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Architects and Engineers for 9/11 Truth

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There is nothing to indicate any conflict of ideas in that list, they all agree that fire resulting from the planes crashing was a factor.

which is that towers likely would have collapsed from the fires alone, even without the structural and fireproofing damage caused by airliners hitting them.

Without knowing the full context that does not suggest he thinks the collapse that actually occured was nothing to do with the structural damage or the damage to the fireproofing.
 
http://video.aol.com/video-detail/molten-steel-found-in-ruins-of-world-trade-center/1524185349

heres baart vorsanger ,yes he did say that.


nice twisting gravy ,you really should work for the media or something.

As for james quintere ,gage never said he supported controlled demolotion.He said he Supports a new investigation.

New Mexico demolitions expert Van Romero said on the day of the attack that he believed the building collapses were "too methodical" to have been a result of the collisions, and that he thought "there were some explosive devices inside the buildings that caused the towers to collapse." His remarks were published in the Albuquerque Journal 1 and are reprinted below. Ten days later the same newspaper printed a retraction, in which Romero is quoted as saying "Certainly the fire is what caused the building to fail." 2 His assertion of the official line in the second article is not backed up by any explanation or analysis.

"It appeared to me that charges had been placed in the building," said Mr. Hamburger, chief structural engineer for ABS Consulting in Oakland, Calif. Upon learning that no bombs had been detonated, "I was very surprised," said Mr. Hamburger. The buildings "certainly did not do as well as I would have hoped." 3
Hamburger may not have retracted this statement, but he went on to co-lead the ASCE/FEMA investigation, which avoided even considering the possibility of demolition, and apparently failed to look for evidence of explosives. Hamburger is listed as an author on the two Chapters of the FEMA Report covering the Twin Towers: Chapter 1 and Chapter 2.

im guessing when they found out that al qaeda couldnt have planted the explosives, the implications that someone american did it made them change their mind due to usual patriotic bias


As for molten metal witness


Joe Allbaugh, the Director of FEMA, was interviewed by Bryant Gumbel of CBS news on October 10 2001:
GUMBEL: We’re seeing a lot of video of smoke pouring up from the debris.
ALLBAUGH: Correct.
GUMBEL: And we’re hearing there are places where temperatures are still approaching and sometimes exceeding a thousand degrees.
ALLBAUGH: That’s right.
GUMBEL: Why? Why do we have these hot spots? What’s going on?
ALLBAUGH: Well, you have normal debris, you know, computers, paper, you have some areas that are hot pockets because of fuel. It’s just too hot for rescuers to get into those areas. So we do not know yet what’s in those areas, other than very hot, molten material. (FEMA.gov)
Source publication date: CBS Early Show 10/04/01
Interviewer: Bryant Gumbel
Witness: Joe Allbaugh
Date molten metal was observed: up to 10/04/01

Leslie Robertson, the structural engineer responsible for World Trade Centers 1, 2, 4, 5, 6 and all subgrade levels, stated "As of 21 days after the attack, the fires were still burning and molten steel was still running." (SEAU.org)
Source publication date: SEAU News Volume VI Issue II 10/2001
Interviewer: James M.Williams October 5, 2001 National Council of Structural Engineers Associations 9th Annual Conference.
Witness: Leslie Robertson
Date molten metal was observed: up to 10/02/01

"I saw melting of girders in World Trade Center." said the first structural engineer given access to the WTC steel. (pbs.org) (audio_pbs.org)

"I talked to many contractors and they said they actually saw molten metal trapped, beams had just totally had been melted because of the heat." said Chaplain Herb Trimpe (recordonline.com) (audio)

Peter Tully, president of Tully Construction of Flushing, N.Y., told AFP that he saw pools of “literally molten steel” at the World Trade Center. (americanfreepress.net)
Source publication date: 09/03/2002
Witness: Peter Tully
Date molten metal was observed: "more than a month after the collapse" up to 10/11/01

A NY firefighter described steel flowing at ground zero. "You'd get down below and you'd see molten steel — molten steel! — running down the channel rails. Like you're in a foundry... like lava... from a volcano. (video) (source) (hi-res_source)

