Moderated Steel structures cannot globally collapse due to gravity alone

not quite, they refused to do one, even though the american society of quality control of which I am a fellow and longtime member - our governing body and membership requested on 14 times to date.

also, i asked the group here for a FMEA from the NIST, bot pre and post destruction, of the design as well as the construction and the assembly..a


all buildings have to have one for the past 40 years, this is nothing new in the construction or manufacturing field.
 
Hey. Bob's back! *Bump*:

ElMondoHummus said:
bob the analyst said:
nonsense...you have never looked at the application of fire proofing of steel--you don't know what is acceptable, what is required, what is suggested...where it is used and when within the building structure itself......stop with the fire proofing crap already, you are fast becomming non-essential to this group and it's discussion...
like I said..it's like the extra coating of rustproofing on a new car...it's all crap..everyone knows that
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"It's all crap...". I'm not really sure you've made a supportable assertion, bob. The Lamont, Lane, Jowsey, Flint, Usmani, and Torero paper done for the JCSS and IABSE Workshop on Robustness of Structures is one example of how seriously structural safety researchers take the concept. And again, fire resistance is specified by a given city's or area's building code, and unprotected steel doesn't meet that in most localities.

Yes, it's true that I and most others here haven't seen it applied or can't say what level is acceptible without looking it up. Of course we can't; again, many of us here are not structural engineers. But again, it doesn't matter. Such fireproofing is necessary for structures to meet code, structural safety researchers take such elements very seriously, and one of the major points of the NIST study as well as the Arup/University of Edinburgh critiques of that specific point was centered around the loss or question of adequacy of the fireproofing. So the evidence is against your assertions, bob.

On top of that, the poster named Architect here is a tall structures architect. And he's often spoken up on the importance of fireproofing; use the search tool and look up his posts ont he topic. Furthermore, while many of us aren't engineers, some here are, and I've yet to see a single one of them post anything that even comes close to agreeing with what you've said.

Where's your evidence that fireproofing is "crap", and a value-added item like car rustproofing? Mind providing something to back that up? Something besides your opinion, that is?
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So, you mind supporting your assertion that fireproofing is "crap" with something that's actually solid?
 
So bob;
I see you moved the goal posts on your FMEA request.

Now, Why do you think we should take your nonsense seriously?

BTW The ABC with the check mark will correct your atrocious spelling. (the grammar, your own your own).
 
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bob the analyst said:
not quite, they refused to do one, even though the american society of quality control of which I am a fellow and longtime member - our governing body and membership requested on 14 times to date.

also, i asked the group here for a FMEA from the NIST, bot pre and post destruction, of the design as well as the construction and the assembly..a


all buildings have to have one for the past 40 years, this is nothing new in the construction or manufacturing field.
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Bull crap! (I don't have a GIF for that)

Edit; Please click on the "reply" or "quote" tabs so we know who you're responding to. (they're at the lower right corner of the post) (your welcome)
 
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bob the analyst said:
not quite, they refused to do one, even though the american society of quality control of which I am a fellow and longtime member - our governing body and membership requested on 14 times to date.

also, i asked the group here for a FMEA from the NIST, bot pre and post destruction, of the design as well as the construction and the assembly..a


all buildings have to have one for the past 40 years, this is nothing new in the construction or manufacturing field.
Click to expand...

So if I was to ask you to supply one for any building on the planet , you could do so? Or you could tell me exaclty where to get one, right?

Can you please provide the FMEA for the Mandarin Oriental hotel ? Both that is, the one before the fire and the one after. Ta
 
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Bob:
Do you know how A-36 (or the like) designation would be applied to steel? I don't think you do. Who's giving you these stupid questions to ask?
 
have you been able to deliver a FMEA, what's the problem, everything that you hold sacred in relation to the accuracy and authenticity of the NIST report is based on FMEA's


better giddy'up
 
bob the analyst said:
have you been able to deliver a FMEA, what's the problem, everything that you hold sacred in relation to the accuracy and authenticity of the NIST report is based on FMEA's


better giddy'up
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Yes, The NIST report (it wasn't me personally that made it :D). Do you have a learning disability we should know about? (thanks Gravy, I like that one).
 
