New 9/11 Truth Group Started in my Town

[DaN K. StAnLeY]

Okay, so I was at a local art show/event here in San Antonio recently that they have on the first Friday of every month (appropriately called "First Friday"). As I'm walking along pretending to like the art, my girlfriend directs my attention to a group of about 5-7 guys with "9/11 was an inside job" signs and a bull-horn (not the tyranny crusher1 though). I couldn't believe I was actually witnessing a "street action" in progress. It was almost surreal seeing the "woo" with my own eyes. Most of the people there were paying absolutely no attention to the group of truthers, but I have to say they were a determined bunch.

I was in a hurry to go home and I didn't have a video camera, so I just decided to wait and find out more about them online. When I got home and Googled these guys, I found out that they are a very new (est. July 14, 2008) chapter of WAC, called "WAC San Antonio" with a meet-up page and all.

WACSA Meet-up page here: http://www.sanantoniotruth.org/

...and here's the YouTube page just so you can see how far along on REF's pyramid these guys are: http://www.youtube.com/user/WeAreChangeSA

Being the well paid member of the NWO that I am, I was immediately filled with the urge to pull a massive prank on them. Unfortunately, my conscience/girlfriend reminded me that I had once almost been duped by the "woo" so I decided to 86 the prank idea and really try and help these guys out. I joined the WAC group online and have since contacted the leader of the group, who was recently featured on the Alex Jones Show, to introduce him to some of the "debunking penicillin" that cleared up my case of "woophilis".

Now these guys are pretty deep into the "movement", a la Mickey Metz, but I still think they can turn it around. I have introduced the guy to JREF, so hopefully he comes on here and learns a little bit about Critical Thinking. I feel like these guys just want to make a difference, and it would be a shame to let them waste their time/efforts on a useless cause.

My hope was to use this thread, to direct this guy for a Q&A type of deal. I also think it would be a learning experience for people, and he can share exactly what got him into 9/11 CT's. I'm also looking for advice on how to approach this situation so I don't trigger the inevitable "you must be a govt shill" reaction. If anyone wants to help try and convert/enlighten this guy let me know. I hate to see a young dude wasting his time, and I have a soft spot for people of just "average" intelligence, who might not be familiar with debunking or physics, or don't work for NASA. Let me know what you guys think. Am I wasting my time? Tips? Advice?

 

[bje]

I hate to see a young dude wasting his time, and I have a soft spot for people of just "average" intelligence, who might not be familiar with debunking or physics, or don't work for NASA. Let me know what you guys think. Am I wasting my time? Tips? Advice?

I'd ask them if they really want to spend their time trying to catch up with these guys.

 

[DaN K. StAnLeY]

I'd ask them if they really want to spend their time trying to catch up with these guys.

ROFLMAO!! 9/11 Chimp Movement, nice.

Well, 100 people have read this thread and only one responds so IO think that tells me all I need to know. I just feel bad for the guys you know? I talked to the guy on the phone again and he is really polite from my experience and sounds like he has good intentions. We'll see what happens I guess.

 

[fitzgibbon]

I'd ask them if they really want to spend their time trying to catch up with these guys.

Bwahahaha! It is to laugh! A major attaboy for whoever came up with that blog!

 

[Brainster]

ROFLMAO!! 9/11 Chimp Movement, nice.

Well, 100 people have read this thread and only one responds so IO think that tells me all I need to know. I just feel bad for the guys you know? I talked to the guy on the phone again and he is really polite from my experience and sounds like he has good intentions. We'll see what happens I guess.

Dan, I appreciate what you're doing, and I hope you're successful. But as Swift observed, it is hard to reason a man out of that which he was not reasoned into in the first place. I don't think JREF works as a site to change minds, nor does Screw Loose Change or 9-11 Myths or Debunking 9-11. At best my hope is that we can provide information for family and friends of proselytizing Troofers so that they do not spread their misinformation.