A reporter with rare access to the debris at ground zero "descended deep below street level to areas where underground fires still burned and steel flowed in molten streams." (theatlantic.com) (cached_copy)
Source publication date: July/August 2002 Atlantic Monthly

The owner of Controlled Demolition Inc., Mark Loizeaux stated the molten steel was found “three, four, and five weeks later, when the rubble was being removed,”. He said molten steel was also found at 7 WTC, which collapsed mysteriously in the late afternoon. (americanfreepress.net)

Fires burned and molten steel flowed in the pile of ruins still settling beneath her feet. -Sarah Atlas of New Jersey’s Task Force One Urban Search and Rescue (upenn.edu)

"Fires are still actively burning and the smoke is very intense," reports Alison Geyh, PhD. "In some pockets now being uncovered, they are finding molten steel." (jhsph.edu)

A veteran of disasters from the Mississippi floods Mt. St. Helens, Burger said it reminded him most of the volcano, if he forgot he was in downtown Manhattan. “Feeling the heat, seeing the molten steel, the layers upon layers of ash, like lava, it reminded me of Mt. St. Helen’s and the thousands who fled that disaster,” he said. Additionally he stated "Shards of steel lay upon shards of steel, shifting and unstable, uncovering red hot metal beams excavated from deep beneath layers of sub-floors, exposing further dark crevasses." (neha.org)

"They showed us many fascinating slides" he continued, "ranging from molten metal which was still red hot weeks after the event, to 4-inch thick steel plates sheared and bent in the disaster." -Dr Keith Eaton (istructe.org.uk)

"Smoke constantly poured from the peaks. One fireman told us that there was still molten steel at the heart of the towers' remains. Firemen sprayed water to cool the debris down but the heat remained intense enough at the surface to melt their boots." -Guy Lounsbury of New York Air National Guard's 109th Air Wing (source)

A NY Department of Sanitation spokeswoman said "for about two and a half months after the attacks, in addition to its regular duties, NYDS played a major role in debris removal - everything from molten steel beams to human remains...." (wasteage.com)

"the ominous groaning of weakened structures overhead, or, in the early days, the streams of molten metal that leaked from the hot cores and flowed down broken walls inside the foundation hole." -William Langewiesche (source_p32) (cached_copy)

He remembers seeing in the darkness a distant, pinkish glow–molten metal dripping from a beam–but found no signs of life. -Lee Turner of The Boone County Firefighters (usnews.com)

“In the first few weeks, sometimes when a worker would pull a steel beam from the wreckage, the end of the beam would be dripping molten steel,” Fuchek said. (gcn.com)

As late as five months after the attacks, in February 2002, firefighter Joe O'Toole saw a steel beam being lifted from deep underground at Ground Zero, which, he says, "was dripping from the molten steel." (fallenbrothers.com)

...numerous fires were still burning and smoldering. Underground it was still so hot that molten metal dripped down the sides of the wall from Building 6. (9-11commission.gov) (2) (3)

Richard Garlock, a structural engineer for LERA said "Going below, it was smoky and really hot... The debris past the columns was red-hot, molten, running." (pbs.org)

Vance Deisingnore, OSHA Officer at WTC, reported the following to Jim McKay, Post-Gazette Staff Writer, on September 11, 2002 "a fire truck 10 feet below the ground that was still burning two weeks after the Tower collapsed, its metal so hot that it looked like a vat of molten steel." (thenewliberator.com)

Father Edward A. Malloy, on site 40 days after the disaster stated "Firefighters atop a number of ladder trucks were spraying in the areas of greatest smoke. The average temperature beneath the rubble is said to be 1500F so that when steel is brought up it is molten and takes two or three days to cool down." (nd.edu)

Ed Pfister, a veteran of three hurricanes and two flood relief efforts, and a member of the elite Disaster Medical Assistance Team, wrote in his diary "deep below ground a portion of the pile was still on fire and boiled with molten material. Sometimes, open flame would erupt as a crane pulled debris out and air rushed in. Fire hoses constantly poured streams of water causing huge billowing steam clouds to rise up over the site into the huge lights above." (NIH.gov)
Source publication date: 10/30/2001
Interviewer: Rich McManus

