New Opposition Leader in Australia - Emissions Trading Scheme to be voted down

[lionking]

I know Australian politics is not huge here, and I would not normally start a thread about it, but the immediate consequence of this is that the Senate, where the Opposition and independents have the balance of power, will now vote down the carbon trading scheme. As a G20 country and 13th largest contributor to emissions, this is significant.

http://www.theage.com.au/national/a...ral-leadership-20091130-k18h.html?autostart=1

Will this lead to other countries re-assessing their positions of carbon trading and other emissions schemes?

 

[The Fool]

I know Australian politics is not huge here, and I would not normally start a thread about it, but the immediate consequence of this is that the Senate, where the Opposition and independents have the balance of power, will now vote down the carbon trading scheme. As a G20 country and 13th largest contributor to emissions, this is significant.

http://www.theage.com.au/national/a...ral-leadership-20091130-k18h.html?autostart=1

Will this lead to other countries re-assessing their positions of carbon trading and other emissions schemes?

so whats new? The Catholic Taliban (Tony Abbott) has taken the leadership of the remnants of the collapsed right wing party and the cost of achieving this was to give the parties global warming deniers what they wanted.

wake me up in 3 or 4 years and we'll see if the right wing of australian politics has climbed back out of the hole.

 

[the_eye]

I predict a landslide victory for Labor in the next election. Tony Abbot is even less popular then Malcolm Turnball.

 

[Alan]

Tony Abbott doesn't seem Prime Ministerial giving this current speech. He's far too excited/nervous. I think it will affect his popularity polls negatively and chances of being elected if he continues like this.

 

[lionking]

A lot depends on how things are spun. I'm certain that the official position will be that the libs are not against emissions reductions, but that the CPRS was deeply flawed (and there's some truth in this) and that a new scheme will be put forward by the libs post-Copenhagen.

And remember that Howard was also "un-electable" when he took over as Opposition leader, and Rudd hardly generated dancing in the streets when he took over.

 

[gtc]

I think Joe Hockey as leader and Abbot as deputy would have worked out better.

With Joe as the nice guy and Abbot as the attack dog. Sort of like Ruddkipz and Gillard.

 

[lionking]

I think Joe Hockey as leader and Abbot as deputy would have worked out better.

I was going to say that two such egos would not work, but Hawke and Keating sort of contradicts that.

 

[The Atheist]

I know Australian politics is not huge here, and I would not normally start a thread about it, but the immediate consequence of this is that the Senate, where the Opposition and independents have the balance of power, will now vote down the carbon trading scheme. As a G20 country and 13th largest contributor to emissions, this is significant.

http://www.theage.com.au/national/a...ral-leadership-20091130-k18h.html?autostart=1

Will this lead to other countries re-assessing their positions of carbon trading and other emissions schemes?

More than likely.

It certainly won't do Aussie any harm in the short term - unless another 400,000 Kiwis moving there is harmful. (I'd say helpful, they might even teach you lot how to speak proper)

It's going down well in NZ, especially counterpointing the NZ Parliament pushing the same bill through this week and adding to our tax burden.

Given that denial seems to be a lot more popular than acceptance, it's going to prove pretty popular with the voters as well.

so whats new? The Catholic Taliban (Tony Abbott) has taken the leadership of the remnants of the collapsed right wing party and the cost of achieving this was to give the parties global warming deniers what they wanted.

wake me up in 3 or 4 years and we'll see if the right wing of australian politics has climbed back out of the hole.

Ah, it's lovely to sit back and compare PMs with you guys.

I'm no John Key fan, but between Abbott and Rudd, you must have the least inspiring pollies on the planet; they make Key look like a white Obama!

WTF is with Aussie having such pussy PMs all of a sudden? Jeating, Hawke and a few of your previous blokes were real battlers.

 

[The Fool]

I was going to say that two such egos would not work, but Hawke and Keating sort of contradicts that.

Got no time for Abbott, he's a bit strange. Hockey is a nice guy....trouble is he is not a good administrator. Already demoted once and described as having "problems with attention to detail" which means he cocks stuff up fairly regularly. Interesting story I heard was that he walked the Kokoda track with our PM Kevin rudd (before he was PM) and apparently pulled him out of a fast flowing river, this was described as "saving his life" by the press.....may have been less spectacular in real life but can you imagine Obama pulling bush out of a fast flowing river? The story hardly made the mainstream press here.

Another interesting story is that during their university days Abbott and Hockey got into a fist fight in a Rugby game....little skinny abbott aparently soundly belted big Joe Hockey due to previous boxing training.

The joys of Australian politics....

and lastly, and most sadly.....with the exit of Peter costello there is now no posibility of a run off between "Abbott and Costello" for the Party leadership. What an oportunity missed.

 

[lionking]

and lastly, and most sadly.....with the exit of Peter costello there is now no posibility of a run off between "Abbott and Costello" for the Party leadership. What an oportunity missed.

No but there's a Bishop and an Abbott on the front bench.

 

[Wildy]

...and Rudd hardly generated dancing in the streets when he took over.

Unless you believe The Herd.


In reality Rudd only got elected because Howard screwed up. He didn't give a consistent answer to when he would retire. Many people didn't really like playing a game of roulette where Howard might leave mid term and then we'd see Costello as the PM.

That and Workchoices.

 

[the_eye]

WTF is with Aussie having such pussy PMs all of a sudden?

