Evidence for why we know the New Testament writers told the truth.

[Ducky]

I'm only saying that for argument sake, since this is a skeptic site. I definitely believe Christianity is true. Haven't you read my threads.

Then why don't you believe all versions of Christianity are true? And if one portion isn't why are you willing to use those numbers to claim most adherents worldwide? Isn't that hypocritical?

 

[joobz]

Mormonism is closer to mainline Christianity than it is to other religions.

So, when you say:

[regarding mormonism]I wouldn't say it was very wise, I would say it is deceptive and secretive. And secrecy is a mainstay of most cults.

You don't mean it, or that it's ok to be a cult, or that you think that christian cults are better than other religions, or that you think christianity is a cult?

 

[Mojo]

I predict the farther Christ goes down the list of influential people in the future the more the world will literally and figuratively go to hell.

Actually, As christ went further down the list, we gained
1.) Women's equality
2.) Racial equality.
3.) Gay equality.
4.) Improved health care.
5.) Improved scientific understanding.

It all depends on your definition of "going to hell", I suppose.

 

[DOC]

Why aren't you a Catholic doc? They have the most adherents.

Personal preference, but I'm glad the Catholic church speaks out a lot about social issues. The differences between mainline Christian denominations aren't really that major in my opinion. Same Christ in all of them. Even Mormonism with its highly unusual concept of God and other unusual doctrines is Christ centered.

 

[joobz]

Even Mormonism with its highly unusual concept of God is Christ centered.

So why don't you believe the signed witnesses for the gold plates? Why do you not believe that they saw angels?

 

[DOC]

Actually, As christ went further down the list, we gained
1.) Women's equality
2.) Racial equality.
3.) Gay equality.
4.) Improved health care.
5.) Improved scientific understanding.

Christ hasn't gone down the list he was ranked 3 in 1976 and 3 again in 1992? Lenin and Stalin though did drop in ranking though with the fall of the Soviet Union. The list will undoubtedly change over time. But I do predict the father Christ goes down the list, the worse things will become overall.

ETA: In fact I truly believe anytime a person or a country is outside the will to God it will fail or be unsuccessful or be unfulfilled over the long run.

 

[joobz]

Christ hasn't gone down the list he was ranked 3 in 1976 and 3 again in 1992? Lenin and Stalin though did drop in ranking though with the fall of the Soviet Union. The list will undoubtedly change over time. But I do predict the father Christ goes down the list, the worse things will become overall.

Then How do you explain our willingness to accept non-christ like behaviors?

I mean we consider slavery bad, jesus didn't. What does that say about our morality vs. Jesus'?

 

[DOC]

So why don't you believe the signed witnesses for the gold plates? Why do you not believe that they saw angels?

After reading about Joseph Smith and Harris and Cowdery I don't don't believe what they saw (if anything) were truly messenger from God. Read the bios on Wiki of Harris and Cowdery and you might understand why.

 

[zooterkin]

: In fact I truly believe anytime a person or a country is outside the will to God it will fail or be unsuccessful or be unfulfilled over the long run.

In the long run, we are all dead.

 

[joobz]

After reading about Joseph Smith and Harris and Cowdery I don't don't believe what they saw (if anything) were truly messenger from God. Read the bios on Wiki of Harris and Cowdery and you might understand why.

And now you understand why I don't believe Jesus was god.

After all,
the reports of him are that he kept secrets, intentionally confused his message, and condoned slavery. None of these things are the halmarks of divinity.

 

[zooterkin]

Just in case you missed it, I'd be interested in your answer to the following:

The book was the 100 most influential people in history, not the 100 most important.

Alright then, do you believe Muhammed was more influential than Jesus Christ?

 

[L The Detective]

But if Christianity is true, then my values are right, and my prediction will be right over the long run. It is very much a prediction.

Sure, if you want to get technical, it's a prediction. It's just not a very interesting one, like I said.

I'm only saying that for argument sake, since this is a skeptic site. I definitely believe Christianity is true. Haven't you read my threads.

Is it nice for you, having all the answers? That's an honest question, no sarcasm meant. In that case, does that mean you place more importance on feeling like what you know is true, than knowing what you know is true?

 

[Mojo]

In the long run, we are all dead.

He didn't make the list.