Guy Lounsbury with the 109th Air Wing of the New York Air National Guard wrote "The men who work on this must constantly change their boots as the heat melts them. Two weeks after the attack, one fireman told us that there was still molten steel at the heart of the towers’ remains." (nycap.rr.com)

A group of veteran ironworkers eating lunch while staring at the steel skeleton of a new building going up on West Third Street when one commented on "how much easier it was to eat a sandwich in front of steel that was strong and straight and new, not molten and mangled and laden with debris." (nytimes.com)

Fire Department Chief Mike Donoho of Texas Task Force 1 Urban Search and Rescue described the scope of the destruction, "Everything had its own look. In the area surrounding what was the two twin towers, there were several buildings still standing that were burned from top to bottom, and some of them were damaged by the collapse. But the two towers — they were 110-story buildings. And there was nothing that you could put your hands on that resembled anything that would tell you this once was two 110-story office buildings. What you had were large columns of steel that were just stuck into massive amounts of molten steel and other metals, that had just fused together from the heat and bonded together from the strength of the collapse. We dug and we dug and we dug, and we cut and we cut and we cut, and we did not see anything that resembled any type of furniture, any type of personal belongings. We found some pieces of things like a telephone, things like that. I think we found credit cards a few times, and we found a couple of stuffed animals. But you would expect to see, like, a bunch of desks, a bunch of chairs. The only way I can explain it is, if you take a car and put it in one of those machines where they crush it and make it look like a cube, and you can’t recognize what it is, that’s what the whole area looked like. It looked like a massive, molten mess that had been fused together, like a car that had been cubed and crushed. With all that heavy, heavy stuff, there were wires, rebar, concrete. Most of it was just steel. A lot of what we were walking on was just molten steel. (theeagle.com)

The workers go through three pairs of rubber boots a day because they melt in the three-week-old fire of molten metal and jet fuel. The health hazards are everywhere: the fire, molten metal, the lack of breathable air and 3000+ decomposing bodies. (illusiongenius.com)

Each story has its differences. Some told of 10-hour car drives and arriving in the black of night, the same calendar day as the towers were hit. Others remembered taking military transport - a C- 141 in Deeds' case - a few days later. Others remember molten metal still dripping under the Pile more than a week after the attack. (source)

"In mid-October, in the evening," said Thomas A. Cahill, a retired professor of physics and atmospheric science at the University of California, Davis, "when they would pull out a steel beam, the lower part would be glowing dull red, which indicates a temperature on the order of 500 to 600 °C. And we know that people were turning over pieces of concrete in December that would flash into fire - which requires about 300 °C. So the surface of the pile cooled rather rapidly, but the bulk of the pile stayed hot all the way to December." (acs.org)

Some beams pulled from the wreckage are still red hot more than 7 weeks after the attack, and it is suspected that temperatures beneath the debris pile are well in excess of 1,000°F. (liro.com)

Ferer was one of several people in a visiting United Services Organization (USO)-Tribeca group who had lost family members. As they visited troops, they carried Port Authority pins, baseball caps, and a piece of molten steel from the WTC. (wiley.com)

No matter when they went, the odor of molten steel, pulverized concrete and charred flesh burned their throats, lingering in their lungs. (ecnext.com)

New York mayor Rudy Giuliani said "They were standing on top of a cauldron. They were standing on top of fires 2,000 degrees that raged for a hundred days." (nymag.com)

Another danger involved the high temperature of twisted steel pulled from the rubble. Underground fires burned at temperatures up to 2,000 degrees. As the huge cranes pulled steel beams from the pile, safety experts worried about the effects of the extreme heat on the crane rigging and the hazards of contact with the hot steel. And they were concerned that applying water to cool the steel could cause a steam explosion that would propel nearby objects with deadly force. Special expertise was needed. OSHA called in structural engineers from its national office to assess the situation. They recommended a special handling procedure, including the use of specialized rigging and instruments to reduce the hazards. (OSHA.gov)

The "hot spots", where intensely burning debris generated temperatures in excess of 1300 degrees Fahrenheit, posed a significant danger to relief workers. NASA had an instrument that could provide information that would be useful to emergency responders. NASA's Airborne Visible infrared Imaging Spectrometer (AVIRIS) science instrument was capable of providing data that could be used to filter smoke and locate extreme hot spots. (erau.edu)

