Congratulations to my fellow Democrats

[WildCat]

You are wrong. The CBO does not assume that. The CBO estimates that the bill will result in about $500 billion reduction in Medicare expenditures over the next 10 years.

It is not something assumed. It is the calculated estimate of the effect of this bill. (The category is actually provisions not related to health insurance coverage, which is mostly related to Medicare.)

In other words, this is what the CBO thinks the effect of the bill will be over ten years on spending in this category (mostly Medicare) compared to the spending on this category if the bill hadn't passed.

From the CBO report:

They can say whatever they'd like. But reality is reality. Former CBO director Douglas Holtz-Eakin writes about the gimmickry in today's New York Times:

Could this really be true? How can the budget office give a green light to a bill that commits the federal government to spending nearly $1 trillion more over the next 10 years?

The answer, unfortunately, is that the budget office is required to take written legislation at face value and not second-guess the plausibility of what it is handed. So fantasy in, fantasy out.

In reality, if you strip out all the gimmicks and budgetary games and rework the calculus, a wholly different picture emerges: The health care reform legislation would raise, not lower, federal deficits, by $562 billion.

 

[Sword_Of_Truth]

Yep. People are going to expect the government to provide more basic services to keep their people alive. But don't worry too much. England is still there. So is Canada. Even Costa Rica, Rush Limbaugh's personal escape from socialized health care. You'll survive.

So what would you cut, if you were president, to eliminate the deficit and pay down the debt? And when would you start?

 

[Tricky]

So what would you cut, if you were president, to eliminate the deficit and pay down the debt? And when would you start?

Farm subsidies would be a start. Probably some military stuff too. But I have to admit, I'd also raise taxes. We have a great country here. But having a great country is expensive. It's pay as you go.

 

[Sword_Of_Truth]

Farm subsidies would be a start. Probably some military stuff too. But I have to admit, I'd also raise taxes. We have a great country here. But having a great country is expensive. It's pay as you go.

Think harder.

The baby boomers are retiring soon. Social Security is about to explode and you're already 1.4 trillion dollars behind.

 

[KoihimeNakamura]

Wildcat: You mean, when you start _editing what the bill_ does. No.. no thanks.

 

[Undesired Walrus]

Yep. People are going to expect the government to provide more basic services to keep their people alive. But don't worry too much. England is still there. So is Canada. Even Costa Rica, Rush Limbaugh's personal escape from socialized health care. You'll survive.

Cough.. Remember, there are other countries bordering said country that have the NHS. It's also worth keeping in mind that an English person regards themselves as British first, English second.

 

[Sword_Of_Truth]

Pressure is already building for Obama to abandon the empty promise he made for Stupaks soul vote.

Which Obama will probably do without so much as a hiccup.

 

[dafydd]

So you assert the USA is not a 1st world country? Do 1st world countries have universal health care?

All of them I think,apart from the USA.

 

[Sword_Of_Truth]

Who wants to stand up and admit that they believe people should be put down like dogs? Other than Rush.

Who is willing to admit they are willing to risk complete economic collapse for a few years of "free" health care?

 

[DC]

Who is willing to admit they are willing to risk complete economic collapse for a few years of "free" health care?

so you prefer letting people die just to prevent economic problems?

isnt there any other places you could save money?

 

[WildCat]

so you prefer letting people die just to prevent economic problems?

isnt there any other places you could save money?

Problem is we're paying for a BMW and getting a Yugo with racing stripes.

 

[BenBurch]

Problem is we're paying for a BMW and getting a Yugo with racing stripes.

But that was true under the present system as well...

This is not the health reform I wanted, but I think overall it will help. It might need some considerable fine-tuning as it plays out, so expect dozens of amendatory bills in the next couple of years.

For one thing and one thing only this is going to help people; preventing insurance companies from dropping you like a stone the moment you get sick, and preventing them from looking 30 years into your past for something that might vaguely be a "pre-existing condition" to use to deny you coverage.

But I agree, this is a welfare bill for insurance companies, and I don't think they need the help.

 

[WildCat]

But I agree, this is a welfare bill for insurance companies, and I don't think they need the help.

Yes, instead we should be passing a welfare bill for public employee unions, who need all the help they can get. Let's put them all on unfunded pension plans while we're at it. I'm sure our grandchildren will figure out how to pay for it all.

The important thing is to screw insurance companies and their huge 3.5% profit margins...

 

[ZirconBlue]

The Republicans want people to die? Is this really how intellectually vapid your argument is?

Oh, I'm sure most of them don't want people to die. They're just indifferent toward the deaths. That's what happens when you let idealogy trump reality.

Problem is we're paying for a BMW and getting a Yugo with racing stripes.

I'll take the Yugo over the ill-fitting, second-hand walking shoes we have now.

 

[Dave Rogers]

Problem is we're paying for a BMW and getting a Yugo with racing stripes.

But up till now it seems you've been paying for a BMW and quite often getting nothing.

Dave

 

[WildCat]

But up till now it seems you've been paying for a BMW and quite often getting nothing.

Dave

And nothing in this bill changes that. If you're a single person making $35,000 per year you still won't be able to afford health insurance, nor will you qualify for any subsidies. In fact, you won't even be paying a tax penalty for not having insurance.

Do not confuse this with a universal health care bill, because it's not.

 

[Thunder]

And nothing in this bill changes that. If you're a single person making $35,000 per year you still won't be able to afford health insurance, nor will you qualify for any subsidies.

i believe this is incorrect.

 

[WildCat]

i believe this is incorrect.

How is it incorrect?

 

[Loss Leader]

Who is willing to admit they are willing to risk complete economic collapse for a few years of "free" health care?

We have a responsibility to each other. This bill comes closer to fulfilling that responsibility than at any other time in US history. That's what matters.

 

[Shalamar]

So, I wake up this morning, and read the paper. The Bill was passed. Good, I suppose.

Eat my Breakfast, get ready for work. I notice that people are still going to work as usual. There doesn't seem to be more red around.

At work, I check in. People aren't saying 'Comrade' to each other, the company does not appear to be run by the government. In fact, I am seeing a complete lack of government controlled businesses.

I guess the cries of 'COMMUNISM!' are unfounded.