Merged 9/11 CT subforum General Discussion Thread

[dtugg]

There is a famous pilot out there with more than 40 years experience in about a hundred different types of aircraft. He holds or has held 17 world flying records and has more than 19,000 hours under his belt. He has been a test plot, was in Vietnam I believe, flew for the CIA and so on. His resume goes on and on forever. He says that he would miss five times out of six at that altitude and speed. He said you would not be able to pick your target building out of all the buildings and would have no points of reference. Everthing would be happening too quickly at nearly 600mph. I can't remember his name right now but I tend to believe him.

You're talking about John Lear. He is a nutcase who believes in all kinds of crazy crap like alien bases on the moon and submarine bases in the desert of Nevada. He may have been a great pilot at one point but he is old and clearly off his rocker. Big surprise he is one of Cap'n Bob's experts.

ETA: And by the way, the Twin Towers were by far the most prominent buildings in the New York skyline. The could be seen for miles and miles away. Especially on a clear day like 9/11 was.

 

[beachnut]

There is a famous pilot out there with more than 40 years experience in about a hundred different types of aircraft. He holds or has held 17 world flying records and has more than 19,000 hours under his belt. He has been a test plot, was in Vietnam I believe, flew for the CIA and so on. His resume goes on and on forever. He says that he would miss five times out of six at that altitude and speed. He said you would not be able to pick your target building out of all the buildings and would have no points of reference. Everthing would be happening too quickly at nearly 600mph. I can't remember his name right now but I tend to believe him.

Wow, good for you, you are gullible. You believe in hearsay and delusions. What is new?

The terrorist pilots hit 3 out of 4, at 75 percent they beat the idiot pilots Balsamo has found who can’t hit buildings; they must be challenged pilots for truth who can’t grasp reality.

I have flown supersonic jets and instructed in heavy jets; the video is junk. I only have thousand of hours in large jets and 35 years flying experience, must be my engineering degrees that keep me from falling for idiotic ideas you and Balsamo have.

Which planes were at 600 mph? Hello? What speeds did the planes impact buildings at, and what were the speed limits they exceeded and explain all about speed, test flying, limits, and aerodynamics. Go ahead make my day.

You are failing again, each idea so far you present is pure delusions, you are doing it again.

Leaving a constant trail of 911 delusions in your wake. Have you any original ideas on 911 you can support with facts?

Do you mean Lear?

 

[alexi_drago]

I think I've found a recent picture of him although he appears to have changed his name.

 

[bill smith]

Wow, good for you, you are gullible. You believe in hearsay and delusions. What is new?

The terrorist pilots hit 3 out of 4, at 75 percent they beat the idiot pilots Balsamo has found who can’t hit buildings; they must be challenged pilots for truth who can’t grasp reality.

I have flown supersonic jets and instructed in heavy jets; the video is junk. I only have thousand of hours in large jets and 35 years flying experience, must be my engineering degrees that keep me from falling for idiotic ideas you and Balsamo have.

Which planes were at 600 mph? Hello? What speeds did the planes impact buildings at, and what were the speed limits they exceeded and explain all about speed, test flying, limits, and aerodynamics. Go ahead make my day.

You are failing again, each idea so far you present is pure delusions, you are doing it again.

Leaving a constant trail of 911 delusions in your wake. Have you any original ideas on 911 you can support with facts?

Do you mean Lear?

I would have never believed you were so qualified. Wow. 590 mph is nerly 600 mph I'd say. That's right- Lear of Learjet corporation. John Lear. I have an interview with him somewhere...hang on....here it is.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7461916360683592003

 

[beachnut]

I would have never believed you were so squalified. Wow. 590 mph is nerly 600 mph I'd say. That's right- Lear of Learjet corporation. John Lear. I have an interview with him somewhere...hang on....here it is.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7461916360683592003

You win; you have alien among us and aliens on the DSOTM. Good for you, we have a winner! Did I spell that right?

Lear is an expert at woo, and he found Balsamo, and you found both of them packaged in one delusion you want to have on 911.

You won! You have fallen for the delusions of 911Truth, and your sig is suggestive of Balsamo's own favorite words as he threatens to kill those who disagree with him.


Pick any of the failed claims of Balsamo and his alien believer buddy in woo and to present your original facts to back them up. Make my day

reminds me of the 11.2g failure still posted by p4t

Bill, you love hearsay, you posted hearsay, and this must be a great day for your delusions on 911. Lear has nothing for 911 he has not studied 911 he uses hearsay like you do and now you are second hand hearsay as you use Lear to defend those who apologize for terrorists.

