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If You're Fat - You Might Not Graduate

And of course, I'm sure it will very popular--the idea that you pay a college which pays its employees to touch your body. Very modern! Very advanced! Very litigable!

I hope whatever insurance company this college has a liability or umbrella policy with is paying attention. "You want your employees to touch the students' bodies? Yeah, that's certainly not going to result in anything untoward. Incidentally, we're not renewing your policy. Good luck!"
 
Darat said:
Perhaps they are hoping to pick up a sponsorship deal from Abercrombie & Fitch.
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That would only work if the college agreed to not just a weight requirement, but a looks requirement as well. Everyone would have to be attractive in a sterile, lifeless way, and utterly hairless from the neck down. Also the college would have to raise its prices because shopping at Abercrombie is generally slightly more expensive than a four year degree from a private school.
 
http://www.your30.qld.gov.au/Tools/Checkyourwaist/tabid/121/Default.aspx

I found this site that allows one to check their "healthy measurement". There doesn't seem to be a minimum (I put in 10cm as a man and I'm healthy!?)

A bit more checking and I found that the measurements change a bit depending on your ethnicity. eg, Japanese measure less than Euro's.
Here's the page followed by a handy table.

http://www.health.gov.au/internet/abhi/publishing.nsf/Content/factsheet-waist-measurement

picture.php
 
The Fallen Serpent said:
Ugh. This is a terrible policy. For one, BMI was intended to be used in regards to population statistics instead of individuals.
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Never knew that! Any more information? BMI always used to say I was not fat, when I clearly am - I just have tiny bones and little muscle, so don't weigh all that much for my height. But anyone who saw me - body like Homer Simpson - would soon tell me "you are overweight".

cj x
 
cj.23 said:
Never knew that! Any more information? BMI always used to say I was not fat, when I clearly am - I just have tiny bones and little muscle, so don't weigh all that much for my height. But anyone who saw me - body like Homer Simpson - would soon tell me "you are overweight".

cj x
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Being yellow probably doesn't help either;)
 
Pfft...we did this in my school, just a few years ago, but there was no "If you don't meet some standard set by the school, the school will make you do this" threat. We ALL had to take a lecture format health class, and an activity class. Period. I took archery.

If you had a disability, exceptions were easily made for the activity class. There was no fuss, no kicking out of people in wheelchairs, or forcing the blind to take mountain cycling, or such ridiculous antics. Don't be absurd.

BMI was only one standard, and thanks ever so, but the people running the program were health professionals and health profession students. I'm pretty sure they could tell which students were disabled, and could adjust accordingly. We took several fitness type tests, had our breathing and heart rates measured, our BMIs assessed (and adjustments made for body types and fat/muscle ratios), and the like. They looked to see what our reach was, standing and sitting; we did a step-exercise; we ran, if we could run; we climbed; we did pull-ups, chin-ups, push-ups and sit-ups; we actually broke a sweat, most of us.

In the lecture class, we saw gross images of smoke-blackened lungs and various STDs. It was quite the EWWWW, GROSS!!!-fest that week, trust me. And we had to use a program on the lab computers to track our eating for a certain time period...a month, I think...and calculate our nutrition and so on.

And no, you could not graduate if you did not pass these courses. This is true of many college courses, you know. If you don't pass your req's, you don't grad. Surely some of you knew this?
 
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Darat said:
As others have stated surely if they are going to implement this idea they would need to implement it in such a way that anyone falling outside the "healthy" band of the BMI chart needs to attend the course? So that would include those that are "too" skinny.
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Yep definitely, but maybe take in to account disorders which cayuse weight gain and weight loss. So a recovering cancer or pneumonia victim may be drastically underweight, but eating healthily - and someone with hyperthyroidism ditto. Hypothyroidism however can pile on the pounds. NO question arises: if you give medical dispensations for these conditions, how do you address other disorders which are medical, but effect weight - anorexia, bulemia, and overeating through grief, personality disorder, etc? It's a minefield :( Glad the college is trying something though!

cj x
 
The coverage in the guardian on this stated they were going to use both BMI and waste measurement to determine if someone was overweight.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/dec/04/lincoln-fat-graduate-obesity

Under the policy, all students must be tested for their Body Mass Index, or BMI, a recognised indication of a person's health status based on their height and weight. If a student has a BMI of more than 30 – one widely used definition of obesity – and a waist measurement of more than 35 inches for women and 40 inches for men, they are obliged to take a one-term Fitness for Life class.
The course includes walking, cycling, aerobics and lessons in healthy diet. Students who fail to take it will not graduate, no matter how good their academic performance has been.
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If correct it almost certainly does only target those students who are obese.

I find it laughable some consider sending someone for education to help them have a healthier life bullying.
 
A.A.Alfie said:
I am technically obese simply because of my body size under the BMI rules - I am not fat at all, stocky/solid and muscular (not Arnold). I am 180cm and 94kg. I always had problems with BMI because I fall outside that scope. My waist measurement is at the higher end at 92cm or so but still in the healthy range. Watch Christmas holidays stuff that up.
AAA
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Not according to BMI you're not. Your BMI is 29, overweight but not obese.
 
Guybrush Threepwood said:
Not according to BMI you're not. Your BMI is 29, overweight but not obese.
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You're right! - I hadn't realised.
I have recently dropped a few kg - I don't have to put much on to get over 30 on the bmi, but still a healthy measurement (which is what my GP wants). He has always said the BMI doesn't work in my case.