 

[ThatSoundAgain]

Your first sentence is a joke considering my last 3 threads have averaged about 40,000 hits. Don't insult the hundreds of people who come into my threads, and your own intelligence in the process.

Just a quick point: I'm lurking in this thread (may have posted a while back), and am thus contributing to "your" hits. In no way should you take my reading along as agreement with your argument.

So why do I read it? It's true that you are continuing to provide textbook examples of logical fallacies (mainly special pleading, appeal to numbers, appeal to dubious authority, and circular reasoning), and a world-class helping of spectacular handwaving, weaving and bobbing.

But I mainly read this thread for your opponents' informative posts - I'm learning here, and what I'm learning isn't pulling me in the direction I think you'd like - quite the opposite.

Christ hasn't gone down the list he was ranked 3 in 1976 and 3 again in 1992? Lenin and Stalin though did drop in ranking though with the fall of the Soviet Union. The list will undoubtedly change over time. But I do predict the father Christ goes down the list, the worse things will become overall.

ETA: In fact I truly believe anytime a person or a country is outside the will to God it will fail or be unsuccessful or be unfulfilled over the long run.

My bold.

I'm posting this from a Scandinavian country. How do you explain that my country has only 21% of respondents say they believe in a personal god, yet has a murder rate of one seventh that of the U.S?

 

[Simon39759]

And I think Western Civilization (and eventually the whole world) will reap the consequences of increasingly putting Christ and religion on the back burner. Read the paper and watch your nightly news -- you can see it happening before your eyes. I predict the farther Christ goes down the list of influential people in the future the more the world will literally and figuratively go to hell.

Actually, if you look at it objectively, the indications would suggest that the world is moving in the right direction with a higher standard of living and life expectancies on the rise.
In the US, crime rate have been declining steadily for a while now, so that's good too.

In fact, if you look at objective studies, rather than stroking your confirmation bias, you will find that the level of Religiosity negatively correlate with the level of quality of life, increasing the rates of homicide, juvenile and early adult mortality, STD infection, teen pregnancy, and abortions.

Other studies have shown a lower rate of atheists and agnostic among the prison population.

And, because you probably think of it as a societal evil, there is a higher divorce rate among conservative Christians than the rest of the population, especially non-believers.

 

[RobRoy]

After reading about Joseph Smith and Harris and Cowdery I don't don't believe what they saw (if anything) were truly messenger from God. Read the bios on Wiki of Harris and Cowdery and you might understand why.

I'm curious, what specifically do you find objectionable regarding Harris and Cowdery? I'm reasonably familiar with both, and the other witnesses, so specifics are what I'm looking for.

What about David Whitmer? Do you have the same objections regarding the third of the Three Witnesses?

Finally, what about the Eight Witnesses?

 

[Hokulele]

Catholicism is mainline Christianity as are most of the Protestant religions. I never said it wasn't. Mormonism is based on the teaching of Christ so it should be included even though I strongly disagree with some of there doctrines. Mormonism is closer to mainline Christianity than it is to other religions.

I am somewhat surprised you haven't heard of Anglicanism. It is better known in the US as the Episcopal church. Interesting that you are using a sliding scale of judgement here, where in other posts you are more than happy to speak in binary absolutes. Rather dishonest, wouldn't you say?

And I assume you have no problem bunching agnostics and atheists in the same group.

Actually, I have a lot of problems with that, and have stated as much in many other threads.

 

[Elizabeth I]

Your first sentence is a joke considering my last 3 threads have averaged about 40,000 hits.

I see that doc:

(a) continues to confuse quantity for quality; and
(b) dishonestly neglects to mention that most people who post in his threads do so to vehemently disagree with him.

 

[L The Detective]

The reason DOC is here in the first place is just to spread his ideas. From his point of view, if even 1 person in 1,000 reads his arguments and is convinced, then he is happy. That's what I bet he'd say.

However, what he hasn't considered is that if there really were fence-sitters reading these posts, the information in this thread may very well lead them in the exact opposite direction that he'd hope. And that, the net result of this thread is either no change (likely) or even less people share his beliefs. This is a fact that DOC can absolutely never admit to himself, no matter what. This, too, is the power of faith.

 

[PrincessIneffabelle]

... and DOC trots out the "my threads are popular" reasoning again?

I should remind him that "hits" are How Idiots Track Success.