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Chiropractic stroke publicized

SteveGrenard

Philosopher
Joined
Oct 6, 2002
Messages
5,528
Billboards raising awareness about the dangers of chiropractic are popping up in Connecticut and other states. I have never heard of this apparently not uncommon side effect of spinal manipulation. I always thought "stroke" was the result of a circulatory blockage. This campaign is all over the local news (NY) tonight.

Wethersfield, CT February 18, 2009 -- The Chiropractic Stroke Awareness Group (CSAG) is flooding the State of Connecticut with outdoor advertisements. Billboards asking the questions, "Have you been injured by a chiropractic adjustment?" and "Are you aware that a chiropractic adjustment can cause a stroke?" are being erected in all geographic regions of the state, some along major interstates such as I-84 and I-95.

The goal is to ensure that survivors of chiropractic stroke know there is a place to turn for support, as well as to alert the general public to the potentially life altering risks of chiropractic treatment.

"Otherwise healthy people are having strokes just because no one told them of the risks so that they could make informed healthcare choices," said Britt Harwe the Founder of
CSAG. "Chiropractors need to step up, be responsible and just say to their patients, 'we know that that there is a possibility a spinal adjustment can cause a stroke, but now you should know it too'".

It is the objective of CSAG supporters, who have committed resources for advertisements for at least the next four years, to ensure that by the time they are through every citizen in Connecticut will be aware of the risks of chiropractic adjustment.
http://www.chiroeco.com/chiropractic/news/7413/50/Anti-Chiro-group-begins-awareness-campaign/
 
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Wow. What a great idea!!

I have a good friend who nearly died from a chiropractically-induced stroke. She had to have a stent put into the stripped blood vessel, and will be on anticoagulants for the rest of her life. She had to instantly wean her 3-1/2 month old daughter because the meds she was on were unsafe for the baby, and are passed on in the breastmilk. She was in the ICU for a couple of days, and the hospital for weeks. Fortunately, she had no lasting physical disability.

I'd like to see reporting of such events mandatory in every state. The chiropractic community claims such events are very rare--but they only count events for which the chiro is sued and/or admits liability in court. Anything handled on an out-of-court basis, or for which the patient does not go after the chiro, does not appear.

It's a crime that such a dangerous and potentially life-threatening procedure is allowed for non-life-saving "treatments" of dubious value.

Just my thoughts, Miss Kitt
 
It's about time! Now all they have to do is get the sleazy personal injury attorneys to switch sides and drive the chiropractors' insurance costs through the roof.
 
But. But. There is only one chance in a hundred trillion of that happening. :eek:

Or am I mixing the sCAMs up? ;)
 
I don't about one in a trillion but there have been studies indicating incidence is low. I think the purpose of this campaign is to make people aware of a complication which is not always discussed with patients by the chiropracter. Here is an abstract of a recent Canadian study:

Spine. 2008 Feb 15;33(4 Suppl):S170-5.
Examining vertebrobasilar artery stroke in two Canadian provinces.
Boyle E, Côté P, Grier AR, Cassidy JD.

Centre of Research Expertise for Improved Disability Outcomes, University Health Network Rehabilitation Solutions, Toronto Western Hospital, Toronto, Ontario, Canada. eboyle@uhnresearch.ca

STUDY DESIGN: Ecological study. OBJECTIVES: To determine the annual incidence of hospitalized vertebrobasilar artery (VBA) stroke and chiropractic utilization in Saskatchewan and Ontario between 1993 and 2004. To determine whether at an ecological level, the incidence of VBA stroke parallels the incidence of chiropractic utilization. SUMMARY OF BACKGROUND DATA: Little is known about the incidence and time trends of VBA stroke diagnoses in the population. Chiropractic manipulation to the neck is believed to be a risk factor for VBA stroke. No study has yet found an association between chiropractic utilization and VBA diagnoses at the population level. METHODS: All hospitalizations with discharge diagnoses of VBA stroke were extracted from administrative databases for Saskatchewan and Ontario. We included incident cases that were diagnosed between January 1993 and December 2004 for Saskatchewan and from April 1993 to March 2002 for Ontario. VBA cases that had previously been hospitalized for any stroke or transient ischemic attack (TIA) were excluded. Chiropractic utilization was measured using billing data from Saskatchewan Health and Ontario Health Insurance Plan. Denominators were derived from Statistics Canada's annual population estimates. RESULTS: The incidence rate of VBA stroke was 0.855 per 100,000 person-years for Saskatchewan and 0.750 per 100,000 person-years for Ontario. The annual incidence rate spiked dramatically with a 360% increase for Saskatchewan in 2000. There was a 38% increase for the 2000 incidence rate in Ontario. The rate of chiropractic utilization did not increase significantly during the study period. CONCLUSION: In Saskatchewan, we observed a dramatic increase in the incidence rate in 2000 and there was a corresponding relatively small increase in chiropractic utilization. In Ontario, there was a small increase in the incidence rate; however, chiropractic utilization decreased. At the ecological level, the increase in VBA stroke does not seem to be associated with an increase in the rate of chiropractic utilization.
 