Most of the Truthers I have encountered have been nice people. Sincere and not (apparently) nuts until you get onto the topic of 9-11. The irascible jerks like Uncle Fetzer and Alex Jones and Kevin Barrett are really few and far between.

My theory on reconverting people is that with the younger ones time and lifestyle changes (a la Mikey Metz) will probably make it happen, while with the older ones nothing is likely to work.

My only suggestion is that rather than deal with the trivia that Troofers focus on, try to find out what makes your new friend attracted to 9-11 "Truth". For most of them, it's not about 9-11, it's about what happened as a result of 9-11. Maybe it's the Patriot Act, maybe it's the Iraq and Afghanistan wars, maybe it's the inconvenience of going through security at airports.

 

[Tweeter]

ROFLMAO!! 9/11 Chimp Movement, nice.

Well, 100 people have read this thread and only one responds so IO think that tells me all I need to know. I just feel bad for the guys you know? I talked to the guy on the phone again and he is really polite from my experience and sounds like he has good intentions. We'll see what happens I guess.

Four replies to your thread tells me the majority at jref dont give two ***ts what you have to say, ya know?But to answer your questions in the op.
Am I wasting my time? Tips? Advice?
Yes.
Dont quit your day job(if you have one).
People in glass houses shouldnt throw stones.

 

[Homeland Insurgency]

Okay, so I was at a local art show/event here in San Antonio recently that they have on the first Friday of every month (appropriately called "First Friday"). As I'm walking along pretending to like the art, my girlfriend directs my attention to a group of about 5-7 guys with "9/11 was an inside job" signs and a bull-horn (not the tyranny crusher1 though). I couldn't believe I was actually witnessing a "street action" in progress. It was almost surreal seeing the "woo" with my own eyes. Most of the people there were paying absolutely no attention to the group of truthers, but I have to say they were a determined bunch.

I was in a hurry to go home and I didn't have a video camera, so I just decided to wait and find out more about them online. When I got home and Googled these guys, I found out that they are a very new (est. July 14, 2008) chapter of WAC, called "WAC San Antonio" with a meet-up page and all.

WACSA Meet-up page here: http://www.sanantoniotruth.org/

...and here's the YouTube page just so you can see how far along on REF's pyramid these guys are: http://www.youtube.com/user/WeAreChangeSA

Being the well paid member of the NWO that I am, I was immediately filled with the urge to pull a massive prank on them. Unfortunately, my conscience/girlfriend reminded me that I had once almost been duped by the "woo" so I decided to 86 the prank idea and really try and help these guys out. I joined the WAC group online and have since contacted the leader of the group, who was recently featured on the Alex Jones Show, to introduce him to some of the "debunking penicillin" that cleared up my case of "woophilis".

Now these guys are pretty deep into the "movement", a la Mickey Metz, but I still think they can turn it around. I have introduced the guy to JREF, so hopefully he comes on here and learns a little bit about Critical Thinking. I feel like these guys just want to make a difference, and it would be a shame to let them waste their time/efforts on a useless cause.

My hope was to use this thread, to direct this guy for a Q&A type of deal. I also think it would be a learning experience for people, and he can share exactly what got him into 9/11 CT's. I'm also looking for advice on how to approach this situation so I don't trigger the inevitable "you must be a govt shill" reaction. If anyone wants to help try and convert/enlighten this guy let me know. I hate to see a young dude wasting his time, and I have a soft spot for people of just "average" intelligence, who might not be familiar with debunking or physics, or don't work for NASA. Let me know what you guys think. Am I wasting my time? Tips? Advice?

You know what?

Maybe you shouldn't get too close ya know? You might learn something. And that of course would be BAAAAAAD!

Stick to your mantra of "move along nothing to see here it's all nonsense... right?"

Questions are BAD.

 

[TJM]

It isn't that questions are bad. It's the truther's failure to understand the answers.

 

[beachnut]

You know what?

