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Encountered my first "Truther" today

RedIbis said:
So even after the judge deemed him a threat to the community, they reduced the charges based on your opinion?
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You still don't understand the plea bargain process in criminal cases. Why don't you call them and get it from the horse's mouth and see if this is a common practice. Sheesh.
 
triforcharity said:
You made it seem like you couldn't believe that false inprisonment was a felony. Everyone else here pretty much thought the same thing. That is why I posted that.

You seem to have a problem with the concept of laws and Florida Criminal Procedure though, so I wouldn't expect you to understand.
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I pretty much have no problem with anything you say in your post until you get to about right here. Nowhere did I say I couldn't believe false imprisonment was a felony. I was questioning the veracity of your story and the case as you described it.

Please don't take any of this personally. Other than your baseball loyalties you seem to be pretty friendly and reasonable. Just don't be surprised when your confronted with skepticism on a skeptics forum.
 
RedIbis said:
I pretty much have no problem with anything you say in your post until you get to about right here. Nowhere did I say I couldn't believe false imprisonment was a felony. I was questioning the veracity of your story and the case as you described it.

Please don't take any of this personally. Other than your baseball loyalties you seem to be pretty friendly and reasonable. Just don't be surprised when your confronted with skepticism on a skeptics forum.
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you didnt question it
you said it was "exposed as a fabrication"
such a claim would require proof
none of which you provided other than whining and carrying on

tri owes you nothin
you owe an apology to him for jumping the gun (at the least)

no matter what happens at this point 21 days ago you told a LIE
time to man up kid
say youre sorry
 
triforcharity said:
Red, They held him 21 days, which is pretty standard in juvie cases in Florida, unless its a minor offense, then its usually release to a parent or guardian.
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No, it's not really all that "standard" - especially for a first-offender.

From what I understand - after a juvenile is arrested in Florida, they are subject to an assessment called the DRAI. It assigns points based on the severity of the crime(s), prior convictions, aggravating/mitigating circumstances, and a number of other factors. The final point total is then presented to the Judge as a pre-trial sentencing recommendation.

You can read more about the DRAI here: http://www.djj.state.fl.us/Research/FDJJ-DRAI-Validation.pdf

Secure detention (for up to 21 days) is only recommended for scores over 12. Considering this kid was an unarmed first-offender whose most serious charge (at the time) was a third-degree felony, I would be surprised if he scored that high.

Anyway - I'm looking forward to seeing that sanitized report. May I suggest that you send the original to Hokulele for verification?
 
I had already planned on it deep. BTW, none of that applies, because it NEVER went for trial. It wasn't even a consideration for a trial, because within 2 weeks of his arrest, his attorney was already asking the SAO for a plea. Plea bargains have a whole nother set of rules to live by. This is not one of them. BTW, adults also have the same thing, so it is not unique to juvenilles.
 
triforcharity said:
I had already planned on it deep. BTW, none of that applies, because it NEVER went for trial. It wasn't even a consideration for a trial, because within 2 weeks of his arrest, his attorney was already asking the SAO for a plea. Plea bargains have a whole nother set of rules to live by. This is not one of them. BTW, adults also have the same thing, so it is not unique to juvenilles.
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Actually, I believe they perform that assessment within 24 hours of the initial arrest, for use at the detention hearing - it's a statutory requirement.

In fact, you mentioned earlier that this kid was denied bail - since juveniles in Florida are not eligible for bail, you must have been referring to the detention hearing.
 
Not gonna happen

TexasJack said:
You still don't understand the plea bargain process in criminal cases. Why don't you call them and get it from the horse's mouth and see if this is a common practice. Sheesh.
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But . . . but, that would require research! Don't you have a youtube link s/he could watch, instead? 'Truthers' don't believe nuttin' 'less it's on youtube.
 
triforcharity said:
I had already planned on it deep. BTW, none of that applies, because it NEVER went for trial. It wasn't even a consideration for a trial, because within 2 weeks of his arrest, his attorney was already asking the SAO for a plea. Plea bargains have a whole nother set of rules to live by. This is not one of them. BTW, adults also have the same thing, so it is not unique to juvenilles.
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Sounds about right when I think about my day of jury duty. I was selected to serve on it but we ultimately didn't have a trial because the party involved settled it out of court and made a plea deal. I'm not familiar with what goes on after the suspect or their attorney's make the plea, but the trial was over essentially before they had to have use serve.
 