Don't let Kevin Rudd's appearance fool you, he's as strong as steel and more cunning then a swamp rat.

No offense, but as citizen of another country whose entire defense strategy is to hide behind Australia, it's hypocritical too call anyone a pussy.

Keating, Hawke and a few of your previous blokes were real battlers.

How were they "Battlers?" They were both pretty Rich.

 

[lionking]

Don't let Kevin Rudd's appearance fool you, he's as strong as steel and more cunning then a swamp rat.

No offense, but as citizen of another country whose entire defense strategy is to hide behind Australia, it's hypocritical too call anyone a pussy.



How were they "Battlers?" They were both pretty Rich.

A small hint the eye. The Atheist is almost without peer when it comes to stirring the proverbial. Take what he says with a modicum of salt, return serve just as hard and enjoy the ride.

 

[Damien Evans]

Right then, I'm voting for Labor next election.

 

[Tricky]

As a Yank who knows nothing (at least until now) about Australian politics, I just want to say thanks to you blokes for keeping us informed in ways that the newpapers never do.

 

[Darth Rotor]

As a Yank who knows nothing (at least until now) about Australian politics, I just want to say thanks to you blokes for keeping us informed in ways that the newpapers never do.

I am still thanking Australia for Elle McPhereson.

 

[a_unique_person]

Abbot and the liberals are ensuring they could get a ETS scheme that is better than the emasculated result we have now. By voting down the ETS they give the trigger for a Double Dissolution, which Labor is certain to win in a landslide. The elevation of Abbot to opposition leader by a one vote margin is something they could only have dreamed about. The timing of the spill was interesting too. Fran Bailey, a Turnbull backer and probable supporter of an ETS are the disaster of the fires through her electorate, was ill and was not given a proxy vote. Two new members who can't vote till next week would also be Turnbull backers. The inherent instability and mistrust is only going to get worse.

Worse still, they will be many liberals wondering if they can keep their seats at the next election. The ETS is favoured by the majority of Australians, and Abbot is their least preferred alternative PM. If they want to keep their seats, something will have to give.

Add to that the treachery of the conservatives. They were pushing for Hockey as the alternative to Turnbull, and said Abbot was only running so that a spill could be forced. In the first round of voting, Hockey got the least votes of the three.

This will play out for years to come. The only problem is that Labor could get it too easy and go the way of NSW labor, with self interest the dominating force after a while, as actually having to answer to the constituency won't be necessary to win.

 

[lionking]

I can't imagine Labor going to a Double Dissolution. Sure, this will allow them to get the ETS through, but they will not control the senate and they know it. A Double Dissolution election, with all senate seats up for grabs and not just half, will result in a heap of single issue Independents. Dealing with six or seven Xenophons and Fieldings is something Labor will avoid like the plague.

I'd also like a dollar for all the times I've heard "that's the end of Labor/the Coalition for the next 10 years". Electorates have very, very short memories and can be swayed by one issue.

 

[a_unique_person]

I can't imagine Labor going to a Double Dissolution. Sure, this will allow them to get the ETS through, but they will not control the senate and they know it. A Double Dissolution election, with all senate seats up for grabs and not just half, will result in a heap of single issue Independents. Dealing with six or seven Xenophons and Fieldings is something Labor will avoid like the plague.

I'd also like a dollar for all the times I've heard "that's the end of Labor/the Coalition for the next 10 years". Electorates have very, very short memories and can be swayed by one issue.

They can be, if they have someone to vote for. The Liberal Party is doing it's best to make sure they are offering up their worst candidate, not their best.

 

[The Atheist]

Don't let Kevin Rudd's appearance fool you, he's as strong as steel and more cunning then a swamp rat.

Nothing to do with his apeparance.

He doesn't look any worse of a wimp than Key.

What makes him a pussy is the Marist Bros high school, the arts degrees and memebership of things like the Australian Student Christian Movement.

Cunning and political steel just don't register.

No offense, but as citizen of another country whose entire defense strategy is to hide behind Australia, it's hypocritical too call anyone a pussy.

Coming from a citizen of a country whose entire defence strategy is to ride America's coat-tails at all costs (refer Rudd and his position on Iraq/USA) that is ironically funny.

Well, if you were right, it would be ironic but you're demonstrably wrong, which makes it funnier, if less ironic.

NZ doesn't have a defence policy, let alone one of hiding behind Australia.

Just the minutest search of the history of NZ politics in the late 20th century would enable you to realise that far from hiding behind anyone, NZ has stood up to all comers, most particularly the sole superpower, USA.

[tip: "to" and "too" have completely different uses]

How were they "Battlers?" They were both pretty Rich.

What does money have to do with it? A battler is someone who battles against odds. Rudd hasn't had the chance to do that yet - maybe he'll surprise me.

A small hint the eye. The Atheist is almost without peer when it comes to stirring the proverbial. Take what he says with a modicum of salt, return serve just as hard and enjoy the ride.

What is this "almost" crap?

Electorates have very, very short memories and can be swayed by one issue.

What's the prevailing Aussie opinion on AGW?

I'd expect it to be similar to ours where the majority of the public don't want to be hit in the pocket, so hate the idea and will cleave to denialism like the proverbial brown stuff to a blanket.

Do you think it's an issue which Rudd would try to make a serious election issue?

I agree that any dissolution is extremely unlikely.