Maybe you shouldn't get too close ya know? You might learn something. And that of course would be BAAAAAAD!

Stick to your mantra of "move along nothing to see here it's all nonsense... right?"

Questions are BAD.

Yes you learn 911Truth members are dirt dumb stupid on 911 issues.

But that is already known. Too late; 7 years, no evidence, no clue - 911TRuth

Dan needs to get the people to think for themselves and be skeptical of all, apply knowledge and logic to their conclusions using real evidence, not hearsay, lies and fantasy. This is something you fail to do and will not help others at.

 

[Homeland Insurgency]

It isn't that questions are bad. It's the truther's failure to understand the answers.

No.

Around here asking questions is JAQing off.

Around here no more investigation into 9/11 is needed. Even before some of that investigation was finished. WTC7 was declared solved before the debunkers could ever even dream of a completed official investigation. And much of what the debunkers originally thought wasn't even much of a factor in what their now gospel hands down as truth.

Questions are bad.

People who ask questions should be discouraged, ridiculed, and ostracized. And I believe I just read here recently that some debunkers feel truthers should be outlawed.

The so-called debunking around here is nothing more then a junior high-school like popularity contest. What a bunch of pathetic fools. And most of you not teenagers.

Hmm that kind of strategy will really turn people around huh?

What is it you are really here for?

It ain't truth.

Is it just to feel popular? Because it isn’t popular anywhere but here.

 

[Alareth]

What investigation are you talking about?

The members of 9/11 truth groups don't do any investigation of the truth behind the events on that horrible November day. It's all a big circle jerk of misunderstood and often wrong information repeated ad nausem.

It's about being against "the Man" and having to be a part of society. Misdirected rage at an ambigious and nonexistant "machine"

It's not about truth, it never has been. Don't be so disingenuous to claim that it is.

 

[dtugg]

No.

Around here asking questions is JAQing off.

No. Asking questions and not caring about the answers is JAQing off. If one is sincere about his question asking, it is fine and to be encouraged. But we all know that you twoofers aren't. You just go into JAQ off mode because it is the only way to keep up your retarded fantasies.

Around here no more investigation into 9/11 is needed.

Nope. As a result of the largest criminal investigation of all time, the case was solved years ago. Yet there are still morons that cannot figure it out.

Even before some of that investigation was finished. WTC7 was declared solved before the debunkers could ever even dream of a completed official investigation. And much of what the debunkers originally thought wasn't even much of a factor in what their now gospel hands down as truth.

Knowing the exact mechanics of the collapse was useful, but really only for people in the industry to help build safer skyscrapers.

It was already extremely obvious to anyone with a properly functioning brain that it fell down on it's own.

Questions are bad.

People who ask questions should be discouraged, ridiculed, and ostracized.

Morons who JAQ off (see above) should be discouraged, ridiculed, and ostracized.

And I believe I just read here recently that some debunkers feel truthers should be outlawed.

I believe that's only enigma. The moron twoofers should be able to say whatever they want. Aside from the whole 1st Amendment thing, if I know that you are a twoofer, I know that you are a moron. Knowing that somebody is a moron, is always a good thing.

The so-called debunking around here is nothing more then a junior high-school like popularity contest. What a bunch of pathetic fools. And most of you not teenagers.

There isn't even anything to debunk anymore. All the garbage that you people say has already been discussed many times over.

I just come here to make fun of you. You people are (unintentionally) hilarious. I would rather read this board and make fun of you than watch TV

Hmm that kind of strategy will really turn people around huh?

We don't need to turn people. If you hadn't noticed the status quo is on our side. I don't give a damn really if a few morons want to believe that 9/11 was an inside job.

What is it you are really here for.

To make fun of you.

What are you here for? Obviously, nobody here really gives a damn what you say and you don't think very highly of us. So what's the point. Don't you have better things to do, like prove to the world that 9/11 was an inside job?

Is it just to feel popular? Because it isn’t popular anywhere but here.