The temperature at the core of "the pile," is near 2000 degrees Fahrenheit, according to fire officials (abcnews.go.com)

Firefighters and other responders contended with intense heat associated with the super-heated steel for weeks; some were coming back from shifts with the bottoms of their boots melted. (gwu.edu)

Two weeks after the attack, the rubble, the Pile, is still 7 stories tall. Below, in the Pit it burns like the gates of hell. It is 1200 degrees, so hot that the steel work lifted by the grapplers comes out soft. I've never seen anything like this". (ukfssart.org.uk)

"The fires are so hot in pockets on the Pile that some of the firefighters change boots 3-4 times a day. Smoke and flame come up from the Pit deep within the Pile when a piece of heavy equipment with a huge grappler pulls out a mass that allows a swish of oxygen inside". (ukfssart.org.uk)

The rubble pile was so hot in places that it melted the soles of work boots. Companies donated supplies of work shoes, and construction workers laboring on the hotter parts of the rubble pile reportedly went through a pair a day. A boot wash was established where workers
could cool their feet. (rand.org)

Firemen and hazardous materials experts stated that, six weeks after 9/11, "There are pieces of steel being pulled out [from as far as six stories underground] that are still cherry red" and "the blaze is so 'far beyond a normal fire' that it is nearly impossible to draw conclusions about it based on other fires." (nydailynews.com) (cached_copy)

Ground Zero at the World Trade Center was a search site like few others after a major disaster event. Multiple sources of hazards were everywhere. There were shards of steel piled on steel, a two-million-ton pile of debris, red hot steel beams still being pulled from the earth, crevasses, holes, unstable ground, still burning fires, possible asbestos exposure, and caustic fumes that may have contained mixtures of benzene, methane gas and other chemicals. (michigan.gov) (maloney.house.gov)

"The first indication of "Ground Zero" is the smoke. It's still smoking. Many of the beams are still red hot as they are uncovered, and start new fires as the oxygen reaches them." -Congressman Pete Hoekstra (hoekstra.house.gov)

The pile of debris after 30 days of removal operations was still gigantic, over three stories high, with structural steel projecting 7-10 stories into the air. The steam, dust, noise, steel and myriad activities were larger than anything I have ever seen. Temperatures in the pile were over 1,200 °F. Every time an area was opened, fire started in any buried combustible debris. Water trucks and fire engines were used continually. The high temperature debris and water created steam. (army.mil) (cached_copy)

"It was determined that 3 million gallons of water were hosed on site in the fire-fighting efforts between 9/11 and 9/21"... "In addition, there were 2 episodes of rain during the same 10 day period after the attack: on 9/14 and 9/20, totaling 0.9 million gallons of water per Bathtub area. Considering the neighboring area, one can take 1 million gallons from the rain. Therefore, a total of 4 million gallons of water percolated through the debris in the first 10 days and collected at the bottom of the Bathtub." (llnl.gov)

2000 gallons of Pyrocool FEF foaming agent were sprayed on the "pile" starting September 28th. (newscientist.com)

"You couldn't even begin to imagine how much water was pumped in there," said Tom Manley of the Uniformed Firefighters Association, the largest fire department union. "It was like you were creating a giant lake." (cbsnews.com)

Both NYCDDC and OSHA officials told us that the WTC site was under continuous dust suppression, and the latter said this dust suppression was very successful. An EPA On-Scene Coordinator told us that once dust suppression began, water was sprayed wherever there was dust and, to the best of his knowledge, this practice was successful. (salemstate.edu_p46)

"When I am not moving, I notice that the soles of my boots are melting from the heat inside the pile of debris." (source)

"As in a stubborn coal mine fire, the combustion taking place deep below the surface is in many places not a fire at all. Instead, oxygen is charring the surfaces of buried fuels in a slow burn more akin to what is seen in the glowing coals of a raked-over campfire. But the scale of the trade center burning is vast, with thousands of plastic computers, acres of flammable carpet, tons of office furniture and steel and reservoirs of hydraulic oil and other fuels piled upon one another. Steel beams pulled from the debris at times are so hot they are cherry red. Benzene, propylene, styrene and other chemicals generated by the combustion of computers, office products and fuels drift through the air." (nytimes.com)
 
And how does any of that support your contention that the WTC was brought down by CD, GIE?
 
