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BNP leaflet through my door

ProdigalGuru said:
The methods of cultural genocide do not have to be violent, or even orchestrated.
You can simply be "bred out", over time.
I am proud of my Saxon heritage, just as a black man may be proud of his African heritage..
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In an interesting programme on British TV, the ethnic backgrounds of various people who considered themselves white British were checked through DNA analysis. One woman who stated that she was entirely descended from Saxon stock (she was even the head of some kind of Saxon society or some such thing) was shown to be anthing but, with a significant Mediterranean component in the last few generations.

In short, you may not be as racially pure as you think (and in your case, it would appear, as you want)

ProdigalGuru said:
I would prefer my son marry a white woman.
This does not make me a racist.
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Yes it does. If your concern is heritage related and you identify as US British then you'd better off with your son marrying a black Carribean (who have a great deal of congruency with Britain from a heritage perspective) rather than, say someone with a European background
 
ProdigalGuru said:
I would prefer my son marry a white woman.
This does not make me a racist.
Click to expand...

Yes, it does.


Here, we have the freedom to be racist and deny the holocaust, regardless of how much others might disagree with our viewpoint.
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As do we.

I am proud of my Saxon heritage, just as a black man may be proud of his African heritage.
Click to expand...

Can't a black man be proud of his British heritage?
 
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The Don said:
In an interesting programme on British TV, the ethnic backgrounds of various people who considered themselves white British were checked through DNA analysis. One woman who stated that she was entirely descended from Saxon stock (she was even the head of some kind of Saxon society or some such thing) was shown to be anthing but, with a significant Mediterranean component in the last few generations.

In short, you may not be as racially pure as you think (and in your case, it would appear, as you want)

...snip...
Click to expand...

I saw this - I wish there was a follow-up programme as I wondered how she would continue to ignore the fact that she wasn't a "pure-blood".
 
The Roman army was made up of men from all over the Roman Empire, including North Africa, Turkey and the Middle East. When they arrived in Britain, there's no reason to believe that they behaved differently from any other settled army of occupation. Which means that today, even the most "pure-bred" English person is likely to have "a touch of the tarbrush" (as my grandparents put it).
Besides, didn't the Saxons immigrate from Europe? Like the Celts? In fact, didn't every inhabitant of these fair isles originate from elsewhere?
 
sophia8 said:
The Roman army was made up of men from all over the Roman Empire, including North Africa, Turkey and the Middle East. When they arrived in Britain, there's no reason to believe that they behaved differently from any other settled army of occupation. Which means that today, even the most "pure-bred" English person is likely to have "a touch of the tarbrush" (as my grandparents put it).
Besides, didn't the Saxons immigrate from Europe? Like the Celts? In fact, didn't every inhabitant of these fair isles originate from elsewhere?
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Actually, Oppenheimer's "Origins of the British" suggests that contributions by Anglo-Saxons, Romans etc make up very little of our DNA.

http://www.prospect-magazine.co.uk/article_details.php?id=7817
 
ProdigalGuru said:
The methods of cultural genocide do not have to be violent, or even orchestrated.
You can simply be "bred out", over time.
I am proud of my Saxon heritage, just as a black man may be proud of his African heritage.
I would prefer my son marry a white woman.
This does not make me a racist.
It is not immoral to want your culture to flourish and prosper over other cultures.
I know nothing of the BNP other than what I have read here, and do not support it or oppose it.
I am an American patriot.
Here, we have the freedom to be racist and deny the holocaust, regardless of how much others might disagree with our viewpoint. If enough people agree with the point of view, we are free to enact laws enforcing those views.
Click to expand...

Yes, and the lovely thing about America is that I'm also free to call you racist. Since you're spouting the party line, let's just take a few of them at a time.

If you're an American you're going to have a damned difficult proving your "Saxon" heritage.

Do you actually know where Saxony is, or are you just reluctant to put in the rest of the expression - White Anglo-Saxon, because it makes it clearer that you are indeed quite likely a racist?

That detritus about the race possibly being bred out of existence... that's also quite common amongst White Supremacists. I think that's in Willis Carto Vol 1.

Your previous line about wanting your son to marry a white person? Ditto.

And the referring to oneself as "just an American Patriot" (or similar expressions) is top of the line White Supremacist patter. It's used as a rallying cry to try to hook the interest of right wing conservatives who might not have quite the misanthropic bent.

So, I'm left with something that walks like a duck, talks like a duck, wiggles its butt like a duck, and am merely waiting to see if it's constantly seen in the company of other ducks, but I'm heading towards a certain conclusion.

No bonus points for the first person to figure that conclusion out.
 
ProdigalGuru said:
The methods of cultural genocide do not have to be violent, or even orchestrated.
You can simply be "bred out", over time.
Click to expand...
Genocide means the murder of a race. If no-one gets killed, it isn't genocide.

Doing the jiggy-jiggy with a hot black chick is particularly not genocide. It's more ... fun than genocide.

