And now Part Two of Part Two - Talking With Bob Heironimus Part Two:
This is continuing on from the point in the conversation where I asked Bob about the rumour that he went to Gimlin telling him that he was going to confess, asking Gimlin to do the same, to which Gimlin refused, saying he had been lying about it too long and had to stay safe...
At this point I really wanted to get a better sense of what the relationship was between Heiroinimus and Gimlin. It had really preoccupied my imagination thinking about the bizarre state of the PGF controversy where the two principle people remaining, Bob and Bob, lived on the exact same street nine doors apart, as they had since before the film was shot in October, 1967. I asked Bob, "Bob, one thing that I really wanted to ask you about is your relationship with Gimlin. I'm talking about over the years and now, also. How has it been between you two?"
"Oh, you know," Bob answered, "We see each other all the time. I just saw him 'bout two weeks ago at a horse sale." "Yeah, I remember you mentioned that last time." "We didn't talk anything about Bigfoot or whatever, though." I jumped in, "Now, can you tell me when you did last discuss anything about the film?" "Discuss what?" he asked. "I said 'when was the last time you did discuss the film?'" "Oh jeez, I can't really remember. It's been so many years, you see. I'm getting kinda old, you know, and it gets all mixed up in there."
"Of course," I answered, "I understand so much of it must be hard to recall. So you don't remember exactly the last time you discussed the film with Gimlin." "Not exactly, no. It was a few years ago, I think." Even that helped me understand better. I was getting the picture in the years since Greg Long's
The Making of Bigfoot had been published, that things had mellowed between the two men on South 90th. "So how has it been between the two of you over the years, you know, since the movie?" I asked. "Well, it was a bit rough there for a while just after that book came out. I know he was not too happy with me, but you know, Bob, he's kind of a small little fella. I wasn't too worried about it." I found that to be hilarious, the way Bob was talking. I was imagining Gimlin marching out of his house and storming down the street to Heironimus' house, nostrils flared, violence on his mind, pounding on Heironimus' door and jumping on him like a crazed wolverine when Heironimus opened up.
I turned my thoughts back to the situation. "But you guys did remain friends, right?" "Oh yeah, we still saw each other all the time. I mean, it's hard not to, being right there and all. We always see each other out on the road there when he's coming down. We talk on the street." "I see," I said. There was the reality. These two older men in that tiny town removed from the world that ceaselessly went on and on debating the film on their computers. They were there in Yakima removed from the world, and removed in their age and lifestyle from the people at their PC's discussing the film day in and day out. I knew Heironimus was, anyway. He had told me before when I asked him if he uses email "No, not really," and neither had he ever heard of youtube. I knew they had a computer, though, because Bob's wife, Glenda, had recently found the email I had sent her last year. Bob Gimlin, I thought possibly to be a different story. I knew from a recent interview that he had seen the Mike Greene thermal video that somebody had sent him. I knew also the Bigfoot enthusiasts who organized the "Yakima Round-Up" in honour of Bob were also in regular contact with him. That interview seemed to indicate that Bob followed developements regarding the film on the Internet. It can be heard here...
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/mnbrt/2010/02/13/mnbrt-radio-with-bob-gimlin
I changed topics from Bob's relationship with Gimlin to something else I had wanted to know. "So, another thing I was wondering about, Bob, was if you've, you know, faced any kind of hostility towards you over the film there in Yakima or anywhere else since you came out with your confession." "How do you mean?" he asked. "I mean like, from people who thought the film was real, like, supporters being hostile to you." "Uh huh, I see. No. Not to my face anyway. They don't have the guts. I'd pop 'em in the nose if they did. On the radio show some people call in callin' me a liar. Didn't bother me none. They wanna keep believin', they can go to hell. I don't care. I was there." "Yeah," I replied. "Too bad for them. It's amazing what some people will hold on to. You should see the people I deal with day to day. Total fanatics. Doodling on stills from the film, saying it couldn't be you. Your elbows couldn't fit. Blah blah blah. It get's pretty mind-numbing after a while."
Crap! Here we go! I thought. It was time to start asking Bob about the suit. I did a scramble to look at my notes and the questions I had neatly written out... and then scribbled little jotted notes all over as ideas and questions had come to me. Damn it! I could hardly read what I wrote and had gotten too into my conversation to keep focused on the notepad. I dropped it and decided to wing it. "So, anyway, I had some things wanted to ask you about the suit, if you don't mind." "Sure," he answered. "Tell me about the suit. Like, did it have any padding inside it or was that all just you?" "Oh yeah, it had a lotta padding in it. Had these great big shoulder pads in it. They went around me. You know, like football padding." "Right," I said, trying to keep calm. I thought of the 1951 Yakima High School photo of Roger Patterson's football team. I was pumped! This is exactly what I was after. I was floored. I had been wondering about this for years. The only thing I had known Bob had said about padding was that the head had padding like an oldtime football helmet. Most of all I was excited that he had spoken about shoulder pads first without me leading him in any kind of way. Bob went on, "And there was padding in the head. Like a helmet type of thing. Bunch up at the top. And there was a great big bunch of padding in the butt. I don't know if you've seen that." I was laughing on the inside. I had seen the miserable diaper butt more times than Bob would ever care to know. "Yeah, I have. It looks pretty bad. There's no butt crack!" I quipped. Bob started laughing. "The legs felt kind of like hip boots, you know? And you can see my wallet! Forgot to take my wallet out." He laughed again.