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bob the analyst said:
have you been able to deliver a FMEA, what's the problem, everything that you hold sacred in relation to the accuracy and authenticity of the NIST report is based on FMEA's


better giddy'up
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After you Bob,

So if I was to ask you to supply one for any building on the planet , you could do so? Or you could tell me exaclty where to get one, right?

Can you please provide the FMEA for the Mandarin Oriental hotel ? Both that is, the one before the fire and the one after. Ta
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Well?
 
ahh geeze skippy, I better slow you down, before you even get into the area of firproofing and whether or not the steel was superficially harmed or harmed at a micro-structure level...you will have to come up with your mass spectrometer readings of the damaged vs. the un-damaged steel from numerous sections of all 3 wtc buidlings,.

this is the way it works in the real world of applications

the we could order up the original kept samples and metallurgical analysis from the casting and rolling mills when the steel was poured into various heats.

I know this sounds a lot like technical jargon, but this is the ultimate reality show of put up or shut up.

It's where I paint the shills of the world into a corner...ask TFK and numerous others, I am legend
 
bob the analyst said:
the american society of quality control of which I am a fellow and longtime member - our governing body and membership requested on 14 times to date.
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Are you an active enough member to know what it's actually called?

You appear to be in violation of its Code of Ethics.

American Society for Quality said:
Relations With the Public

1.1 Each Society member will do whatever he can to promote the reliability and safety of all products that come within his jurisdiction.

1.2 He will endeavor to extend public knowledge of the work of the Society and its members that relates to the public welfare.

1.3 He will be dignified and modest in explaining his work and merit.

1.4 He will preface any public statements that he may issue by clearly indicating on whose behalf they are made.
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Dave
 
bob the analyst said:
not quite, they refused to do one, even though the american society of quality control of which I am a fellow and longtime member - our governing body and membership requested on 14 times to date.

also, i asked the group here for a FMEA from the NIST, bot pre and post destruction, of the design as well as the construction and the assembly..a


all buildings have to have one for the past 40 years, this is nothing new in the construction or manufacturing field.
Click to expand...

I'm a RAB accredited Lead Auditor (2003). I'm sure you don't know much about FMEA's and NCSTAR to be asking silly questions like this.

Can you cite anything to support your claim that and FMEA is required after a controlled demolition? :)
 
stateofgrace said:
So if I was to ask you to supply one for any building on the planet , you could do so? Or you could tell me exaclty where to get one, right?

Can you please provide the FMEA for the Mandarin Oriental hotel ? Both that is, the one before the fire and the one after. Ta
Click to expand...

Still waiting Bob, where are they?
 
bob the analyst said:
ahh geeze skippy, I better slow you down, before you even get into the area of firproofing and whether or not the steel was superficially harmed or harmed at a micro-structure level...you will have to come up with your mass spectrometer readings of the damaged vs. the un-damaged steel from numerous sections of all 3 wtc buidlings,.

this is the way it works in the real world of applications

the we could order up the original kept samples and metallurgical analysis from the casting and rolling mills when the steel was poured into various heats.

I know this sounds a lot like technical jargon, but this is the ultimate reality show of put up or shut up.

It's where I paint the shills of the world into a corner...ask TFK and numerous others, I am legend
Click to expand...
Would you mind translating this gibberish into English so us rational people can understand? Thanks in advance.
 
bob the analyst said:
before you even get into the area of firproofing and whether or not the steel was superficially harmed or harmed at a micro-structure level...you will have to come up with your mass spectrometer readings of the damaged vs. the un-damaged steel from numerous sections of all 3 wtc buidlings
Click to expand...

What exactly is a mass spec analysis going to tell you about the microstructure of the steel?

Dave
 
what is this? re-runs of the old gong show? does anyone here even understand the basic metrics of steel metallurgical analysis? how steel is even manufactured, poured, rolled, tested and validated? I thought this forum was on the ball.

we have not even been able to get the basic tenets of a defense mechanism from the shills and lord guardians of the NIST report to step up to the plate

no DVPR
no metallurgy reports
no FMEA's


what's going to happen when I push the envelope into transthermal expansion and collapse dynamics

energy absoption

transfer of loads

impact testing

the list is endless the amount of omni-potent things that the NIST flat out refused to acknowledge of if the did test for it, they never reported it as most engineers and common sense thinkers see as likely
 
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