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I don't about one in a trillion but there have been studies indicating incidence is low.
The incidence is low but the consequences to the individual are catastrophic and include death. When you also consider that the benefits of chiropractic are vanishingly small and a lot less compared with safer, more orthodox treatments like physiotherapy the risk-benefit calculation comes out against its use.

Why risk it when there are better and safer treatments around.

Yuri
 
So combing the best of the last 2 posts you get:

Yuri, the Spirited Away Ghost: "The incidence is low but the consequences to the individual are catastrophic and include death"
and
Skeptigirl, the Spirited Away Ghost scene: "there is zero benefit."


:D
 
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Okay, how does messing with one's spine lead to stroke? I can see spinal injuries but not stroke.
 
Skeptigirl. I think you risk dumping the baby with the bathwater here.
By your "zero benefit" statement, do you mean there is absolutely never any potential benefit from spinal manipulation?
I don't accept that myself and neither would any of the several senior physiotherapists who happen to be personal friends of mine and with whom I have discussed this at length. (None of whom is a chiropractor, by the way.)

Spinal manipulation emphatically can help some musculoskeletal problems related to posture, soft tissue damage and the like. To say otherwise is simply ignoring a vast pool of evidence. That isn't the point of this story though.

The point in this story is that spinal manipulation is potentially lethally dangerous and that fact is often ignored by chiropractors and their patients.

Lots of mainstream medicine is dangerous too. The point is that patients must be able to make informed choice that weighs risk against potential benefit.

Where chiropractors claim a potential benefit that simply does not exist-
and I think we would agree that this happens in many cases- they are being criminally negligent if they apply a potentially dangerous technique knowing it is useless. If that's what you mean, we agree completely.

But to say there is never any potential benefit just isn't true.
 
Okay, how does messing with one's spine lead to stroke? I can see spinal injuries but not stroke.
The short story is that straining your neck can tear arteries. That can happen naturally; but when it happens simultaneously on both sides, that is surely a sign one has been to a chiro. The mechanism is well understood, and it is also understood why it may take a few days to manifest itself. See: http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/chirostroke.html
 
Skeptigirl. I think you risk dumping the baby with the bathwater here. {snip}
Look here http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/ and click on the "chiropractic" category. The argument is that gentle manipulation is safer and possibly effective. The chiros exert undue force with no extra benefit.

Also, see this video (42 min.) [FONT=&quot]http://ph-ms.ouhsc.edu/ah/rehab/kinsinger.wmv[/FONT] In it, Dr. Kinsinger explains why chiros cause strokes whereas PTs do not. In short, PTs are more selective about doing neck manipulation, and better at it.

See "Manipulation of the Cervical Spine Risks and Benefits" ( [FONT=&quot]PHYS THER Vol. 79, No. 1, January 1999, pp. 50-65[/FONT]) [FONT=&quot]http://www.ptjournal.org/cgi/content/full/79/1/50[/FONT] " [FONT=&quot]The literature does not demonstrate that the benefits of MCS outweigh the risks. Several recommendations for future studies and for the practice of MCS are discussed.[/FONT]"

I have lost control of the formatting after cutting and pasting :eek:
The PT Journal article reports a long-term study of adverse reactions after manipulation. They found that fewer than 2% were caused by PTs, and no deaths were caused by PTs.
 
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Billboards raising awareness about the dangers of chiropractic are popping up in Connecticut and other states. I have never heard of this apparently not uncommon side effect of spinal manipulation. I always thought "stroke" was the result of a circulatory blockage. This campaign is all over the local news (NY) tonight.
It is gratifying to know it is in the news. However, it isn't quite new. One such billboard appeared in CT (ca. 2005?). The chiros advised the billboard owner that it would be bad for business if the message stayed up, and the owner caved and removed it.

