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Brainster Versus Dylan Avery Debate September 10, 2009

Brainster said:
Valid criticism is always appreciated. I do think at times that what I call the "nuclear option" is better than responding to individual points. For example, if the Truthers bring up the claim that Flight 77 didn't hit the Pentagon and start listing their bullet points (not enough wreckage, flight controllers thought it was military, etc.) it's useful to go with the argument that "You believe that large planes hit the World Trade Center, right? Then why would the plotters use something else to hit the Pentagon?"

Of course, remembering that in the heat of the moment can be tricky.
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It can be, I totally agree. Like I mentioned, I don't tend to consider myself any more skilled at actually taking part in the debate as you guys are, and I know full well that being able to do such things in the middle of a series of rather heated statements can be difficult-- the truther arguments seem specifically poised to elicit confusion and distraction when they're spit out in rapid succession in bullet-point form.

Speaking of, I visited a new art exhibit here in Dallas today that was built specifically from steel wreckage salvaged from the WTC debris, and wouldn't you know it there was a truther sitting closeby waiting to walk up to people and beckon them to take "a few videos on 9/11 that you can watch on your computer." While I normally tend to at least poke the evangelical truthers into outright stating their conspiracy accusations-- this also works wonders when I visit Dealy Plaza (where my dog peed on the grassy knoll)-- this time I was so moved from looking at the sculpture that all I did was refuse the videos and told the guy I didn't have time for his nonsense today. The truther crowd definitely has a fairly fervent set of dogma that their true-believers can rattle off quickly to stun people into listening to them, at least for a short while, but normally when you can get them to make a positive claim or argument they almost certainly trip themselves up and show their blatant cognitive dissonance. With relation to your debate with Avery, it seems he's on to this trap inherent in truther rhetoric and has built up a whole set of mental speed-bumps to avoid making any outright positive statements or claims (at least when on a recorded media outlet).

Still, like I also said, kudos on your talking him into corners on several occasions. Moments like those are the type that can swing potentially fence-sitting listeners to observe the cognitive dissonance and mental gymnastics inherent in conspiracy theory thinking.
 
VespaGuy said:
A Truther posted this video?! He actually thinks that it makes him look good?!

I need a laughing dog.
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Hell, this isn't even the first time "James" has posted a youtube video of himself calling in to Rob's show when Pat was a guest and "owning" them both. Here's one from last year.


Some truthers are best left for psychiatrists to figure out what their problem with reality really is. James is one of those.
 
Foolmewunz said:
And in Round 2....

Tri and MystifieD versus Dylan and JFK..... and look what's that lumbering in from stage left? It's The Buffet Slayer.

Wow, Tri... This is the Internet Tough Guy of the group. Be careful, he's likely to get, um... wordy, or something.
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I was banned before I could really respond after last night. Too bad. I guess they thought of me as a threat.
 
eromitlab said:
Hell, this isn't even the first time "James" has posted a youtube video of himself calling in to Rob's show when Pat was a guest and "owning" them both. Here's one from last year.


Some truthers are best left for psychiatrists to figure out what their problem with reality really is. James is one of those.
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He was right about one thing; Alex Jones doesn't think the New World Order wants to kill 80% of us because they want all the oil for themselves. Actually Alex seems to think this is some sort of sacrifice to their evil gods. Or something; I don't know that he's been specific as to why they're going to bump off 5 billion people or so.

I do love the way he painted himself into the corner on saying that the Twin Towers didn't look like controlled demolitions; that was definitely a laugh moment.
 
Brainster said:
He was right about one thing; Alex Jones doesn't think the New World Order wants to kill 80% of us because they want all the oil for themselves. Actually Alex seems to think this is some sort of sacrifice to their evil gods. Or something; I don't know that he's been specific as to why they're going to bump off 5 billion people or so.

I do love the way he painted himself into the corner on saying that the Twin Towers didn't look like controlled demolitions; that was definitely a laugh moment.
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When is this big event supposed to happen anyways. Its been 8 years. How many years will it take before his exp. date goes bad?
 
Hi all,

I wrote to Rob Breakenridge today to ask him for permission to post some of the debate on my youtube channel. Here's his response:

'Heh, yes, James and the local twoofer contingent - it is funny how they like to post this stuff. Unlike you, however, they don't ask for permission. I suppose if I wanted to mess with them I'd tell Youtube to yank their stuff, but then they'd only make themselves out to be martyrs.

Yes, feel free to put it up on Youtube.

PS: a huge thanks to you and all the JREFers - you guys are awesome!'

Again, thanks Rob and Pat. Can you JREF guys give me your best rebuttals and I'll try to include them in my video.

thanks

AE
 
Brainster said:
He was right about one thing; Alex Jones doesn't think the New World Order wants to kill 80% of us because they want all the oil for themselves. Actually Alex seems to think this is some sort of sacrifice to their evil gods. Or something; I don't know that he's been specific as to why they're going to bump off 5 billion people or so.