That wallet thing, I thought to myself. That was something I had heard before. Right under what was a completely unreal folding crease on Patty's leg there was a bulge that had been famously called by Bigfooters as a hernia on Patty's leg. I thought of the argument that the bulge could not possibly be Bob's wallet because it was too low on the leg. "So which pocket was the wallet in?" I asked. "My side pocket,' he replied. "Yeah, the Bigfooters call that a hernia." Bob started chuckling. I decided it was time for a different question. "So there's this thing that people talk about. About you saying the suit stunk. Like it had an odour. What can you tell me about that? What kind of odour was it?" "Well, you see it was the face. Roger had altered the face. He made it of horsehide, I think he said, which can stink. It was right in my face. And they said something about the suit being made out of dynel, which they say can have an odour, too." This was amazing, I thought. This completely altered everything we had been discussing about the point of the suit having an odour. I had to be clear. "So the whole suit was horsehide or it was just the face?" "Just the face, I think," he replied. A different thought occurred to me then. "So inside the suit, there wasn't anything like an inner layer, like a muscle suit or padding?" "No, just the shoulders, the head, and the butt. I was in pretty good shape back then." Fantastic, I thought to myself.
I looked at the clock and realized that it was getting close to dinnertime. I had other important questions I wanted to ask Bob about the suit, but I knew I would be able to speak with Bob anytime. I remembered the rumour about Pat Patterson hiring an attorney to reveal the PGF as a hoax and how it was done upon her passing. I explained the rumour to Bob, that it was said to have come from Tom Biscardi and asked if he had ever heard any such thing. "No," he said. "I hadn't heard anything like that." This was before the call I made to Biscardi right after my conversation with Bob, in which Tom confirmed the rumour as being false. We continued chatting. Bob then asked me, "Did you know that National Geographic came out here?" "Yes," I said. "The
Is It real? show." "Yeah, they screwed me!" Bob exclaimed. "They showed the one thing we asked them not to show. Us havin' fun and making some faces just sittin' around at the bar. The dog hiding under the chair and all that. We were just jokin' around. They filmed a bunch of stuff. They filmed me in a suit. Had me do the walk. Had me riding up in the mountains. They didn't show any of that. Just the part I asked them to leave out and they promised they would. They made the whole thing look like a joke." I thought that was very interesting.
Bob and I continued chatting about various things. I asked him about his '55 Chevy and how that was doing. I asked him if he could still ride horses and he said that he couldn't since he had his hip replaced. "I like to get out and go bowling in the evenings. Get some strikes there. Gonna get back to it slowly. I'll ride again. Probably take a couple years." I asked Bob about his mother after remembering that Lucas had mentioned she was ill. "She's doing great," he said. "She's just turned ninety, you know. Yep, she's moving around on her own. She still drives herself. She was a little sick for a bit but she's doing much better now." "That's great," I said. "I'm so glad to hear that."
We continued chatting and Bob brought up the Bigfoot documentary featuring Vancouver Island he had watched that day. Bob, it turned out was a complete skeptic about Bigfoot. "They never find nuthin'. No hair, no bones, no scat, no bodies. And people keep saying they seen one everywhere." "No kidding!" I said. "Everywhere. You name it. Florida, Iowa, Texas, Alaska." Bob continued, "They're not real. They woulda been found by now. No way." Bob then said it was getting about time for dinner and I thanked Bob kindly for the time he spent talking to me. I told him I'll keep working on my project and be in touch with him regularly. We said goodbye and hung up. I was elated. I had accomplished everything I had set out to do in that phone call and opened the door to a relationship of trust with Bob. He had told me things that would change much of what we discussed concerning the PGF. Now things were really moving, I thought to myself.
So there it is. I apologize for the delay, but it takes quite a bit of time for me to get everything down. My next phone call to Bob I'll be introducing myself to his wife, Glenda, and be asking her about when she had first been told about Bob being the man in the Bigfoot film. I would love to talk with his mother, Opal, also, who said she saw the suit. She is 90, however, and I can't expect to much. Everyone feel free to continue offering questions for me to ask Bob. As Bob and I get more familiar with each other I will start to ask him more difficult questions, such as the discrepancy of the suit he described, and that described by Philip Morris. I have many plans regarding myself and Bob and will keep everybody updated as things progress.
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