I am proud of my Saxon heritage, just as a black man may be proud of his African heritage.
Click to expand...
Are you a pure Saxon, or are you one of those filthy Anglo-Saxon crossbreeds?

Don't even get me started on the Jutes.

I would prefer my son marry a white woman.
This does not make me a racist.
Click to expand...
Yes it does. Duh.

It is not immoral to want your culture to flourish and prosper over other cultures.
Click to expand...
What are the defining characteristics of your "culture", and what does it have to do with race?

I know nothing of the BNP other than what I have read here, and do not support it or oppose it.
Click to expand...
The fact that they're evidently a bunch of freakin' morons doesn't give you a clue?

I am an American patriot.
Here, we have the freedom to be racist and deny the holocaust, regardless of how much others might disagree with our viewpoint. If enough people agree with the point of view, we are free to enact laws enforcing those views.
Click to expand...
You know, I don't think you could enforce racism and holocaust denial even if you were in the majority.

The constitution, y'know.

Fine "American patriot" you are.
 
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Rebuttals

It seems I have a lot to cover, I will try to get to all of your arguments in a single post.

Murder is not the only route to genocide. If a race or culture ceases to exist by the actions of another race or culture, the method is largely irrelevant.
Genocide- systematic killing of a racial or cultural group.
Kill - stamp out: end or extinguish.

I quoted my Saxon heritage, and yes, it would more accurately be described as Anglo-Saxon, but this was to illustrate that my ancestors came from Germanic tribes instead of Scandinavian tribes. Saying that I am "white" did not convey any cultural heritage at all. I also never stated I was "pure". My family came to America on the Mayflower, and has a VERY long history in Britain. I will provide NO documentation, so do not ask. I have also not claimed to be superior to ANYONE. Cultures transcend political borders, so no, I would not prefer for my son simply to marry a British girl, or a Caribbean girl. "British" is not a definition of heritage, it is a definition of a political boundary. My stated preference (more specifically W.A.S.P.) does not indicate that I would forbid my son to marry any other race or religion. I similarly would prefer he marry a woman, this does not make me a homophobe, either. This is an extreme forum, but not all views expressed here are such.

Name-calling isn't nice, please stop.

Racist- a person with a prejudiced belief that one race is superior to others. Again, I do not state any superiority, just a preference. I prefer the red Skittles over the yellow ones, too, but I think they are both nice. Is the NAACP racist? They prefer to help only brown Americans. In fact, I am starting to get the impressions that Muslims, as a culture, are superior. They at least agree on a single God, and who their enemies are. Far from "white" supremest.

On enforcing racism and holocaust denial vs. the Constitution: I cite the Emancipation Proclamation, the Equal Rights Amendment, Indian Reservations, and Prohibition. The US has a strong history of oppression. The Laws change to suit the times. While it is not likely these laws would be enacted, it is entirely within the scope of possibility. I never stated I would support such laws. Don't put words in my mouth.

I said- "It is not immoral to want your culture to flourish and prosper over other cultures."
Darat said- "From my viewpoint it is when that culture will not let me live as I want to."
"Flourish and prosper" does not mean "oppress". Grade 6 stuff here.
Also, Darat, labeling an entire culture "despicable" based on the actions of some individuals is bigoted, and arguably racist. Ironic much?

People here seem to jump to some fairly assumptive conclusions in a hurry. Isn't this supposed to be a haven for critical thinking and rational skepticism?
 
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ProdigalGuru said:
I quoted my Saxon heritage, and yes, it would more accurately be described as Anglo-Saxon, but this was to illustrate that my ancestors came from Germanic tribes instead of Scandinavian tribes. Saying that I am "white" did not convey any cultural heritage at all. I also never stated I was "pure". My family came to America on the Mayflower, and has a VERY long history in Britain. I will provide NO documentation, so do not ask. I have also not claimed to be superior to ANYONE. Cultures transcend political borders, so no, I would not prefer for my son simply to marry a British girl, or a Caribbean girl. "British" is not a definition of heritage, it is a definition of a political boundary. My stated preference (more specifically W.A.S.P.) does not indicate that I would forbid my son to marry any other race or religion. I similarly would prefer he marry a woman, this does not make me a homophobe, either. This is an extreme forum, but not all views expressed here are such.
Click to expand...

Unless you can account for all of your forebears (as opposed to a single line you have allegedly traced back to the Mayflower) then you have no idea as to your racial heritage. As I mentioned earlier in this thread, a lady who was *convinced* that she was entirely Saxon was shown to be pretty much anything but.

Cultural heritage is easily transferred. British Indians are sometimes more British culturally than the British themselves (the show Goodness Gracious Me has mined this seam of stereotypes very effecively) so if you are basing your preference for your son's wife on skin colour alone then you certainly racist.
 
ProdigalGuru said:
It seems I have a lot to cover, I will try to get to all of your arguments in a single post.