Then (2006) the message showed up on the sides of government-owned buses. When the chiros whined, they discovered the rules are clear- if you pay for the space and have a legal message, it stays. They have also had messages on TV in CT.
 
Look here http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/ and click on the "chiropractic" category. The argument is that gentle manipulation is safer and possibly effective. The chiros exert undue force with no extra benefit.

Also, see this video (42 min.) [FONT=&quot]http://ph-ms.ouhsc.edu/ah/rehab/kinsinger.wmv[/FONT] In it, Dr. Kinsinger explains why chiros cause strokes whereas PTs do not. In short, PTs are more selective about doing neck manipulation, and better at it.

See "Manipulation of the Cervical Spine Risks and Benefits" ( [FONT=&quot]PHYS THER Vol. 79, No. 1, January 1999, pp. 50-65[/FONT]) [FONT=&quot]http://www.ptjournal.org/cgi/content/full/79/1/50[/FONT] " [FONT=&quot]The literature does not demonstrate that the benefits of MCS outweigh the risks. Several recommendations for future studies and for the practice of MCS are discussed.[/FONT]"

I have lost control of the formatting after cutting and pasting :eek:
The PT Journal article reports a long-term study of adverse reactions after manipulation. They found that fewer than 2% were caused by PTs, and no deaths were caused by PTs.

Cut & Paste is a dangerous activity...:)
Thanks for the links. My own discussions with PTs are offrecord among friends. I find what they say then is often rather different from what appears in published papers. I'd also expect (and this is purely based on what I know of humans in general) that the overlap in applied force between PT and chiro will be considerable. Don't see how that could be avoided really.
Please don't think I'm here to defend the lunacies of chiros, but as I've discussed on the forum before, I find a disparity between the JREF view of chiros in general and the reality of the chiros I have encountered. (There does seem to be a higher grasp of reality among the UK based subspecies than the American- I suspect because they find themselves working with NHS PT and OT clinics where their wilder notions are damped down, as opposed to the more isolated US practice where they communicate only with patients and other chiros). There's probably a good social studies PhD in it somewhere.
 
{snip} My own discussions with PTs are offrecord among friends. I find what they say then is often rather different from what appears in published papers. I'd also expect {snip} that the overlap in applied force between PT and chiro will be considerable. {snip}
Nonetheless, the numbers reported in the PT Journal article reveal the difference. And, yes, a lot of practitioners do not practice what they preach. They are often seduced by "in my experience ..." See http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/?p=388

[FONT=&quot]The chiro fan magazine Dynamic Chiropractic had a recent article titled "Chiropractors Eating Their Own."
[/FONT][FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]http://www.chiroweb.com/archives/26/02/11.html[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=&quot]
The author bemoans the fact that some chiros are now advertising "Spinal correction without twisting or popping the neck." He thinks this emphasis on safety makes their industry look bad.[/FONT]

Please don't think I'm here to defend the lunacies of chiros, but as I've discussed on the forum before, I find a disparity between the JREF view of chiros in general and the reality of the chiros I have encountered. {snip}
I cannot share your enthusiasm for UK chiros. Look at what Simon Singh said that generated a law suit. I have also encountered many dopey chiros on http://www.skeptics.org.uk/forum/index.php
 
Apologies for the length of this post, but I’m hoping it informs new readers.

From the CSAG campaign press release:
Chiropractors need to step up, be responsible and just say to their patients, 'we know that that there is a possibility a spinal adjustment can cause a stroke, but now you should know it too'.

That’s the same message that Simon Singh and Professor Edzard are trying to get across. On p.285 of their book, Trick or Treatment? Alternative Medicine on Trial, they propose that all chiropractors be compelled by law to disclose the following to their patients:
“WARNING: This treatment carries the risk of stroke or death if spinal manipulation is applied to the neck. Elsewhere on the spine, chiropractic therapy is relatively safe. It has shown some evidence of benefit in the treatment of back pain, but conventional treatments are usually equally effective and much cheaper. In the treatment of all other conditions, chiropractic therapy is ineffective except that it might act as a placebo.”

And, interestingly, paragraph 155 of Sandra Nette’s Complete Statement of Claim (in her ongoing class action lawsuit against the chiropractic profession in Alberta, Canada), which looks at informed consent, says:
It should be disclosed that with the possible exception of back pain, chiropractic spinal manipulation (A) Has not been shown to be effective for any medical condition. (B) The risk associated with chiropractic adjustment of the neck is unknown. (C) Alternative treatments are available. (D) In many cases, neck symptoms will go away without treatment. (E) Certain types of neck manipulation carry a higher risk than others. (F) Claims that chiropractic spinal manipulation and adjustment can remedy systematic diseases, boost immunity, improve general health, or prolong life have neither scientific justification nor a plausible rational.

