Israeli blockade 'forces Palestinians to search rubbish dumps for food'

looks like for some, Palestinians are not humans anymore.

Indeed so: for the Hamas leadership, it is perfectly clear that their people are expendable pawns, to be starved or killed at will as long as it helps them with their goal of killing the Jews.

will extrem poverty prevent terrorism or will it increase it.

Considering Hamas' ideology, it will matter not one bit to them whether the Palestinians live in extreme poverty or if each one has a palatial mansion. The goal of destroying Israel will remain. Indeed, every time Israel relaxes the blockade, the sole result is Hamas declaring it proves Israel's weakness, how they defeated the Zionist enemy, etc. Giving Hamas more money will make them more, not less, terroristic.

Besides, again, it is in Hamas' interest to keep the Palestinians in extreme poverty, so that the useful idiots will like them. Any money given to them will merely be taken to buy weapons, and the Palestinians will be just as poor as before.

Finally, the "poverty causes terrorism" or "desperate people do desperate things" claim is simply false. If anything, the opposite is true: terrorists are usually not poor and desperate, but rich and confident -- in particular, confident of their coming victory. Bin Laden isn't poor. Hamas' leadership isn't poor. The 9/11 hijackers weren't poor. Iran isn't poor. And none are desperate - they're all terribly confident of coming victory. (On the other hand, many dirt-poor nations in desperate straits have virtually no terrorism.)

In reality, the "poverty and desperation cause terrorism", like most "root cause" thinking, is merely a rhetorical device to blame the victims of terrorism for being killed by the terrorists (they kept the terrorists "poor and desperate", you see.) The "root causers" blame the victims, the economy, "imperialism", the weather, the forces of history, the latest election results -- anybody and anything except, of course, the terrorists themselves. THEY are as pure as snow, as innocent as lambs.

The "root cause" of terrorism is terrorists, with their genocidal Islamist ideology, not poverty and desperation.

Sorry.
 
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Indeed so: for the Hamas leadership, it is perfectly clear that their people are expendable pawns, to be starved or killed at will as long as it helps them with their goal of killing the Jews. staying in power.

Not exactly a "fixed it for you", but that's how I would phrase it.
 
Indeed so: for the Hamas leadership, it is perfectly clear that their people are expendable pawns, to be starved or killed at will as long as it helps them with their goal of killing the Jews.



Considering Hamas' ideology, it will matter not one bit to them whether the Palestinians live in extreme poverty or if each one has a palatial mansion. The goal of destroying Israel will remain. Indeed, every time Israel relaxes the blockade, the sole result is Hamas declaring it proves Israel's weakness, how they defeated the Zionist enemy, etc. Giving Hamas more money will make them more, not less, terroristic.

Besides, again, it is in Hamas' interest to keep the Palestinians in extreme poverty, so that the useful idiots will like them. Any money given to them will merely be taken to buy weapons, and the Palestinians will be just as poor as before.

Finally, the "poverty causes terrorism" or "desperate people do desperate things" claim is simply false. If anything, the opposite is true: terrorists are usually not poor and desperate, but rich and confident -- in particular, confident of their coming victory. Bin Laden isn't poor. Hamas' leadership isn't poor. The 9/11 hijackers weren't poor. Iran isn't poor. And none are desperate - they're all terribly confident of coming victory. (On the other hand, many dirt-poor nations in desperate straits have virtually no terrorism.)

In reality, the "poverty and desperation cause terrorism", like most "root cause" thinking, is merely a rhetorical device to blame the victims of terrorism for being killed by the terrorists (they kept the terrorists "poor and desperate", you see.) The "root causers" blame the victims, the economy, "imperialism", the weather, the forces of history, the latest election results -- anybody and anything except, of course, the terrorists themselves. THEY are as pure as snow, as innocent as lambs.

The "root cause" of terrorism is terrorists, with their genocidal Islamist ideology, not poverty and desperation.

Sorry.


You really oughta spend a year living as a Palestinian. And then you'll realize just a little bit how some people feel after living 60 years as a Palestinian.

I think such an experience would enable the emancipation of you as a person.
 
Indeed so: for the Hamas leadership, it is perfectly clear that their people are expendable pawns, to be starved or killed at will as long as it helps them with their goal of killing the Jews.



Considering Hamas' ideology, it will matter not one bit to them whether the Palestinians live in extreme poverty or if each one has a palatial mansion. The goal of destroying Israel will remain. Indeed, every time Israel relaxes the blockade, the sole result is Hamas declaring it proves Israel's weakness, how they defeated the Zionist enemy, etc. Giving Hamas more money will make them more, not less, terroristic.

