911 Truth as the Idolization of Insanity

[Scott Sommers]

Back when my dad was a young man, in the 1940s and 50s, the cutting edge image of rebellion was the deliquent. So we got a whole slew of 'cool' movies with the cool protaganist as some sort of 'rebel'. We didn't know what they were rebelling against, but then even they admitted that they were 'without a cause'.

So my dad grew up with this idea of cool. He bought a leather jacket and an Indian motorcycle. But all that was a long time ago. He got married, had a family, and the only thing left of this is memories and few photos.

By the time my brothers and I were growing up, the cutting edge of cool was the criminal, particularly the drug dealer. I grew up watching movies where the coolest characters were drug dealers and vice cops.

We did all kinds of rebelious things in this image. I have smoked dope and I inhaled. I never touch cigarettes and think smoking them is disgusting. But growing up on the West Coast, the image of drugs and cool was pretty strong.

And now, the folks of the 911 Truth Movement tell us that the cutting edge of rebellion is not a drug dealer, no, no. Now, it's a guy who doesn't do anything dangerous. He has no formal education in anything. He has no formal education in anything. No, no...now, he is a self-taught video expert or someone who has done 'his own research'. And he can say anything now. something so dellusional that only the insane would have said it. It's the kind of thing we used to hear only in a SciFi movies or some wierd book about robots or something. And now there's a bunch of guys telling us this is real.

But they're not insane. I've talked with many of them and they're clearly not hallucinating. I can only think that it's the same thing that happened with the generations of people in my family. There's this image of cool they've got. The long haired hip music producer, friend to the stars, self-taught video editor, and he's out there pushing the envelope. You can't tell the difference between what he says and what the schizophrenics who are so sick they're still looking for medications that can help, but it's all cool now.

I know there are some people in the TM who should be and probably are being medicated. But there are people posting here and other places. They're not insane. Why would they think it's so cool to play at being insane?

 

[Orphia Nay]

"Idolisation of Insanity"... I think you might be right. Most are not insane, but the theories are. Most don't take the theories to their "logical" conclusion and they don't believe they are being watched/mind controlled by the NWO, but we've seen those that do do that. DJLegacy, a former LC Forum mod comes to mind. Last I heard of him he was posting at a mind control / implant forum. Christophera just posted that "agents" follow him around the net.

 

[Scott Sommers]

I suspect there is a fair share of the truely insane hanging around 911 Truth. We here at JREF may even know some of them. I just can't understand why a well-adjusted teenager from a loving home would idolize ideas that only the insane could genuinely take seriously. I'm 47 and I suggested to my equally old friend this may be part of the 'generation gap' from my age. I though it was fun pretending I was criminal and cool. Perhaps those hanging around with 911 Truth feel it's fun pretending to be insane and cool.

 

[Liszt]

Is this your professional opinion?

Don't give up the day job. Damned pop psychologists. I suppose we should be thankful that you don't pretend to be a surgeon.

 

[Scott Sommers]

Funny thing, my day job is publishing stuff like this.

Damn Truthers, dress them up and still manage to spill ketchup all over themselves.

 

[Liszt]

Funny thing, my day job is publishing stuff like this.

Damn Truthers, dress them up and still manage to spill ketchup all over themselves.

Who? I'm not a truther. But I am qualified in psychology. You should try looking up "delusional" in the DSMIV. But you don't know what that is, do you?

And what is the "dressing up" analogy about? Get some sleep.

Also, if your day job is to publish stuff like this, I suggest you go and retrain. You are not a talented analyst.

 

[Scott Sommers]

Who? I'm not a truther. But I am qualified in psychology. You should try looking up "delusional" in the DSMIV. But you don't know what that is, do you?

And what is the "dressing up" analogy about? Get some sleep.

Also, if your day job is to publish stuff like this, I suggest you go and retrain. You are not a talented analyst.

You are "qualified" in psychology are you. That's great. Then you should know there other ways of talking about delusion and preference than the DSMIV. Or is what you really mean to say that Psychologists own these words now you have the DSM?

 

[Liszt]

Also, at 47, you are too old to be using the word "dude".

 

[cyclonic]

Also, at 47, you are too old to be using the word "dude".

There is no age limit on being cool,dude.
Chiill out,don't have a cow!

