Naturopath Education vs Med School

[WitchyWoman]

Thank you for your opinion.

 

[paximperium]

Naturopathy is not medicine because it IS based on opinion and anecdotes. There is little to no evidence to support any of their claims except for say-so. They do things backwards, they make a claim and then work backwards to try to support their claims. Even then, it does not matter since most of their claims do not rely on evidence or research.

I don't get what's so attractive about someone using pure "opinion" as their entire basis of treating a disease.

 

[WitchyWoman]

If you say-so Paxiperium. Your opinion MUST be right.

 

[paximperium]

If you say-so Paxiperium.

So that's all you have left? An 8 years old temper tantrum?

Your opinion MUST be right.

Actually it isn't. My "opinion" is based on facts.
Naturopathy is based on anecdotes and unevidenced based claims. Any objective research done shows that it does not work or not very well at all. There is evidence that it is harmful. There is evidence that "true-believers" will never change their minds no matter how many people are killed or harmed by their beliefs.

 

[JenseitsDavon]

Given that your entire argument seems to consist of "Naturopathy are great! You iz silly if you thinks otherwise!", I think I'm going to agree with you and say that yes, Pax is right. Pax wins, everybody, end of thread. Next!

 

[Estellea]

Several other same observations? Exactly where do they come from? And who statistically validated them? Because if it was done by your evidence based labs, it would then be proven without a doubt, right??!!

Have you ever read medical/scientific literature? Do you understand how epidemiology and statistics work?

Actually if you re-read the posts you will realize FLS was refuting my statement. Prove I'm wrong then.

I don't think you grasp the nuances of debating.

 

[WitchyWoman]

Not a temper tantrum at all. Just allowing you to believe what you will.

There is evidence that "true-believers" will never change their minds no matter how many people are killed or harmed by their beliefs.

Oddly, the same can be said of pharmaceuticals.

Naturopathy is based on anecdotes and unevidenced based claims. Any objective research done shows that it does not work or not very well at all.

Using the herbs I already posted, which never got a comment. Please show how this is a true statement. Actually please source proof that herbs do not work and while you're at it please explain why the medical establishment then uses them....IF they do not work.

 

[WitchyWoman]

Have you ever read medical/scientific literature? Do you understand how epidemiology and statistics work?

I'm going to follow suit. Do you always answer a question with a question?

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

This is timely:

http://scienceblogs.com/whitecoatun...epage&utm_medium=link&utm_content=channellink

As a nurse practitioner I also did not participate in a residency to better my skills, but my prescriptive authority is overseen by the state pharmacy board, not just the nursing board.

I did know, however, the minute I read the case history that drug induced cough was on the dif. And that is not my area of practice.

 

[quarky]

Not a temper tantrum at all. Just allowing you to believe what you will.



Oddly, the same can be said of pharmaceuticals.



Using the herbs I already posted, which never got a comment. Please show how this is a true statement. Actually please source proof that herbs do not work and while you're at it please explain why the medical establishment then uses them....IF they do not work.

Perhaps the confusion is the herbs. No one involved in modern medicine would dispute the point that many useful medicines are derived from plants.
Morphine is a good example.

The old wives tales tend to get weeded out along the way, thankfully, which is why we don't do much blood-letting, or take rhino-horn instead of viagra.

 

[paximperium]

Not a temper tantrum at all. Just allowing you to believe what you will.

Then you're here for...what again? Trolling?

Oddly, the same can be said of pharmaceuticals.

No it cannot. Many drugs have been supplanted due to better drugs, withdrawn due to safety issues and are all supported by evidence.

Using the herbs I already posted, which never got a comment. Please show how this is a true statement. Actually please source proof that herbs do not work and while you're at it please explain why the medical establishment then uses them....IF they do not work.

Ahhh, so you mean REAL medicines that have been shown to work by science. Sorry, I meant the "naturopathic" stuff still being used by naturopaths.

So your evidence of "naturopathic" stuff is the stuff that is now considered real medicines? Isn't it odd that no one has looked at all those other herbs and remedies...oh wait, they have and it does not work. Herbs are DIRTY DRUGS if they work. They have a physiological effect.

 

[Jeff Corey]

"Naturopathy" is not medicine.

It's not? These "doctors" here practice all kinds of medicine, they have ND degrees.http://www.washingtoninstituteofnaturalmedicine.com/w/practitioners/

 

[Estellea]

Using the herbs I already posted, which never got a comment. Please show how this is a true statement. Actually please source proof that herbs do not work and while you're at it please explain why the medical establishment then uses them....IF they do not work.

It has been explained to you here and on the other naturopathy threads that you have dredged up on your crusade. In the imitable words of Dara O'Briain, "Herbal medicine that works is called medicine, the rest is a nice bowl of soup and some potpourri. Now get in the $&@*ing sack". Medicines derived from botanical sources are identified active ingredients, synthesised and purity quantified. Herbs from a naturopath or herbalist do not have these qualities, nor have they been tested for safety and efficacy.

 

[Bob Klase]

I NEVER said the two practices were the same. EVER. I said I think each form of medicine has its place.

I really don't think anyone here disagrees with that. Just that some people think "its place" for some forms of medicine is the toilet or a garbage dump.

 

[kellyb]

I've been in natural health forever. Actually I started out in orthodox medicine and switched over. I worked with critically ill cancer patients.

Can you elaborate on this?

 

[paximperium]

It's not? These "doctors" here practice all kinds of medicine, they have ND degrees.http://www.washingtoninstituteofnaturalmedicine.com/w/practitioners/

As per a modern definition of medicine, no. Naturopathy is not Medicine. They do prescribe "medicines" but do not practice Medicine and most definitely do not practice any science.

 

[WitchyWoman]

Perhaps the confusion is the herbs. No one involved in modern medicine would dispute the point that many useful medicines are derived from plants.
Morphine is a good example.

Exactly quarky. Someone found the point. and I agree that we are better off without many techniques once used.

 

[Estellea]

I'm going to follow suit. Do you always answer a question with a question?

When I'm speaking to someone whom I don't think understands science-based medicine, then I have to ask, since your incoherent response belies any solid understanding of how statistical likelihoods are acquired.

 

[kellyb]

Herbs from a naturopath or herbalist do not have these qualities, nor have they been tested for safety and efficacy.

Well, to be fair, rather a lot actually have been properly tested and found ineffective. That information just appears to be omitted from the curriculum at Woo Schools where you can get your degree in the cornucopia of woo known as "naturopathy".

 

[kellyb]

Exactly quarky. Someone found the point. and I agree that we are better off without many techniques once used.

So what's the point of naturopathy?