I wonder why freshkills didnt save these peices of steel ,for further testing

a838_abolhassan_astaneh_20500817-1.jpg


576d026223582a3L.jpg


018yl71-2.jpg
 
As late as five months after the attacks, in February 2002, firefighter Joe O'Toole saw a steel beam being lifted from deep underground at Ground Zero, which, he says, "was dripping from the molten steel." (fallenbrothers.com)

If there's any truth in that then that would suggest to me that there was something other than a substance intended to release it's energy quickly (therm?te/explosives etc. for your demolition theory) burning and it would void all argument based on hot spots in the debris.

Unless you're claiming it was super-slow-burning-super-nano-thermate.
 
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As for james quintere ,gage never said he supported controlled demolotion.He said he Supports a new investigation.

im guessing when they found out that al qaeda couldnt have planted the explosives, the implications that someone american did it made them change their mind due to usual patriotic bias ...
Quintiere Quintere (cute lower case kid) said fire did it! LOL

What? Why are you apologizing for terrorists?
Many reasons there were no explosives on 911.
Not one person died from a BOMB blast!
Not one piece of steel was found to be subjected to a BOMB BLAST!
Not one explosive SOUND from a BOMB BLAST on 911!

So, your delusion remains a delusion made up by frauds.

As for the molten STEEL! You just SPAMed the most hearsay I have seen in a while. Al wheels melt, and many other metals would melt in the fire. Cherry picking news articles are not the stuff of science studies; learn what hearsay is. Hearing a story is called hearsay, not facts.

As for the fused floors photo, pretty hard for paper to remain paper in a molten steel glob, so you must be delusional if you persist in saying the multiple floors shown to you in photo form were melted steel. The floors were smashed together, the 4-inch light weight concrete floors on metal pans are pancaked together with office contents smashed. No thermite was used to bring down the WTC, no thermite was responsible for the fires burning for months. Fires under the WTC pile were office contents, plastics, rugs, and other stuff you find in an office building with 110 acres of office space, like the fire and contents of over 330 homes in my neighbor hood! Your lack of knowledge is your problem when you are duped by Gage and SPAM with his standard junk, hearsay, lies, and fantasy the people who lack knowledge and sound judgment repeat like trained cult members.

You are at the bottom of the pit of ignorance Gage has built based on delusions. Good luck climbing out as you spew junk from Gage and look no further to improve your position.
 
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You are a fraud. This was cut after 911. Fraud!

Terrorist apologist spend second to post fraud. You spent 10 seconds on the Internet to post a fraud. Your entire research was 10 second of actual thought and you posted A LIE!
You found Gage, the Jim Jones of his 911 cult of dupes who spew delusional conclusions on 911. Dr Thermite Jones seems to be the Christ figure, and you have drank the Kool-aid and you are ready to be picked up by Comet Hale-Gage any moment.

Wow, you spend a few seconds searching the Internet and post pure stupid. Cool
 
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GIE you do know that workers cut the hell out of those beams when they were cleaning up, right? Exactly how do you know that beam wasn't cut AFTER the collapse? Don't you even care?
 
Great to see Mark's posts :).

But I still don't believe the likes of Gage or Griffin are mentally ill, as I understand it. There is just something terribly wrong with their belief systems and self-deception (or it's all about the money and feeling important).
I've never made an armchair psychiatrist's assessment of Griffin. He seems to be quite careful about not putting his personality (what little there may be of it) in the fore, not engaging with opponents, and not making the most extreme claims (or at least not making them so obviously), to keep his for-profit venture going. He's cagey.

Gage strikes me as being very different. He's a full-blown kook, unafraid to make a fool of himself. He has publicly committed to living in a dark, absurd fantasy, which has negatively affected at least his personal life. He does not seem capable of analyzing his own claims or thinking anything through. When his gross errors are pointed out to him, he just digs his heels in deeper.

Okay, let's say that 90,000 tons of structural steel really was turned to a fine powder in a few seconds at the WTC. Forget the facts that no such steel was missing and no such quantity of steel powder was there. The next step is to ask what mechanism could cause that to happen. Little gremlins attacking the towers with grinders as they fell? Rapid chemical decomposition? Nuclear weapons? No: a Hiroshima-sized nuclear blast could vaporize some steel but not turn it to powder. (IIRC, R.Mackey did some calculations and determined that you'd need to direct all the energy of a Hiroshima-sized blast into heating steel to vaporize that quantity.)