You're right about one thing. Discussing 9/11 conspiracy theories really isn't very popular too much outside of here. Doesn't that suck, that the only people that even pay you any attention think that you are all loony toons morons?

 

[bje]

No.

Around here asking questions is JAQing off.

I've asked Truthers the same questions repeatedly for seven years and they either refuse to answer or think it's beneath them to answer.

So just what are you complaining about, bubba?

Around here no more investigation into 9/11 is needed.

Don't blame anybody else but yourselves for your utter failure to come up with any credible reason for yet another investigation. You're lost in your own prejudice and ignorance.

 

[Bobert]

No.

Around here asking questions is JAQing off.

Around here no more investigation into 9/11 is needed. Even before some of that investigation was finished. WTC7 was declared solved before the debunkers could ever even dream of a completed official investigation. And much of what the debunkers originally thought wasn't even much of a factor in what their now gospel hands down as truth.

Questions are bad.

People who ask questions should be discouraged, ridiculed, and ostracized. And I believe I just read here recently that some debunkers feel truthers should be outlawed.

The so-called debunking around here is nothing more then a junior high-school like popularity contest. What a bunch of pathetic fools. And most of you not teenagers.

Hmm that kind of strategy will really turn people around huh?

What is it you are really here for?

It ain't truth.

Is it just to feel popular? Because it isn’t popular anywhere but here.

Shouldn't you be DEMANDING that the leaders of your movement start presenting their so called evidence to a court?
Oh wait much more fun to post and whine on the internet.

 

[Homeland Insurgency]

No. Asking questions and not caring about the answers is JAQing off. If one is sincere about his question asking, it is fine and to be encouraged. But we all know that you twoofers aren't. You just go into JAQ off mode because it is the only way to keep up your retarded fantasies.

I'm retarded. Right. Maybe I meant Grammar school?

Nope. As a result of the largest criminal investigation of all time, the case was solved years ago. Yet there are still morons that cannot figure it out.

If it's all solved (In your head that is) then why are you here? Go debate in the Bigfoot forums. You don't still have any doubts do you? Oh the shame.

Knowing the exact mechanics of the collapse was useful, but really only for people in the industry to help build safer skyscrapers.

Who knows the exact mechanics? Is there more then a theory? Fill me in will ya?

It was already extremely obvious to anyone with a properly functioning brain that it fell down on its own.

So what took so long with the official investigation that was already obvious to anyone with a properly functioning brain?

Morons who JAQ off (see above) should be discouraged, ridiculed, and ostracized.

Yes. Because you can't adequately answer anything and it makes you feel bad about yourself. Yeah, I got that.

I believe that's only enigma. The moron twoofers should be able to say whatever they want. Aside from the whole 1st Amendment thing, if I know that you are a twoofer, I know that you are a moron. Knowing that somebody is a moron, is always a good thing.

Is enigma on your side or mine? I mean you debunkers do live in a black and white world don't you? And right you have already declared me a moron so you don't have to consider anything I claim. Good for you. Is it warm and cozy in that bubble of yours?

There isn't even anything to debunk anymore. All the garbage that you people say has already been discussed many times over.

You haven't debunked anything yet. That's what I'm pointing out to all the lurkers.

I just come here to make fun of you. You people are (unintentionally) hilarious. I would rather read this board and make fun of you than watch TV

Yes that's pretty much what I pointed out. Does it make you feel like you weren't the one made fun of back in school? It feels good to feel like you're on the other side of things huh? I guess you learned nothing from your abuse other then to pass it on huh? Too bad.

We don't need to turn people. If you hadn't noticed the status quo is on our side. I don't give a damn really if a few morons want to believe that 9/11 was an inside job.

Yeah you do. And yeah you give a damn. That's why you are here. The status quo isn't on your side anywhere but here. Just read the last polls before they stopped taking polls that were embarrassing to people like you.

To make fun of you.

How does that feel? Where does the need stem from?