Besides, again, it is in Hamas' interest to keep the Palestinians in extreme poverty, so that the useful idiots will like them. Any money given to them will merely be taken to buy weapons, and the Palestinians will be just as poor as before.

Finally, the "poverty causes terrorism" or "desperate people do desperate things" claim is simply false. If anything, the opposite is true: terrorists are usually not poor and desperate, but rich and confident -- in particular, confident of their coming victory. Bin Laden isn't poor. Hamas' leadership isn't poor. The 9/11 hijackers weren't poor. Iran isn't poor. And none are desperate - they're all terribly confident of coming victory. (On the other hand, many dirt-poor nations in desperate straits have virtually no terrorism.)

In reality, the "poverty and desperation cause terrorism", like most "root cause" thinking, is merely a rhetorical device to blame the victims of terrorism for being killed by the terrorists (they kept the terrorists "poor and desperate", you see.) The "root causers" blame the victims, the economy, "imperialism", the weather, the forces of history, the latest election results -- anybody and anything except, of course, the terrorists themselves. THEY are as pure as snow, as innocent as lambs.

The "root cause" of terrorism is terrorists, with their genocidal Islamist ideology, not poverty and desperation.

Sorry.

So the only reason for terrorism is actually that the Palestinians hate jews and want to kill all of them?

and the 9/11 highjackers hated our freedom, isnt it?

they are evil and you are good.
 
So the only reason for terrorism is actually that the Palestinians hate Jews and want to kill all of them?

Yeah never mind that Palestinians have had their land and livelihoods taken away from them and being persecuted in a manner that would fascist racists proud. But it's not about the apartheid, and being treated like animals by Israel is it? No, it's just that they are all anti-semites who just want to kill Jews. :rolleyes:


and the 9/11 highjackers hated our freedom, isnt it?

they are evil and you are good.

Like I've said may times, It's this 1 bit mindset of black and white, good v. evil. There is only 2 allowable states.

Skeptic is of the same mindset as Neocons and Islamists
 
So feel free to explain why the residents of Gaza decided to elect an internationally recognized terrorist group to power, rather than elect non-terrorists to power.

So you agree with bin Laden: It is okay to punish people for the actions of the governments they support.

If you care to, explain why any party advocating peace with Israel and recognition of its right to exist can't even get enough support to be viable in the first place.

But Hamas is a party advocating peace with Israel. We've had this converstation before. "Even" Fox news reported it:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,190606,00.html

Fox News said:
The Palestinian foreign minister said in a letter to U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan on Tuesday that the new Hamas-led government believes its struggle against Israel is just, but it wants to live side by side in peace with its neighbors.

And Meshal backs Palestinian state in '67 borders:
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/970807.html
 
You really oughta spend a year living as a Palestinian. And then you'll realize just a little bit how some people feel after living 60 years as a Palestinian.

I think such an experience would enable the emancipation of you as a person.

Maybe he would see things like Ehud Barak:
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/946518.html

Defense Minister Ehud Barak should understand this better than anyone. He has certainly read a book or two about history, and he knows that it is impossible to forcefully extinguish a determined and protracted struggle for freedom, like that of the Palestinians. He is also the person who once said in a television interview, courageously and frankly: "If I were a Palestinian, I would join a terror organization." He is the one who is now orchestrating the sowing of death in Gaza.

No doubt he had to back pedal afterwards. But he said it.
 
Indeed so: for the Hamas leadership, it is perfectly clear that their people are expendable pawns, to be starved or killed at will as long as it helps them with their goal of killing the Jews.



Considering Hamas' ideology, it will matter not one bit to them whether the Palestinians live in extreme poverty or if each one has a palatial mansion. The goal of destroying Israel will remain. Indeed, every time Israel relaxes the blockade, the sole result is Hamas declaring it proves Israel's weakness, how they defeated the Zionist enemy, etc. Giving Hamas more money will make them more, not less, terroristic.

Besides, again, it is in Hamas' interest to keep the Palestinians in extreme poverty, so that the useful idiots will like them. Any money given to them will merely be taken to buy weapons, and the Palestinians will be just as poor as before.

Finally, the "poverty causes terrorism" or "desperate people do desperate things" claim is simply false. If anything, the opposite is true: terrorists are usually not poor and desperate, but rich and confident -- in particular, confident of their coming victory. Bin Laden isn't poor. Hamas' leadership isn't poor. The 9/11 hijackers weren't poor. Iran isn't poor. And none are desperate - they're all terribly confident of coming victory. (On the other hand, many dirt-poor nations in desperate straits have virtually no terrorism.)