Gage concludes that some sort of conventional explosive caused this imaginary catastrophic dustification of 180 million pounds of steel, somehow without vaporizing it or destroying everything within miles...or even being heard.

Gage puts his name and professional reputation behind this madness. This is just one small example. And it's not as if he gets some things right and some wrong: everything he claims is completely absurd.

I'm not a mental health professional. I could be totally wrong about this. But it seems to me, after spending a lot of time with Gage's work, that his delusions aren't ordinary or mild. He's consumed by this fantasy and won't reassess his methods or conclusions even when reality slaps him in the face again and again. If that's not illness, what is it?
 
As for james quintere ,gage never said he supported controlled demolotion.He said he Supports a new investigation.

Say what???
Richard Gage said:
We believe that there may be sufficient evidence to conclude that the World Trade Center buildings #1 (North Tower), #2 (South Tower), and #7 (the 47 story high-rise across Vessey St.) were destroyed not by jet impact and fires but by controlled demolition with explosives.
Source

Richard Gage again said:
[FONT=arial,sans-serif]"Gage: Well that's why they would have used thermite, which is a more silent, um, thermate, which is a special form of thermite with added sulfur, because obviously you wouldn't want a whole bunch of explosions to be heard, even though they were, it's not a perfect science. They have a hundred and eighteen witnesses just from those who were recorded in the oral histories."[/FONT]
Source

Richard Gage yet again! said:
[FONT=arial,sans-serif]"[FONT=arial,sans-serif]Twenty-seven hundred people were murdered in what we can now safely [FONT=arial,sans-serif]call demolitions[/FONT][FONT=arial,sans-serif]," Gage said.[/FONT][/FONT][/FONT]
Source

For the love of God... he "supports a new investigation" because he believes the towers were deliberately brought down via controlled demolition! This is clear from his own statements.

We already know you are blind to historical reality. Don't compound the problem by being blind to what the person you are trying to defend has said. It's one thing to get facts and reality wrong, it's a whole other level of shoddy thinking to not even get your original source's beliefs right.


Not. A. Gain. Jesus Mary and Joseph, you have no sense of history do you? Molten steel has been discussed ad nauseum on this forum already!

Previous discussions on this topic: Link.
And: http://debunking911.com/moltensteel.htm and http://www.911myths.com/html/wtc_molten_steel.html

Get recent, GIE.
 
Wait a minute... I'll leave my original statement up for legitimate criticism if I misunderstood, but: Did I misunderstand this?
GIE said:
As for james quintere ,gage never said he supported controlled demolotion.He said he Supports a new investigation.

Who are we talking about who "never said he supported controlled demolition? Gage? Or Quintiere? The carelessness with the pronouns don't help here.

ETA: Okay. The more I read that, the more I realize that the original intent must have been "Gage never said Quintiere supported controlled demolition". If that's the case, then the first part of my previous post is off base. My apologies for getting that wrong. Again, I can edit that away, but I choose not to.
 
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He's talking about Quintiere, I believe. But to use any of those men's opinions in a section called "Experts Agree" is utterly dishonest. None of those men agree at all with Gage's fantasies (with the exception of Jowenko and building 7, but not the Towers), and several have spoken publicly against the conspiracists.
 
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oooh i touched a nerve here guys.

""What? Why are you apologizing for terrorists?
Many reasons there were no explosives on 911.
Not one person died from a BOMB blast!
Not one piece of steel was found to be subjected to a BOMB BLAST!
Not one explosive SOUND from a BOMB BLAST on 911!""

1.because half of these 'terrorists' were found alive
2.ask william rodriguez, or this guy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhGcBxONSvc&feature=related
3.Not one peice of steel was tested for that....
4. What were all these people hearing ? were they all on drugs that day?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8n-nT-luFIw

Heres the ends of the steel which you beleive was cut after 911.
Well as you can see from the eds its not cut by thermal lances or oxy cetalene torches.
I guess you beleive then they cut it with thermite after 911 ?
Slide160_PNG.jpg

you are the kool aid drinker, the cia did that too .You would probally let bush babysit your kids while he molests them.
Its easy for the government to justify killing sheeple,in a way they deserve it for being stupid ,Survival of the fittest .
 