Note, also, that page 42 of the Claim carries a ‘confidential’ Malpractice Alert from 1981 for members of the International Chiropractic Association. It begins:
Evidence has now accumulated to the point that the chiropractic profession can no longer ignore the increasing incidents of strokes occurring concomitant with cervical manipulation.

Read on…
http://www.casewatch.org/mal/nette/claim.pdf

It's a crime that such a dangerous and potentially life-threatening procedure is allowed for non-life-saving "treatments" of dubious value.

Just my thoughts, Miss Kitt

My thoughts too.

I'd like to see reporting of such events mandatory in every state.

We could do with that here in the UK as well. Interestingly, in August 2005, the UK chiropractic regulatory body, the General Chiropractic Council (GCC), informed the UK-based group, Action for Victims of Chiropractic (AVC), that it understood that the British Chiropractic Association (BCA) was in the process of establishing a database to which patients could report any adverse events they might experience following treatment. See the letter that the GCC sent to AVC in the August 2005 news item in this link:
http://www.chirovictims.org.uk/victims/news.html

Then, the following month, in response to a news story 'Survey questions safety of alternative medicine' (Nature 346,898; 200510.1038/436898b) which quoted Edzard Ernst as saying that complementary and alternative medicine organisations were not doing enough to monitor adverse reactions, a representative of the BCA, Barry Lewis, responded by saying that, in conjunction with the Anglo European Chiropractic College, the BCA had set up a "chiropractic reporting and learning system" and went on to say that:
More than 1,200 practitioners who are members of the BCA have recently received an information pack to enable them to participate in the scheme. Resulting data will be analysed at the Anglo-European Chiropractic College and outcomes will be relayed to the profession, through our newsletter, journal and website, so practitioners may learn from the experience of others. The intention is that the scheme will, if successful, be offered to other chiropractic associations within Europe in 2006.

http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v437/n7058/full/437476d.html

However, one can only assume that the scheme was unsuccessful since no chiropractic professional body in the UK seems to have made any further mention of it despite the fact that Item 7 of the Minutes of the GCC’s 2nd March 2006 meeting stated very clearly that:
If chiropractors are to provide a safe clinical experience for patients then a reporting procedure needs to be put in place, within the clinics and within the profession as a whole, which allows for adverse events and near misses to be shared on an anonymised basis so that we can all learn from them.

http://www.gcc-uk.org/files/link_file/C-020306-Open1.pdf

It all seems to confirm Dr Harriet Hall’s views in her recent blog post entitled “Chiropractic’s Pathetic Response to Stroke Concerns”:
http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/?p=362

I think the purpose of this campaign is to make people aware of a complication which is not always discussed with patients by the chiropracter.

Apparently true:
Consent: Its Practices and Implications in United Kingdom and United States Chiropractic Practice

Results from this survey suggest a patient's autonomy and right to self-determination may be compromised when seeking chiropractic care. Difficulties and omissions in the implementation of valid consent processes appear common, particularly in relation to risk.

Langworthy JM, and Cambron J, Institute for Musculoskeletal Research and Clinical Implementation, [AECC], Bournemouth, UK, July-August 2007
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/e...ez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

It’s also worth noting that in a recent investigation (“Consent or submission? The practice of consent within UK chiropractic”), which focused on approaches to consent of a small sample of practicing UK chiropractors, only 23% reported that they always discussed serious risk with their patients, and over one third did not advise patients of alternative available treatments despite their being legally obliged to obtain informed consent from their patients to ensure that patients understand the principal benefits, risks and alternatives regarding their proposed treatment. See here:

J. M. Langworthy and C. le Fleming, Institute of Musculoskeletal Research and Clinical Implementation, AECC, UK Journal of Manipulative and Physiological Therapeutics, January 2005
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...ve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=15726031

Okay, how does messing with one's spine lead to stroke? I can see spinal injuries but not stroke.

In addition to JJM’s link to Chirobase above, also see Dr Harriet Hall’s analysis of chiropractic and stroke here:
http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/?p=94

Where chiropractors claim a potential benefit that simply does not exist - and I think we would agree that this happens in many cases- they are being criminally negligent if they apply a potentially dangerous technique knowing it is useless.