In reality, the "poverty and desperation cause terrorism", like most "root cause" thinking, is merely a rhetorical device to blame the victims of terrorism for being killed by the terrorists (they kept the terrorists "poor and desperate", you see.) The "root causers" blame the victims, the economy, "imperialism", the weather, the forces of history, the latest election results -- anybody and anything except, of course, the terrorists themselves. THEY are as pure as snow, as innocent as lambs.

The "root cause" of terrorism is terrorists, with their genocidal Islamist ideology, not poverty and desperation.

Sorry.

and it has OC nothing to do with people that came back after 3000 years and wanted back the nation that 3000 years ago belonged to them.

That the Palestinians feel treated unfaily has also nothing to do with it.

would the jews not have come back to the region, the Palestinians would have spread all over the world to hunt down the jews, isnt it?

I just hope we remember the troubles a creation of a state causes when we creat Nations for the Aborigines, Native Americans, Kurds and all the others stateless poeples.

it seems that hate and violence is not something that is created by the circumstances, it is something that is in the genes, isnt it?
 
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Nah, I'm happy letting them lie in the bed they made for themselves.

Maybe you Aussies can invade and fix the place if it bothers you so. Shouldn't be a problem, they're just normal everyday people just like the people in your town I'm sure.

punt....
 
I think you're mising my point. Are you saying the following?

"All members of GROUP PALESTINIAN are members of GROUP HAMAS" ?

No, sure not, i would have alot less troubles with Human right violations in Israel/Palestina if all Palestinians are Hamas supporters.

Im not a hamas fan, in contrary. but i do belive that collective punishment will backfire sooner or later.

ETA: the post of mine you answered to was sarcastic, sorry.
 
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I know you don't really care, but the Palestinians are human beings. With feelings.
Yeah, these were the guys dancing in the streets after the 9/11 attacks. Such feelings!

Maybe one day your wife or mother might not be able to get medical care and die in pain because some occupying racist power has a checkpoint set up in the middle of Chicago. Let's hope that never happens eh? ;)
I guess that may well happen if the majority of the population decides it's more important to fire rockets at some neighboring state than it is to live in peace.
 
So you agree with bin Laden: It is okay to punish people for the actions of the governments they support.
Uh, no. That's not what OBL thinks. OBL thinks it's OK to kill anyone who isn't a Muslim. He's fighting a religious war, not a political one. The political angle is only to fool the useful idiots, and as this thread shows this strategy works quite well.

But Hamas is a party advocating peace with Israel. We've had this converstation before. "Even" Fox news reported it:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,190606,00.html
Sure they do, just like Hitler wanted to live in peace with Stalin. The news media even reported it! :rolleyes:

And please tell us all FireGarden, what Article 13 of the Hamas Charter says? I will keep asking you this until you acknowledge it.

And Meshal backs Palestinian state in '67 borders:
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/970807.html
Only as a first step for their ongoing and endless war against Israel, as the Hamas Charter makes clear.

It's amazing how eager you are to make excuses for Hamas and misrepresent and/or ignore what their own founding document says, and which they have not altered to this day. You're being played for a sucker, and you're all too eager to play the part.
 
Hamas is the power in Gaza. Israel is not the occupying power of Gaza any more than the US was the occupying power of Cuba after JFK blockaded it.

The residents of Gaza have nobody but themselves to blame for their predicament. It's funny how when you elect an internationally recognized terrorist group to be your government international laws prevents nations from aiding that government. Of course, those laws were super secret and no one knew ahead of time what the consequences would be... oh, wait! Everyone knew, and they elected said internationally recognized terrorist group to be their government anyway in hopes the world community of useful idiots would bail them out, and as we see in this thread the useful idiots are lobbying hard in the terrorists defense.
 
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Hamas is the power in Gaza. Israel is not the occupying power of Gaza any more than the US was the occupying power of Cuba after JFK blockaded it.

The residents of Gaza have nobody but themselves to blame for their predicament. It's funny how when you elect an internationally recognized terrorist group to be your government international laws prevents nations from aiding that government. Of course, those laws were super secret and no one knew ahead of time what the consequences would be... oh, wait! Everyone knew, and they elected said internationally recognized terrorist group to be their government anyway in hopes the world community of useful idiots would bail them out, and as we see in this thread the useful idiots are lobbying hard in the terrorists defense.

oh dear you should inform yourself a little bit.............. really.
 

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