What are you here for. Obviously, nobody here really gives a damn what you say and you don't think very high of us. So what's the point. Don't you have better things to do, like prove to the world that 9/11 was an inside job?

Well you give a damn. I think the world has weighed in and not on your side. Does that bother you? Sure it does. That's why you are here.

Everyday

You're right about one thing. Discussing 9/11 conspiracy theories really isn't very popular too much outside of here. Doesn't that suck, that the only people that even pay you any attention think that you are all loony toons morons?

So why do you pay attention? Because you are paying plenty of attention.

 

[Alareth]

There are none so blind as those that refuse to see.

 

[dtugg]

Hey genius, get this through your head. I don't care what you people say. I am not concerned at all that your fantasy might be right. I would wager my life that it isn't. Your stupid movement isn't a concern to anybody in the real world. If fact, when I leave my computer, the 9/11 Moron Movement doesn't even exist anymore.

I come here because you twoofers make me laugh. I like laughing at terrorist apologists who are the stupidest group people in the world. You have a problem with that? Oh well. I laugh at you every single time you post.

 

[Oliver]

If fact, when I leave my computer, the 9/11 Moron Movement doesn't even exist anymore.

That's exactly my point even if my computer is running - and my reason why this is one of the very rare posts I make in 9/11-CT's. But I wonder why there is still so much excitement coming from debunkers despite that "dead-horse"-aspect ...

Concerning the OP: On the positive side you could acknowledge that if there is any evidence that the Twoofmove is dead, it's when they start to show up in San Antonio ...

 

[Homeland Insurgency]

That's exactly my point even if my computer is running - and my reason why this is one of the very rare posts I make in 9/11-CT's. But I wonder why there is still so much excitement coming from debunkers despite that "dead-horse"-aspect ...

Concerning the OP: On the positive side you could acknowledge that if there is any evidence that the Twoofmove is dead, it's when they start to show up in San Antonio ...

Every time you show up here whether or not you choose to post it's still alive to you. It’s alive to everyone who comes here. Even just the lurkers.

 

[DaN K. StAnLeY]

Dan, I appreciate what you're doing, and I hope you're successful. But as Swift observed, it is hard to reason a man out of that which he was not reasoned into in the first place. I don't think JREF works as a site to change minds, nor does Screw Loose Change or 9-11 Myths or Debunking 9-11. At best my hope is that we can provide information for family and friends of proselytizing Troofers so that they do not spread their misinformation.

Most of the Truthers I have encountered have been nice people. Sincere and not (apparently) nuts until you get onto the topic of 9-11. The irascible jerks like Uncle Fetzer and Alex Jones and Kevin Barrett are really few and far between.

My theory on reconverting people is that with the younger ones time and lifestyle changes (a la Mikey Metz) will probably make it happen, while with the older ones nothing is likely to work.

My only suggestion is that rather than deal with the trivia that Troofers focus on, try to find out what makes your new friend attracted to 9-11 "Truth". For most of them, it's not about 9-11, it's about what happened as a result of 9-11. Maybe it's the Patriot Act, maybe it's the Iraq and Afghanistan wars, maybe it's the inconvenience of going through security at airports.

I see what your saying. I just feel like if I could introduce him to the videos and to these blogs/forums, maybe he won't end up wasting his time and unintentionally accusing people of murder.

I've talked to the guy and he has agreed to check out MarkyX's video, the SLC blog, and JREF. I actually posted the Mark Roberts vs. Loose Change debate on the groups Meet-up page just to see if anything sticks with the members. I told the guy that if he has any questions about the videos, or 9/11, that I would do my best to answer or direct him to the place to find the answers. Unfortunately, shortly after our conversation I recieved an e-mail saying that NSA had just set up a base in San Antonio. The email was from the WAC San Antonio chapter so I'm just waiting for the next e-mail that says I must be a government shill/traitor. I also don't think age will solve this one because from my understanding the dude is like 27 or 28.

At least I can say I tried........