 

[BCR]

OMG he converted to Christianity too

 

[The Big Dog]

I would have never believed you were so qualified. Wow. 590 mph is nerly 600 mph I'd say. That's right- Lear of Learjet corporation. John Lear. I have an interview with him somewhere...hang on....here it is.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7461916360683592003

John Lear? Wow, Old Bill is really taking us through our paces.... I'll see your appeal to authority fallacy and top it with an ad hominem pointing out that your expert is a freaking first class nutjob (just like all the other No Planers).

By the way, speaking of bat **** crazy, what is the status of old Cap'n Bob's FAA certification?

 

[Whiplash]

I found this lovely thought on Infowars.com:

"To deny 9/11 was an inside job is ABSOLUTE TREASON."

In the USA, the punishment for treason is death.

So I guess this truther is saying..."if you don't accept 9-11 truth..you should be killed".

I think you are right, and that's exactly what they think, but don't have the courage enough to actually state it. Instead they try to veil it like that.

The thing that confuses me the most about truthers is how they can go day to day actually thinking they are winning and making any difference. I find it hard to fathom that anyone could be that deeply in denial. I don't know how they do it. They are about half as clever as they think they are.

 

[six7s]

Pick any of the failed claims of Balsamo and his alien believer buddy in woo and to present your original facts to back them up. Make my day

reminds me of the 11.2g failure still posted by p4t

Reminds me of Alice in Wonderland

 

[R.Mackey]

John Lear? Wow, Old Bill is really taking us through our paces.... I'll see your appeal to authority fallacy and top it with an ad hominem pointing out that your expert is a freaking first class nutjob (just like all the other No Planers).

Yup, that's Mr. Lear. He also, among other things, believes the Moon has a breathable atmosphere. This despite the fact that anyone can disprove this just by looking at the Moon, no telescope required.



I keep forgetting that he's one of the "verifiable professionals" on their roster... one can only assume this means their little club is a full-blown no-planer group. Of course, just like the rest, they're rather short when it comes to explaining what they think "really" happened.

Mr. Lear stands on his authority as a pilot to defend his beliefs about the Moon. He also stands on the exact same authority to defend his beliefs about September 11^th. As a result, this isn't an ad Hominem attack at all, but rather a simple appraisal of his supporting argument, or lack thereof.

 

[six7s]

Yup, that's Mr. Lear. He also, among other things, believes the Moon has a breathable atmosphere. This despite the fact that anyone can disprove this just by looking at the Moon, no telescope required.

his career was severely affected by his speaking publicly on the subject matter

Adversely, I hope

his accuracy is really quite unique in this field

Good!

 

[six7s]

When applying Occam's Razor to the problem, do you honestly find the plane theory only slightly more reasonable than the no plane theory? Really?

OCCAMS RAZOR WOZ A HOKES!!!11!!!

 

[debunker9145]

Should truthers compare the belly of UA 175 to the belly of a United Airlines 767

It would be more helpful than comparing it to the bottom of a 767' where the bottom is painted all white. Look at the paint job on the belly of this United Airlines 767'. http://www.airliners.net/photo/Unit...=1&sok=&sort=&prev_id=1502187&next_id=1499145

According to their logic all United Airlines 767's have "Missiles" and "strange Anomalies" attached to their underside.

 

[bill smith]

Shattering Impact

2.3.6 Results of modal analysis

The period of oscillation in the N-S direction of WTC 2 was estimated immediately after aircraft impact based on a detailed analysis of the building motion, which was captured in video footage (Figure E-6 of Appendix E) of the WTC2 impact(see NIST NCSTAR 1-5A). A frequency analysis of the displacement of the tower at the 70th floor, shown in Fig. 2-15, resulted in a fundamental mode in the N-S direction with a period of approximately 11.4s, a torsional mode with a period of 5.3s, and two higher translational modes with periods of 3.9 and 2.2 s. Periods were accurate to within +-0.1 s. The measured fundamental period of 11.4 +-0.1 s was nearly identical to the calculated period from the model (11.2 s with P-Δ effects for large-amplitude vibrations). Also, the measured torsional period and the higher translational period were almost identical to the calculated periods from the model with P-Δ effects (5.2 s and 4.0 s for the torsional and higher translational modes, respectively).