Murder is not the only route to genocide. If a race or culture ceases to exist by the actions of another race or culture, the method is largely irrelevant.
Genocide- systematic killing of a racial or cultural group.
Kill - stamp out: end or extinguish.
Click to expand...

What actions?

I quoted my Saxon heritage, and yes, it would more accurately be described as Anglo-Saxon, but this was to illustrate that my ancestors came from Germanic tribes instead of Scandinavian tribes. Saying that I am "white" did not convey any cultural heritage at all. I also never stated I was "pure". My family came to America on the Mayflower, and has a VERY long history in Britain. I will provide NO documentation, so do not ask. I have also not claimed to be superior to ANYONE. Cultures transcend political borders, so no, I would not prefer for my son simply to marry a British girl, or a Caribbean girl. "British" is not a definition of heritage, it is a definition of a political boundary. My stated preference (more specifically W.A.S.P.) does not indicate that I would forbid my son to marry any other race or religion. I similarly would prefer he marry a woman, this does not make me a homophobe, either. This is an extreme forum, but not all views expressed here are such.
Click to expand...
Ok you wouldn't forbid it. Whould you make your reservations known and try to talk him out of it?

Name-calling isn't nice, please stop.
Click to expand...
K.

Racist- a person with a prejudiced belief that one race is superior to others. Again, I do not state any superiority, just a preference. I prefer the red Skittles over the yellow ones, too, but I think they are both nice. Is the NAACP racist? They prefer to help only brown Americans. In fact, I am starting to get the impressions that Muslims, as a culture, are superior. They at least agree on a single God, and who their enemies are. Far from "white" supremest
Click to expand...
Wait what? I'm pretty sure Christians and Jews agree on a single god (respectively) and who their enemies are.
On enforcing racism and holocaust denial vs. the Constitution: I cite the Emancipation Proclamation, the Equal Rights Amendment, Indian Reservations, and Prohibition. The US has a strong history of oppression. The Laws change to suit the times. While it is not likely these laws would be enacted, it is entirely within the scope of possibility. I never stated I would support such laws. Don't put words in my mouth.
Click to expand...
The Emancipation Proclamation and the Equal Rights Amendment were oppressive?
I said- "It is not immoral to want your culture to flourish and prosper over other cultures."
Darat said- "From my viewpoint it is when that culture will not let me live as I want to."
"Flourish and prosper" does not mean "oppress". Grade 6 stuff here.
Also, Darat, labeling an entire culture "despicable" based on the actions of some individuals is bigoted, and arguably racist. Ironic much?
Click to expand...
Flourish and prosper, no. Flourish and prosper over other cultures. Yes.

People here seem to jump to some fairly assumptive conclusions in a hurry. Isn't this supposed to be a haven for critical thinking and rational skepticism?
Click to expand...
What's rational about your having a problem with your son marrying a person with a (supposedly) darker skin color?
 
ProdigalGuru said:
Racist- a person with a prejudiced belief that one race is superior to others.
Click to expand...

Which you follow up with:

I prefer the red Skittles over the yellow ones, too, but I think they are both nice.
Click to expand...

I 'prefer' The Wire to Monarch of the Glen. Why? Because I think one if better than the other. You prefer (God knows why as they all taste alike) the red Skittles over the yellow ones because: You find one better than the other.

Don't use semantics to get around your racism.

I'm sure if a black father said he'd prefer his son to marry a black woman, you'd be one of the first to cry racist. You'd be right.
 
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ProdigalGuru said:
It seems I have a lot to cover, I will try to get to all of your arguments in a single post.

Murder is not the only route to genocide. If a race or culture ceases to exist by the actions of another race or culture, the method is largely irrelevant.
Genocide- systematic killing of a racial or cultural group.
Kill - stamp out: end or extinguish.
Click to expand...


So you would be one of those bleeding hearts who belives there is such a thing as cultural genocide?

I quoted my Saxon heritage, and yes, it would more accurately be described as Anglo-Saxon, but this was to illustrate that my ancestors came from Germanic tribes instead of Scandinavian tribes. Saying that I am "white" did not convey any cultural heritage at all. I also never stated I was "pure". My family came to America on the Mayflower, and has a VERY long history in Britain. I will provide NO documentation, so do not ask. I have also not claimed to be superior to ANYONE. Cultures transcend political borders, so no, I would not prefer for my son simply to marry a British girl, or a Caribbean girl. "British" is not a definition of heritage, it is a definition of a political boundary. My stated preference (more specifically W.A.S.P.) does not indicate that I would forbid my son to marry any other race or religion. I similarly would prefer he marry a woman, this does not make me a homophobe, either. This is an extreme forum, but not all views expressed here are such.
Click to expand...

You claim WASP culture and yet object to genocide? Thats some serious doublethink there.

Also, Darat, labeling an entire culture "despicable" based on the actions of some individuals is bigoted, and arguably racist. Ironic much?
Click to expand...

Some individuals?? Have you any idea what imperist WASPs got up to? It would likely make Stalin blink (and then take notes probably).
 
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