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Evidence for why we know the New Testament writers told the truth.

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Simon39759 said:
Last night, I went ahead and translated these passages 75 times in a row. Each time I used the word 'slave' rather than servant.
So now, you see, your argument is moot (well, it always was).

It matters not what the numbers of translation are, especially when many Biblical translations are known to be terribly innacurate (King James, for example).
What matters is the real expert opinion born out of modern, serious scholarship. And it does, quite clearly, translate the word dolous as meaning slave (the first two links are a rather interesting article, too bad Doc will never read it).


These translations is not perfect, mostly, because slavery was a different institution back then that it was in modern times: it was not race-based, and it could be temporary and the slaves tended to be better treated back then.
But still, on a crucial feature, being the property on another being, the word slave is more accurate.
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Ultimately, irregardless of the slave vs servant argument (I side with the slave translation), Jesus advocated beating a subordinate for not knowing the rules/job and then failing to perform adequately.

That's like me coming back to work from a vacation and beating (not just firing, but whipping) one of my subordinates because he didn't balance the books even though I'd never told him to do so, nor where any of the paperwork he'd need was located, nor even trained him how to do it properly. Who's fault is it really that the task wasn't performed? The worker who not only didn't know how to do the task but wasn't even aware the specific task needed to be performed or mine for not making sure my subordinate knew what to do and how to do it?
 
BobTheDonkey said:
Ultimately, irregardless of the slave vs servant argument (I side with the slave translation), Jesus advocated beating a subordinate for not knowing the rules/job and then failing to perform adequately.

That's like me coming back to work from a vacation and beating (not just firing, but whipping) one of my subordinates because he didn't balance the books even though I'd never told him to do so, nor where any of the paperwork he'd need was located, nor even trained him how to do it properly. Who's fault is it really that the task wasn't performed? The worker who not only didn't know how to do the task but wasn't even aware the specific task needed to be performed or mine for not making sure my subordinate knew what to do and how to do it?
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Thank you for stating quite clearly my argument. I may stealuse your example in the future.
 
I haven't been back to this thread for a few days, and it seems to have grown a couple of extra pages. Any evidence for why we know the New Testament writers told the truth yet?
 
Mojo said:
I haven't been back to this thread for a few days, and it seems to have grown a couple of extra pages. Any evidence for why we know the New Testament writers told the truth yet?
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You must be kidding..............

Paul

:) :) :)
 
Mojo said:
I haven't been back to this thread for a few days, and it seems to have grown a couple of extra pages. Any evidence for why we know the New Testament writers told the truth yet?
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I think we had some three pages pack. Hold onna sec, lemme go look.


Nope, someone just spilled a bit of BBQ sauce on the page, my bad.
 
DOC said:
No I don't. And show me in the bible where it says Jesus was nailed in his forearms.
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Whomever wrote that tale had no idea or any medical knowledge. If Christ was nailed through the palms, his weight would very soon cause the palms to rip through the nails. It was through the wrists or not at all.
 
Mojo said:
I haven't been back to this thread for a few days, and it seems to have grown a couple of extra pages. Any evidence for why we know the New Testament writers told the truth yet?
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Are you seeking evidence that the new testament writers told the truth? Very sorry to inform you. But this is not the place to find such information.
Why not seek it in the babble? :p
 
joobz said:
servants were almost always slaves during biblical times. It is you who must prove that Jesus didn't mean slave when "dolous" was used.
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A source would be nice regarding Palestine.
 
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Mojo said:
I haven't been back to this thread for a few days, and it seems to have grown a couple of extra pages. Any evidence for why we know the New Testament writers told the truth yet?
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Post 7667
 
DOC said:
They're wrong on that specific point because it's not in the bible that Jesus was nailed specifically in the forearms.
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Then why did you bring in that reference if it didn't support you?

DOC said:
Let me talk a little about my comment regarding the crucifixion, prophecy, and the OT.

Psalm 22 has been called the Crucifixion Psalm because many Christians believe it is prophesying about the crucifixion of Christ. I would recommend people to read the whole psalm and the following website but here are some of the main points in the article.