The maximum displacement of the WTC 2 tower at floor 70 was measured to be about 12 in., while the maximum sway of the tower at the top was approximately 27 in. (NIST NCSTAR 1-5A).

The impact of the aircraft into WTC 2 caused the tower to sway back and forth for almost four minutes.
************************************************************************
It seems plainly obvious from the NIST report exerpt above (NIST NCSTAR 1-5A) that there was an absolutely shattering impact of the plane into WTC2. Now look at the plane slide into the building from the 50 second mark in the attached video. Is there an incongruity with the NIST report ? Which do you believe- NIST or your own eyes ?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JPR0hw-mqnk&feature=related 5-6

 

[Baby Nemesis]

You folks should know how badly you are getting your heads handed to you in your debates with ole Master-de-bator bill smith.

http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/TSBMT04T49GGG7HFO/post88136

But Teddy....everybody knows that jref is a forum of wall-to-wall Shills (with a very ocasional Truther) I am not expecting converts but I do quite enjoy putting them through their paces here and there. I will choose my moments.

Y'all should be embarrassed by the fact that billy is "putting you thru your paces".

So Bill, just what's the point?

 

[six7s]

Which do you believe- NIST or your own eyes ?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JPR0hw-mqnk&feature=related 5-6

Yeah! Do the maths, sheeple!

One plus one equals eleventy!

 

[beachnut]

2.3.6 Results of modal analysis

The period of oscillation in the N-S direction of WTC 2 was estimated immediately after aircraft impact based on a detailed analysis of the building motion, which was captured in video footage (Figure E-6 of Appendix E) of the WTC2 impact(see NIST NCSTAR 1-5A). A frequency analysis of the displacement of the tower at the 70th floor, shown in Fig. 2-15, resulted in a fundamental mode in the N-S direction with a period of approximately 11.4s, a torsional mode with a period of 5.3s, and two higher translational modes with periods of 3.9 and 2.2 s. Periods were accurate to within +-0.1 s. The measured fundamental period of 11.4 +-0.1 s was nearly identical to the calculated period from the model (11.2 s with P-Δ effects for large-amplitude vibrations). Also, the measured torsional period and the higher translational period were almost identical to the calculated periods from the model with P-Δ effects (5.2 s and 4.0 s for the torsional and higher translational modes, respectively).

The maximum displacement of the WTC 2 tower at floor 70 was measured to be about 12 in., while the maximum sway of the tower at the top was approximately 27 in. (NIST NCSTAR 1-5A).

The impact of the aircraft into WTC 2 caused the tower to sway back and forth for almost four minutes.
************************************************************************
It seems plainly obvious from the NIST report exerpt above (NIST NCSTAR 1-5A) that there was an absolutely shattering impact of the plane into WTC2. Now look at the plane glide into the building from the 50 second mark in the attached video. Is there an inconuity with the NIST report ? Which do you believe- NIST or your own eyes ?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JPR0hw-mqnk&feature=related 5-6

No. You should check with the p4t expert who can do 11.2G math with out effort, without math. But you posted no real explanation for why you think there is an inconuity? What is an inconuity?

 

[bill smith]

So Bill, just what's the point?

Well I don't approve of that groupie guy Teddy (here he's knwn as 'tfk') following me around and basically shouting from street corners. But we all have to suffer the slings and arrows I suppose.
At the time I believed that to be true but now I think that most of the posters here are just looking for the Truth. So I do the right thing and share what bits of information I have managed to put together, sometimes with my own interpretation in the form of hypotheses.

 

[beachnut]

There is a famous pilot out there with more than 40 years experience in about a hundred different types of aircraft. ... Everthing would be happening too quickly at nearly 600mph. I can't remember his name right now but I tend to believe him.

Explain what you mean and how Lear supports your claim of happening too quickly, because when I was flying at 600 mph, things were happening the same speed, my heart was beating the same, my radio worked the same, not too quickly, my eyes worked and not too quickly, and I put the jet exactly where I wanted.

On my first flight in a heavy jet I put it exactly in the center of the runway. When I flew high-speed maneuvers I put them exactly on target. Nothing was happening too quickly. Sorry, this makes no sense; did the p4t math challenged guys help you out. Lear knows this is true just like he knows there are aliens on the DSOTM.

 

[bill smith]

No. You should check with the p4t expert who can do 11.2G math with out effort, without math. But you posted no real explanation for why you think there is an inconuity? What is an indonuity?

Well spotted. There we go....all fixed.