I do love the way he painted himself into the corner on saying that the Twin Towers didn't look like controlled demolitions; that was definitely a laugh moment.
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When you combine the tale of Kay Griggs and Skull and bones you could wonder .
 
knife fight colobus said:
Here is all the info for the LA Truth meetup:
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Knife and I were there today asking about Khalid Shiekh Mohammed and other such things. Knife is pretty awesome at this, me substantially less so. Some guy videotaped me asking stuff and I sucked, so prepare to see me suck on YouTube.

I don't think anyone that was asked either knew or read the NIST report, but Knife can fill you in better.

Lots and lots of, "Just asking questions," refusing to answer hypotheticals (but throwing some at us was a-ok), no evidence, inability to cite sources, a guy who asked about crop circles, and my favorite, the guy who didn't want to talk to us anymore but then proceeded to jump into our conversations with others.
 
eromitlab said:
Hell, this isn't even the first time "James" has posted a youtube video of himself calling in to Rob's show when Pat was a guest and "owning" them both. Here's one from last year.


Some truthers are best left for psychiatrists to figure out what their problem with reality really is. James is one of those.
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Am I wrong in saying he didnt have a single good point ? He stumbled through this whole thing like a true moron.
 
Lost,

PLEASE, PLEAASE PAAALLLEEEZZZEEEE tell me you have a video!?!?!? The comedic value would fill the rest of the years RDVoC (Reccomended Daily value of Comedy)

I will gladly pay to see this.
 
triforcharity said:
Lost,

PLEASE, PLEAASE PAAALLLEEEZZZEEEE tell me you have a video!?!?!? The comedic value would fill the rest of the years RDVoC (Reccomended Daily value of Comedy)

I will gladly pay to see this.
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I did not take video, but I'm sure you will see video of me sucking and I wager they'll make Knife out to be a terrorism supporter with the Khalid Shiekh Mohammed bit.

I don't want to speak for Knife fight colobus, but he aspires to emulate Gravy and I think he does a damn fine job of it.

I wish I had taken video of the guy who admitted to being drunk and getting paid. He seemed like a decent enough, if not somewhat paranoid and smelling of beer, guy.

There was a young woman who was talking about the melted steel and I just asked, "How are swords made?" After explaining the point of that she said she had no idea what swords were made of. Knife didn't want to, "double team," her and I just felt bad and moved on.

I do have a somewhat interesting picture that I would prefer to pass onto to the relevant person before posting publicly, but their office lists a mailing address, a phone number, and a fax number, so I'll call them on Monday. I have a hard time believing that a city official is going to take kindly to people using his campaign signs during a 9/11 Truth rally.
 
bill smith said:
So shall we say
Dylan-1
Debunkers-0.
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Hey Bill, I was one of the debunkers who called in and asked about KSM. My question isn't even about 911 and I'm asking sincerely, do you think that Dylan was directly answering my question? Or do you think that he was trying to change the subject to talk about ObL?

LostAngeles said:
Knife and I were there today asking about Khalid Shiekh Mohammed and other such things. Knife is pretty awesome at this, me substantially less so. Some guy videotaped me asking stuff and I sucked, so prepare to see me suck on YouTube.

I don't think anyone that was asked either knew or read the NIST report, but Knife can fill you in better.

Lots and lots of, "Just asking questions," refusing to answer hypotheticals (but throwing some at us was a-ok), no evidence, inability to cite sources, a guy who asked about crop circles, and my favorite, the guy who didn't want to talk to us anymore but then proceeded to jump into our conversations with others.
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Officially two different Truthers did not know of the NIST report. They were still talking about the pancake theory and how wtc 7 wasn't in the 911CR and when ever someone did tell me who they thought was behind it they said it was Israel.

One guy thought it was both Israel and the Illuminati.

I want to point out that one of them disproved one of my arguing points. When I mentioned the ESB plane crash had fuel also go down into the lobby the Truther told me that the towers had elevator banks, that they didn't go all the way down. That sounds pretty legit to me and so I figured before I continue saying how insane they are I should mention that someone totally destroyed me on that point.

ALL of them were trying to change the subject.

I think I'm gonna look lame on youtube too, but the video the guy was recording did record him saying that he thought that it was a good idea for them to start looking into how to get KSM out of jail.
 
I feel like I should explain the KSM bit.

Assume that 9/11 was an inside job. Then KSM is very likely innocent. Therefore we have tortured and imprisoned an innocent man. Same with Moussaoui.

If you give over the evidence of 9/11 being an inside job to the attorneys, they can present this in court and get KSM released.

If KSM is released, the media will blow up. Glenn Beck will lose **** in ways we haven't seen and can not imagine. Hell, everyone in the media will be all over this and boom, 9/11 Truth has its new investigation, which is what they say they want.

Why aren't they doing this?
 
Hey Tri and MythD, I also posted in that thread, I have the username Beehive. I should probably jump in and clear up any mistakes that the Truthers made.
 
I got banned and cannot view it even. BUT, alas, the wife's computer might provide some insight.....
 
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