From the Moorings Website: The Crucifixion of Christ
Lesson 2: Psalm 22 as Prophecy

"* "They pierced my hands and my feet." Could there be clearer proof that the psalm describes a crucifixion? In what other mode of execution does the victim suffer a piercing of his hands and feet? Earlier, we showed that Jesus was held to the cross by three nails, one through each forearm and one through both heels.
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zooterkin said:
I think you're a bit off on this one. Without checking when exactly these alleged prophecies were made, they were certainly before Rome had conquered the Jews, so how would they guess that Roman punishments for treason (even if they were current at the time of the prophecy) would ever apply to the Messiah?
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have a look at this list
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_messiah_claimants#Jewish_messiah_claimants

Apart from David and Cyrus (who weren't crucified) all the possible claimants for the Messiah post date the Roman form of execution. Its a bit daft to think that they were prophecising that the Messiah would die by crucifixion and then one at a time saying
"hey look its the messiah, no wait he wasn't crucified" over and over again until finally one of the candidates actually is crucified. Thats not a prophecy, its a certainty. The only one of these who is actually qualified in the eyes of the Jews as a great military leader who would free them from opression was Cyrus, who died in battle (or in one account peacefully in bed)
;)
 
BobTheDonkey said:
Ultimately, irregardless of the slave vs servant argument (I side with the slave translation), Jesus advocated beating a subordinate for not knowing the rules/job and then failing to perform adequately.
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Actually Jesus said the servant who didn't know beating several other servants was wrong would receive a lesser punishment than the servant who did know it was wrong. This would be like someone as a youth who doesn't know it is wrong to beat up someone who laughs at him when he trips. He will not be punished as much as someone who knows that beating up the guy is wrong but still does it.
 
zooterkin said:
Then why did you bring in that reference if it didn't support you?
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Maybe the guy made a mistake on that one point. It is possible to be right about one thing and wrong or make a mistake about something else. Einstein was wrong to think the universe just always existed but not many people hold it against him.
 
Marduk said:
have a look at this list
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_messiah_claimants#Jewish_messiah_claimants

Apart from David and Cyrus (who weren't crucified) all the possible claimants for the Messiah post date the Roman form of execution. Its a bit daft to think that they were prophecising that the Messiah would die by crucifixion and then one at a time saying
"hey look its the messiah, no wait he wasn't crucified" over and over again until finally one of the candidates actually is crucified. Thats not a prophecy, its a certainty. The only one of these who is actually qualified in the eyes of the Jews as a great military leader who would free them from opression was Cyrus, who died in battle (or in one account peacefully in bed)
;)
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I'm not sure how that's relevant to the point I was making. You were saying it wouldn't be hard for the prophets to guess at the means of execution the Romans would use; I was pointing that at the time the prophecies were made, it would not have been clear that the Romans would have been involved at all (unless they were genuine prophets, after all :) ).
 
Doc, the bible was used in the USA for many years as proof that slavery was condoned by God himself. As did the white regime in South Africa.
Where can you quote and from what bible passage that slavery was ever condemned anywhere in the bible.
 
DOC said:
A source would be nice regarding Palestine.
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I have absolutely no clue what you are asking me for.
If you believe the area of Rome/Judea (where the Jesus story was supposedly from) didn't commonly use slaves, then present the information.
THat's your claim, not mine.
 
DOC said:
Maybe the guy made a mistake on that one point. It is possible to be right about one thing and wrong or make a mistake about something else.
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exactly! You do realize that this is proof that you are being fully dishonest when making the Ramsay quote. Luke being right about some facts has no bearing on the accuracy about magical elements in the bible. Even Ramsay said as much.

So, why do you lie instead of present evidence? Isn't it sad that the best you can do to support your religion is to lie through your teeth about it?
 
DOC said:
Maybe the guy made a mistake on that one point. It is possible to be right about one thing and wrong or make a mistake about something else. Einstein was wrong to think the universe just always existed but not many people hold it against him.
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So. Not only do you not read anything that anyone else posts - the evidence for this being your continued use of failed, tired, stale and utterly discredited arguments (who gives a hairy camel's cock what the **** Sir William Ramsey thought about Luke???) - but you also fail to read what you post.

I think that this shows a complete lack of sincerity on your part. You don't even have the respect for others to actually look at what you post, but just copy anything that supports the particular argument that you might be making at the time.

We're nearing 10,000 posts on this car crash of a thread. Still there hasn't been any evidence to support the original post. Could you please, please, please post some evidence. And don't even ****ing think of responding by listing any of your previous evidence free posts.
 
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