 

[defaultdotxbe]

And now, the folks of the 911 Truth Movement tell us that the cutting edge of rebellion is not a drug dealer, no, no. Now, it's a guy who doesn't do anything dangerous.

i have to disagree, the modern "cool" is the righteous rebel, Neo, V (as in "for Vendetta") and others who seek to "bring down the system"

the truthers of course, and many others, are wholly ineffectual at this, but any generation has their posers, and the posers tend to be the loudest ones, the internet just gives them a bigger bullhorn

 

[Scott Sommers]

i have to disagree, the modern "cool" is the righteous rebel, Neo, V (as in "for Vendetta") and others who seek to "bring down the system"

the truthers of course, and many others, are wholly ineffectual at this, but any generation has their posers, and the posers tend to be the loudest ones, the internet just gives them a bigger bullhorn

This is a good point and I don't disagree with you. My interest here is the imagery that they have adopted to handle this. Why on Earth would they want to appear as thought they are crazy - Liszt, is that a better word? why would anyone assume that the stigma of being labeled as crazy, and rebellious or criminial, would make one cool or interesting or worth listening to?

 

[Tricky]

A number of uncivil and off-topic threads have been infracted and/or split to AAH. Please address the issue, not each other.

Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: Tricky

 

[Thunder]

i think truthers just enjoy sticking it to "the man".

 

[Walter Ego]

Meanwhile Back On Topic...

Speaking as a layman not trained in psychology (note to Liszt: you are on ignore), I would not say the truthers are idolizing insanity at least not in the clinical sense of the word.

When most people use words like "insane," "nuts" or "crazy," they are not referencing mental illness per se but bizarre or outlandish beliefs or ideas or behavior that "sane" or intelligent people would not entertain.

The more "nutty" members of the TM like Jim Fetzer, Judy Woods, et al , are in fact marginalized by the TM at large.

A few truthers like Sean Fitzgerald (pictured below at his arrangement for murdering his father) have slipped into psychosis. The "paranoia" (again in the non-clinical sense of the word) associated with the TM probably didn't cause his psychosis but it didn't help either.

Listen to this telephone interview Fitzgerald gave to a fellow (and sympathetic) truther from his hospital bed where he was recovering from an accident "caused" (in his mind) by being chased by the police in Thailand.

 

[DGM]

i think truthers just enjoy sticking it to "the man".

By "the man" you mean anyone on the internet that looks for them and doesn't hold the same view. Outside of that, not so much.

 

[alexi_drago]

We did all kinds of rebelious things in this image. I have smoked dope and I inhaled. I never touch cigarettes and think smoking them is disgusting. But growing up on the West Coast, the image of drugs and cool was pretty strong[/quotee]

Perhaps it's all relative but I never thought of dope as being rebellious, more just as a safer and more pleasant alternative to alcohol.

 

[defaultdotxbe]

This is a good point and I don't disagree with you. My interest here is the imagery that they have adopted to handle this. Why on Earth would they want to appear as thought they are crazy - Liszt, is that a better word? why would anyone assume that the stigma of being labeled as crazy, and rebellious or criminial, would make one cool or interesting or worth listening to?

well imagine if ther was a scene in the Matrix where Neo goes around telling everyone they are batteries in some giant robot, he would come off as crazy but in the context of the movie hes right, truthers see themselves this way too, it sounds crazy but its true

also im sure many of them are simply oblivious to how nutty their theories sound to others, or like killtown seem to think the crazier the theory the better it supports their case, like his big faces in the smoke rant

 

[Thunder]

well imagine if ther was a scene in the Matrix where Neo goes around telling everyone they are batteries in some giant robot, he would come off as crazy but in the context of the movie hes right, truthers see themselves this way too, it sounds crazy but its true

and just as in the Matrix, everyone who is not unplugged, can be taken over by the agents and therefore must be treated like a possible evil Agent Smith.

 

[dudalb]

Let's put aside whether the truthers themselves are delusional/insane or not; it's enough to show that the Truther theories on 9/11 are ,by any defination that relies on facts and logic, batcrap crazy.

 

[Scott Sommers]

well imagine if ther was a scene in the Matrix where Neo goes around telling everyone they are batteries in some giant robot, he would come off as crazy but in the context of the movie hes right, truthers see themselves this way too, it sounds crazy but its true

also im sure many of them are simply oblivious to how nutty their theories sound to others, or like killtown seem to think the crazier the theory the better it supports their case, like his big faces in the smoke rant

So the idea being expressed is that the crazier the idea that's true, the better it is? I guess I can understand this. Is this because the insanity of the idea is being confused with complexity?