RedIbis said:
I know I've asked this several times in this thread, but what proof has Tri provided to support his story?
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1. His statement was anecdotal. As such I was willing to buy into it because the behavior of his arrested twoof fits in with how TWOOFS behave.
2. He has NEVER shown any reason NOT to believe him (unlike you, who lies and tries to slander folks by playing handwaving games with semantics)
3. As he found out more information, he posted it and <gasp> has changed his POV.

(kinda like 9/11. Early information was hectic and chaotic, but as more time passed more and correct information came out).

4. He has provided a great deal of information which is consistent with
a. the juvenile justice system (I worked in it for 7 years). b. the legal system and how plea agreements work. c. how an adult reacts (angry, and with time realizing that he over reacted and not wanting a kid to pay for a mistake too long)

and the most interesting point
5. WHAT PROOF DO YOU HAVE THAT IT IS A FABRICATION? Huh? The phrase "exposed as a fabrication" means that you have
a. PROOF it is a fabrication.
b. that said proof has been provided.

Now what PROOF have YOU or OTHERS provided to "expose it as a fabrication?" Huh twoof? You have been asked REPEATEDLY to provide the proof or provide an apology for calling TRI a liar. Instead of saying "oops, I was trying to be playful and went a bit too far, you have spent a month and 10 pages acting like a child caught in a LIE.
 
Not yet huh? What does it matter at this point? Even if by miracle he ever proves it to be true it has already been accepted as Gospel by the debunkers before that proof has been offered up.

Nice play Red. Perfect.
 
Lets count the lies or misrepresentations

RedIbis said:
Well, primarily there's no support for his claims. His claims make almost no sense.
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It makes plenty of sense if you have ever worked in law enforcement, or in the juvenile justice system.

He changed his story several times,
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No he hasn't. He has clarified his story, and he has changed his STANCE on the arrest. Had it been some stupid 20 something adult, it is different than a 17 year old with no real parential supervision.

and no one has been able to locate the arrest of a young man in Florida arrested for false imprisonment in an east coast county on that date
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false. There were over 500 arrests for false imprisionment in the month in florida, as has been provided to you.

which really shouldn't be hard to do, nor would it include the victims involved.
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if you found the arrest record, you could easily FOIA it and then you twoofs would have Tri's identity and address.

I would say this is also consistent with the joy that many posters took in assuming the story was true so they could act out their violence fantasies, not because the story was supported but because they wanted it to be true.
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No... it is more that they can CROW look at da stooopid twoof. Many of us wish they would arrest the twoofs much more often.

So there is NO PROOF that Tri's story is a fabrication. Right twoof?

Just like 9/11 no PROOF of an inside jobby job, but you will keep on hoping and trying.
 
WUBRINY63 said:
Not yet huh? What does it matter at this point? Even if by miracle he ever proves it to be true it has already been accepted as Gospel by the debunkers before that proof has been offered up.

Nice play Red. Perfect.
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Try reading the thread or improving your reading comprehension.
 
WUBRINY63 said:
What? What's been offered up as proof? And if something has (which I can't find) didn't you already believe it anyway? Did you need it?
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Point to the posts where I said I believed it. Like I pointed out before, either read the thread or improve your reading comprehension.
 
WUBRINY63 said:
So you don't believe it yet.
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Do you believe that Tri's story was exposed as a fabrication? Do you understand the plea bargain progress? Or are you going to remain in denial and be ignorant like Red?
 
TexasJack said:
Point to the posts where I said I believed it. Like I pointed out before, either read the thread or improve your reading comprehension.
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Some people don't understand the difference between believing in a story's validity and stating its validity as a fact. I don't care to waste time on people who don't have basic reading comprehension, and neither should you IMO. I'll take the story at face value, but my opinion has no bearing on the overall validity of the anecdote, but experiences similar to tri's happen all the time, and not all of them are news-worthy. If he brings up specific names or accusations, I might ask for the proof, but at this point it's common enough with or without conspiracy nuttery as a pretext I'd almost certainly see something like this happening to anyone.
 
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nicely done wubrin. you show that you are only a parrot and believe anything and everything that REd ibis offers, which are nothing more than lie,s and you repeat those same lies


1) please point to a post on this thread where anyone "bought" this story as fact. you'll be hard pressed to do so

2) provide proof that RED provided proof that the story was a complete fabrication

Keep in minde: the kid was a minor so anything that pertains to him WILL not be made available to the public. That includes his ARREST, his criminal charges, the plea bargain and even the sentencing. the only person who would be privy to such information is Tri.

Unfortunately for you and REd, who have the credibility of con mens, Tri is a respected member of this forum, and by his POSTING history, we have no reason to not BELIEVE his ANECTDOTAL story.

YOU understand what anectdotal is right?
 
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