All of which makes you wonder how the UK regulators manage to evade accountability for being less than robust in their primary duties to protect patients and set standards - especially when you consider that some of the following treatments are likely to include unnecessary neck manipulations…
Overall, mechanical conditions of the musculoskeletal system were felt to be treated effectively by chiropractic intervention and there was 100% agreement that it was beneficial in treating mechanical dysfunctions of the spine. Non-musculoskeletal conditions in adults, including asthma (64%), gastro-intestinal complaints (61%) and pre-menstrual syndrome (PMS) (70%), were considered conditions that can benefit from chiropractic management. Opinions on the treatment of osteoporosis (43%), obesity (26%), hypertension (42%) and infertility (30%) were less conclusive. Childhood musculoskeletal and muscular conditions, infantile colic, otitis media and asthma were perceived to benefit from chiropractic intervention by more than 50% of the respondents.

-snip-

Traditional chiropractic beliefs (chiropractic philosophy) were deemed important by 76% of the respondents and 63% considered subluxation to be central to chiropractic intervention.


Aranka Pollentier and Jennifer M. Langworthy, The scope of chiropractic practice: A survey of chiropractors in the UK. Clinical Chiropractic, Volume 10, Issue 3, September 2007, pp147-155.
http://www.cam-research-group.co.uk...linical Chiropractic 2007 10 3 pg 147-155.pdf


In view of the above, the following, IMO, is what needs to be made widely known to the general public (in addition to the proposals made by Singh and Ernst):
Chiropractic is perhaps the most common and egregious example of the bait and switch in medicine…

..someone may go to see a chiropractor and think they will be seeing a medical professional who will treat their musculoskeletal symptoms, but in reality they will see the practitioner of a cult philosophy of energy healing…

The bait - claims that chiropractors are medical practitioners with expertise in the musculoskeletal system. The switch - practitioners of discredited pseudosciences that have nothing to do with the musculoskeletal system…

A more subtle form of the bait and switch among chiropractors is the treatment of musculoskeletal symptoms with standard physical therapy or sports medicine practices under the name of chiropractic manipulation. Ironically, the more honest and scientific practitioners among chiropractors are most likely to commit this subtle deception. The problem comes not from the treatment itself but the claim that such treatments are ‘chiropractic’…

But by doing so and calling it ‘chiropractic’ it legitimizes the pseudoscientific practices that are very common within the profession - like treating non-existent ‘subluxations’ in order to free up the flow of innate intelligence.

The Bait and Switch of Unscientific Medicine (Steven Novella)
http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/?p=156
 
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For an extended discussion of chiropractic therapy see

Simon Singh and Edzard Ernst (2008) "Trick or Treatment: Alternative Medicine on Trial", Bantam Press, ISBN 9780593061299.

Their conclusion is that chiropractic therapy may sometimes work for lower back pain, but there are cheaper conventional treatments which are at least as effective. Moreover, under no circumstances should you permit them to even touch your neck let alone manipulate it.

They also discuss in detail homeopathy, acupuncture and herbal medicine, as well as providing a "rapid guide" to other forms of alternative medicine. Their general conclusion is, not surprisingly woo-woo.

[Sorry Blue Woad. You posted whilst I was composing this!]
 
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When you weigh risk vs benefit, the scale tips toward rejecting spinal manipulation because there is zero benefit.
"'I'm an orthopedic spine surgeon, so I treat all sorts of back problems, and I'm a big believer in chiropractic,' says William Lauerman, chief of spine surgery and a professor of orthopedic surgery at Georgetown University Hospital. 'I'm more of a believer for acute problems like short-term back pain, although I know [chiropractic] can be helpful for some cases of more-chronic conditions.'" See http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/07/13/AR2007071301836.html
 
I LIVE in Wethersfield. I've been seeing these billboards for months. Next time I pass one on my way to see my son, I'll snap a picture of it!
 
"'I'm an orthopedic spine surgeon, so I treat all sorts of back problems, and I'm a big believer in chiropractic,' says William Lauerman, chief of spine surgery and a professor of orthopedic surgery at Georgetown University Hospital. 'I'm more of a believer for acute problems like short-term back pain, although I know [chiropractic] can be helpful for some cases of more-chronic conditions.'" See http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/07/13/AR2007071301836.html

So the opinions of individual physicians can be taken as more reliable than evidence-based recommendations? Cool, I've always wanted others to regard me as infallible.

Excuse me, I'm off to wield some power.

Linda
 

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