader reaction. But to the extent that anyone is aware of the consequences their actions are likely to cause, then they choose those consequences, even if the more direct agents are more directly responsible and are idiots.

If I'm in a band, and I make a song advocating suicide with full knowledge that a significant portion of my fanbase takes me literally and someone will die, then I have participated in ending that life in an active way. I have made a decision, knowing the consequences.

If I walk into a biker bar and scream at the biggest guy there that I banged his mom, it is his action and decision of beating me that directly caused my pain, but I am also responsible because I initiated my act of speech with full knowledge of the likely consequences. I can't pretend I didn't know what the results of my speech would be, so getting beat up would be largely my own damned fault.

I guess so. You'd have to live in a vacuum to not know somebody might take something you do or say the wrong way.

You use the biker bar example because you know exactly what to expect from your intended audience. That caveat can't be said about producing and selling music. To make the examples equivalent you'd have to produce a biker bar album and sell only to biker bars. Or a mental hospital album for sale only in mental hospitals.

Hard to prove any intention with an album, walking into a biker bar has intent written all over it.

 

[Furcifer]

It still amuses me immensely that people take ICP seriously.

One of the worst groups ever.

Come on I can name 50 untalented hacks that suck worse.

Brittany Spears comes to mind.

You like Brittany Spears better than ICP? (Holy loaded question careful how you answer this, I don't have a tag line right now )

Oh, and no "She's a solo act" semantics either