Evidence for why we know the New Testament writers told the truth.
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The book cited in post 1 (page 322) responds to your point:
"Does Jesus have to appear to every person in the world to make his claims credible? Why would he? We don't have to witness every event firsthand in order to believe the event actually occurred. In fact, it would be practically impossible to do so. We believe the testimony of others if they are trustworthy individuals {for example Luke, called one of the world's greatest historians}, and especially if their testimony is corroborated by other data. This is exactly the case with the testimony of the New Testament writers.
...if God were too overt because of frequent miraculous displays, then he might, in some cases infringe on our free will. If the purpose of this life is for all of us to freely make choices that will prepare us for eternity, then God will give us convincing evidence but not compelling evidence of his existence and purposes. Therefore, those who want to follow God can do so with confidence, and those who do not can suppress or ignore the evidence and live as if he didn't exist."
Hokulele
Deleterious Slab of Damnation
You said most, that implies some do.
Hokulele
Deleterious Slab of Damnation
AdinDraco
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Sorry, took ages to look up my bible (been busy) but re: the death of Judas.
Judas threw away his ill-gotten silver and hung himself.
Judas used his ill-gotten silver to buy a field where he tripped, burst open and his guts went everywhere....presumedly dying at this point.
This is why there is a "Field of Blood" because they took his silver (after he hung himself) and used it to buy a graveyard because the money was unclean...no, wait....it's called the Field of Blood because Judas' bowels spilled all over it.
For the kids playing at home, it's Matthew 27:5, Acts 1:18. Keeping reading each for the field of blood bit.
Now, I don't claim that the bible is 100% accurate and contradiction free, but many do and this is only useful to demonstrate to them that the inerring word of god has errors. If you are more moderate and say well of course the bible is not perfect, it is the work of men, or came to us through men etc but this hasn't sidestepped the issue. If you admit that the bible is NOT the inerring word of god, or that he didn't step in for some proofreading then we have the problem of knowing which bits are right and which bits are wrong. Thus the bible becomes utterly useless in it's intended function - the word of god. Yes, I'm imposing stricter conditions on it than any other book in history, but we have to put it (and any other religious writings for that matter...Koran, I'm looking at you...) into its own category because if it's the word of god, then it's either perfect or useless.
Judas threw away his ill-gotten silver and hung himself.
Judas used his ill-gotten silver to buy a field where he tripped, burst open and his guts went everywhere....presumedly dying at this point.
This is why there is a "Field of Blood" because they took his silver (after he hung himself) and used it to buy a graveyard because the money was unclean...no, wait....it's called the Field of Blood because Judas' bowels spilled all over it.
For the kids playing at home, it's Matthew 27:5, Acts 1:18. Keeping reading each for the field of blood bit.
Now, I don't claim that the bible is 100% accurate and contradiction free, but many do and this is only useful to demonstrate to them that the inerring word of god has errors. If you are more moderate and say well of course the bible is not perfect, it is the work of men, or came to us through men etc but this hasn't sidestepped the issue. If you admit that the bible is NOT the inerring word of god, or that he didn't step in for some proofreading then we have the problem of knowing which bits are right and which bits are wrong. Thus the bible becomes utterly useless in it's intended function - the word of god. Yes, I'm imposing stricter conditions on it than any other book in history, but we have to put it (and any other religious writings for that matter...Koran, I'm looking at you...) into its own category because if it's the word of god, then it's either perfect or useless.
six7s
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There's a Super Bowl ATLTUAE?
Lothian
should be banned
Oh good at long last we are going to get 3rd party corroboration with the New testament writers of the miracles in the bible. I just wish you had provided it in one of your previous 1225 posts in this thread.
Too overt, you are kidding. Name one mircale from God that has convincing evidence that it was him.
I'm convinced by all the evidence I've presented in my 1200 posts in this thread as well as other evidence I've presented in other threads. For example my thread "The 25 fulfilled prophecies of Isaiah 53". If your truly not convinced, then so be it. But there is plenty of evidence there for Christians to believe, and nothing any skeptic has said in this or any other thread has changed my mind.
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pakeha
Penultimate Amazing
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Well, as such, in the strictest, narrowest definition of the word, possibly not.
We have had Josh McDowell's 'six proofs' relinked, though.
Hokulele
Deleterious Slab of Damnation
Lothian
should be banned
I don't need a miracle to believe Jesus in the New Testament fits these verses.
From Isaiah Chapter 53
Who has believed our message
and to whom has the arm of the LORD been revealed?
He grew up before him like a tender shoot,
and like a root out of dry ground.
1 He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to him,
nothing in his appearance that we should desire him.
2 He was despised and rejected by men,
3 a man of sorrows, and familiar with suffering.
4 Like one from whom men hide their faces
he was despised, and we esteemed him not.
5 Surely he took up our infirmities
and carried our sorrows,
6 yet we considered him stricken by God,
smitten by him, and afflicted.
7 But he was pierced for our transgressions,
8 he was crushed for our iniquities;
the punishment that brought us peace was upon him,
and by his wounds we are healed.
9 We all, like sheep, have gone astray,
each of us has turned to his own way;
and the LORD has laid on him
the iniquity of us all.
10 He was oppressed and afflicted,
yet he did not open his mouth;
11 he was led like a lamb to the slaughter,
12 and as a sheep before her shearers is silent,
so he did not open his mouth.
13 By oppression [a] and judgment he was taken away.
14 And who can speak of his descendants?
For he was cut off from the land of the living;
for the transgression of my people he was stricken.
15 He was assigned a grave with the wicked,
16 and with the rich in his death,
17 though he had done no violence,
nor was any deceit in his mouth.
18 Yet it was the LORD's will to crush him and cause him to suffer,
and though the LORD makes his life a guilt offering,
19 he will see his offspring and prolong his days,
and the will of the LORD will prosper in his hand.
20 After the suffering of his soul,
he will see the light of life and be satisfied;
21 by his knowledge my righteous servant will justify many,
and he will bear their iniquities.
22 Therefore I will give him a portion among the great,
23 and he will divide the spoils with the strong,
24 because he poured out his life unto death,
and was numbered with the transgressors.
25 For he bore the sin of many,
and made intercession for the transgressors.
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=142542
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Yes, some have that opinion (that wasn't developed until the Middle Ages by a Jewish Rabbi) -- many others don't. Jews have converted to Christianity because of Isaiah 53.
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Hokulele
Deleterious Slab of Damnation
You already have a thread for this topic. Derail reported.
Lothian
should be banned
Doc,
Stop spamming and get to the point. I asked for an example of a miracle and you came up with Isaiah. What has Isaiah got to do with God's miracles? Even if we assume Jesus meets all the conditions, where is a miracle from God in all this?
Stop spamming and get to the point. I asked for an example of a miracle and you came up with Isaiah. What has Isaiah got to do with God's miracles? Even if we assume Jesus meets all the conditions, where is a miracle from God in all this?
pakeha
Penultimate Amazing
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Thanks for the reply, sonofgloin;
I agree with you there, sonofgloin.
From the modern examples linked here, it seems large numbers of people can still be so deeply moved by the etherial.
Not quite. The examples linked up have been reported within the life-times of the participants, as well.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've always had the impression Jesus was sought precisely for that; the story of the centurion comes to mind as an example.
I agree with you there, sonofgloin.
From the modern examples linked here, it seems large numbers of people can still be so deeply moved by the etherial.
Not quite. The examples linked up have been reported within the life-times of the participants, as well.
Akhenaten
Heretic Pharaoh
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