You have made my day.
 
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slingblade said:
Pfft...we did this in my school, just a few years ago, but there was no "If you don't meet some standard set by the school, the school will make you do this" threat. We ALL had to take a lecture format health class, and an activity class. Period. I took archery.

If you had a disability, exceptions were easily made for the activity class. There was no fuss, no kicking out of people in wheelchairs, or forcing the blind to take mountain cycling, or such ridiculous antics. Don't be absurd.

BMI was only one standard, and thanks ever so, but the people running the program were health professionals and health profession students. I'm pretty sure they could tell which students were disabled, and could adjust accordingly. We took several fitness type tests, had our breathing and heart rates measured, our BMIs assessed (and adjustments made for body types and fat/muscle ratios), and the like. They looked to see what our reach was, standing and sitting; we did a step-exercise; we ran, if we could run; we climbed; we did pull-ups, chin-ups, push-ups and sit-ups; we actually broke a sweat, most of us.

In the lecture class, we saw gross images of smoke-blackened lungs and various STDs. It was quite the EWWWW, GROSS!!!-fest that week, trust me. And we had to use a program on the lab computers to track our eating for a certain time period...a month, I think...and calculate our nutrition and so on.

And no, you could not graduate if you did not pass these courses. This is true of many college courses, you know. If you don't pass your req's, you don't grad. Surely some of you knew this?
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Your college had what I feel to be a reasonable standard. It is definitely different from what Lincoln University is intending on trying to enforce after having this policy for 3 years. Lincoln University has a health and fitness class that everyone is required to take ust as your University does. I find this positive. This should be encouraged. Discussions of BMI and even comparing yourself to the chart is a valid exercise. If for nothing else to demonstrate how often people fall outside the categories of a world standard and that arbitrary numbers should not be used to determine who is obese and who is not. The point I have issue with is that students who fall into the obese category by the BMI chart are required to take additional steps to graduate over the general student population. It can be fullfilled by completing a health and fitness class designed for the obese as the primary intention, by completely a sports class, or by reducing BMI below 30. Is this extra requirement particularly onerous? No. Obviously the many athletes who fall into BMI obesity are likely to be in and passing a sports class. I do doubt that the disabled, pregnant and other obviously protected states are subject to this unless the University has completely lost its sense of appropriateness. Yes, I could believe most people above BMI 30 are likely obese. I am more concerned with people that are healthy but might be convinced otherwise by a simple BMI reading, or people who have more subtle problem such as gigantomastia that is likely to sky rocket your BMI.

I have a friend who is obese by BMI standards. It is a legacy of pregnancy. She was underweight prior to the pregnancy. She has great difficulty burning off the pounds now. She tried a wide variety of methods to reduce her weight (not liposuction though) and not even taking hunger suppresants worked. Though she did fall ill. Turns out she has a glandular problem. She is on medication that helps regulate her body and this more than diet and exercise has led finally to weight loss. She will never be a twig again (the sacrifice of giving birth for many women ;) ) but mostly she just feels better being vindicated that after almost a decade of people telling her she just has no self control even though she personally perceived herself eating less that there was a hard to pinpoint medical issue here. I doubt her college going out of its way to mention she was obese and needed to take an obesity or sports class would have helped her mental state. I on the other hand have a scrawny build and low muscle mass. I am twenty pounds under BMI recommendation for obesity but saw clear signs of being overweight twenty pounds lighter. I could probably use the class but I figured that out on my own without extra collegiate requirements that would fail to apply to me.

In the end, BMI is too arbitrary and the concept while may be done with good intention is obtrusive in a way that is inappropriate for someone attempting to earn a degree unrelated to the personal weight.

EDIT: I missed the weight measurement. Another arbitrary metric. I had a 44" waist when I was sixty pounds lighter. Once forced because of mistaken Christmas shopping I had when I was healthier fit into a 42" waist pair of jeans, but it was a very uncomfortable day. Sure I am tall but I was called skinny back then. Maybe I just have a wide waist? I fit in 46" waists now.

Oh nevermind. Waist as measured above the navel. I have no idea where I do or did fit into that.
 
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Ivor the Engineer said:
The coverage in the guardian on this stated they were going to use both BMI and waste measurement to determine if someone was overweight.[...]
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I believe you meant to say waist measurement. I'd rather not ponder how one might perform waste measurement...

Edit: Beaten to the punch. :(
 
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According to the BMI I am obese (BMI about 32) and my waist measurement is also slightly over 35 inches.
I already walk a minimum of two hours every weekday as I don't drive and have to walk this much (at a brisk pace to catch trains, and carrying a heavy bag of books and papers) just to get to and from work. I also walk for recreation as often as I can make time to and can walk for 10-12 hours over rugged terrain with only a couple of short rest breaks. I eat a very healthy diet. I work 60-80 hours a week at a high-stress job. I have no physical health problems and have never required treatment for an illness in my adult life.
If I was a student I would be at a loss to know what I would gain from this.
 
I think the whole idea of the requirement is stupid. Nowadays kids are going more and more to online education. This is one more push in that direction.

Let me throw out a completely thoughtless comment. Is it right for this school to have a requirement like this for the overweight educated kids, when it lets the stupid jocks pass through without learning anything? (I have no evidence or citation for the previous comment, so don't ask)
 
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