1.because half of these 'terrorists' were found alive
2.ask william rodriguez, or this guy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhGcBxONSvc&feature=related
3.Not one peice of steel was tested for that....
4. What were all these people hearing ? were they all on drugs that day?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8n-nT-luFIw

...
Its easy for the government to justify killing sheeple,in a way they deserve it for being stupid ,Survival of the fittest .
1. 19 terrorist, all dead on 911. You are repeating a mistake, and now a lie pushed by Gage delusions. Source for you your lie?

2. No bomb killed people, because there were no bombs used. Now there was big jet fuel explosion, but it is not the same as a CD charge. Sorry, Willy has as much as you do, nothing.

3. Not one single piece of steel was found to be in a bomb blast on 911, and they were studied as you have prove with a guy measuring and inspecting the crime scene. Thank you for refuting your own post. You posted someone inspecting the steel and that is cool! You are self debunking.

4. Sound like explosions are not sounds of explosives. It is called reading comprehension, like, as, etc. Learn not to be fooled. Here you are at a place to discuss skepticism but you would rather drink Gage’s Kool-Aid and spew lies from GAGE. The sign of an independent thinker? No

The dumbest idea, the terrorist are still alive, this proves Gage is dirt dumb stupid! Not one terrorist survived the impacts. Gage is pushing a lie. And this lie is the easiest hearsay to bust. Your lack of research, your shallow research is showing. How much time did you research this lie, two seconds of google? lol

You prove you are just a hate monger calling American's stupid to support your delusion, blaming the United Stated for killing ourselves and acting like a terrorist apologists, you have some terrorists alive, you are saying they did not do 911. You are not a UBL follower; he takes pride in taking credit after he is safely hidden away.

Flight 93 passengers figured out 911 in minutes, what you call “stupid Americans” figured out 911 in minutes and took action! You have had 7 years and the best you can do is spew lies and delusions and support murderers. Your lack of action matches your understanding of 911.

You post delusions after 7 years – Flight 93 heroes figured out 911 in minutes.

Flight 93 heroes win. Your plight is self-critiquing. You are so easy to debunk, and have not come to JREF to exercise skeptical thinking, and are so far from critical thinking I can’t imagine how you made the mistake of coming to JREF with delusions from the cult of Gage worshiping Thermite Jones.
 
1.try a google search http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/1559151.stm

2.explosions before the plane hit ,etc .

3/thats asl astranah who examined the steel ,and said hes never seen melting of girders before.
That steel wasnt tested.
300 peices of steel weere saved by nist and found the temperatures didnt exceed 250celcius.

4.First you say theres no cd because there was no sound of explosions.Then when i show you people hearing sounds of explosions ,you say they werent cd explosions.
Either way there were sounds of explosions which supports the CD hypothesis.

flight 93 was shot down even rumsfeld admitted that
 
Forget it, GIE, your scattergun technique won't work here. How many "facts" can you throw out hoping one actually might be true, and hoping we get too drowned in data to point them out to you? It's almost as if you think we haven't seen that before. LOL

Oh, I noticed you tried to sneak the 'half the terrorists were found alive' lie. Nice. You're getting good at this conspiracy theorist throw mud against the wall and hope something sticks debate technique. It will help you convince gullible people. Not a whole lot of those here, but there is a world of conspiracy forums at your fingertips. The world is your OYSTER, GIE. Go forth!
 
What i cant understand is when you have thousands of smoking guns evidences that show the official story is wrong,
You somehow think this adds weight to your argument that its wasnt a conspiracy because your God Gravy 'debunked' them
 
What i cant understand is when you have thousands of smoking guns evidences that show the official story is wrong,
You somehow think this adds weight to your argument that its wasnt a conspiracy because your God Gravy 'debunked' them
The problem is these "smoking guns" simply don't exist. Just because you fall for unsubstantiated speculation (sorry for the big words) doesn't make it true. Try backing up your claims (and when you fail) it will be quite liberating.
 
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