• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

ULTIMA1 explains Pearl Harbor

Uh oh, Ultima1. Some people here actually know stuff about Pearl Harbor. What now?
 
I thought the theory was that "they" wanted the Battleships out of commision because "they" knew Carriers were the new powerhouse. Hence the Carriers being out that day. With that thought, the Pacific Fleet took no important damage as the Carriers were safely away.
Click to expand...

Which ignores that almost all of the admirals in the policy making decisons were "Black Shoe Navy" ...with the Battleships and other suface craft being the decisive arm of the Navy.The carriers were a very important supporting arm, but few in the highest ranks really thought of the carriers as equal partners with the Battleships/Cruisers, let alone the most important arm. It was Pearl Harbor, and a couple of day laters, the sinking by the Japanese of The British "Prince of Wales" and "Repulse",that finally put the Carriers on a equal footing with Battleships in the US Navy, and it was the Coral Sea and Midway that made them the decisive arm.
 
Almo said:
I thought the theory was that "they" wanted the Battleships out of commision because "they" knew Carriers were the new powerhouse.
Click to expand...
Neither the IJN nor the USN considered the aircraft carrier the prime weapon of naval warfare in 1941, though certainly there were carrier proponents in each navy. If either, or both, navies considered the aircraft carrier the new prime weapon, then one must ask why the IJN committed huge resources to building the Yamato-class superbattleships (the Shinano was only converted to a carrier after the losses at Midway, and the unnamed fourth vessel was cancelled in 1942 when 30% complete), and the first two USN ships of the massive Montana class were originally scheduled to have been laid down on Jan. 25, 1941.

Almo said:
Hence the Carriers being out that day. With that thought, the Pacific Fleet took no important damage as the Carriers were safely away.
Click to expand...
It was just luck that kept the Enterprise from being in port that day. It was to have returned to Pearl Harbor by Dec. 7th, but it ran into a storm which forced a refuelling of the escorting destroyers. This caused a delay sufficient to keep it from reaching port before the attack.
 
Corsair 115 said:
It was just luck that kept the Enterprise from being in port that day. It was to have returned to Pearl Harbor by Dec. 7th, but it ran into a storm which forced a refuelling of the escorting destroyers. This caused a delay sufficient to keep it from reaching port before the attack.
Click to expand...
The CTs, of course, will say it was deliberate. There's no such thing as coincidence in the CT world, is there?

(FTR, I agree with the above posters: the USN viewed the battleships as the core of the fleet. I even posted this in an earlier thread the last time this was brought up.)
 
dudalb said:
Actually, Pearl Harbor Conspiracy theories have been around a long time before Stinnett. "Day of Deceit" basically just recyled the Same Old S---,
a little bogus "new" evidence added.
Click to expand...

Oh, certainly. But these days all the PH nutters and FDR frothers go running to their Stinnett first no matter how many times poepl point out he's not only re-using old debunked stuff, but outright lies about what the evidence actually is.

Mostly, they look at all of Stinnett's endnotes and assume anyone who cites that much stuff must be 'well researched' and utterly true. Nevermind that those who know what the cites actually say find he is full of it.
 
grmcdorman said:
The CTs, of course, will say it was deliberate.
Click to expand...
How does one go about deliberately creating a storm anyway? :D

grmcdorman said:
(FTR, I agree with the above posters: the USN viewed the battleships as the core of the fleet.
Click to expand...
Not just the USN, but the IJN too. Even Yamamoto himself often still thought of the battleship as the final decisive naval weapon in spite of his willingness to use carriers in operations.
 
a test run for HAARP. the full version "they" have now can create full on Cat 5 hurricanes.
 
Actually, I think Destro and Cobra Commander can hook them up with some old equipment
 
dudalb said:
We could give him a reading list, starting with Gordon Prange's superb "At Dawn We Slept", but I doubt that would change his mind.
Click to expand...

Fantastic book. When I inherited my pops' great collection of old books, that one was in there...along with the complete Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire series, which I will NEVER get around to reading.

I play too much XBOX for that.
 
At least some of the "fore-knowledge" idea could come from misinterpreting Billy Mitchell. He predicted in the late early-mid 30s (not sure on date) that Japan would attack Pearl Harbor. He even went so far as to say it would be on a Sunday morning,and he had the general direction of the attack down. Nothing psychic involved,just a keen tactical eye.
 
dtugg said:
Isn't that what HAARP is for? Oh, that's right it didn't exist in 1941. Well, that just means they had a secret version somewhere.
Click to expand...

You have to think like a "Grand Conspiricist". Pearl Harbor was after the FBI had seized Nicola Tezla's secret notebooks. They had his broadcast power/death ray technology!!!
 
ParrotPirate said:
At least some of the "fore-knowledge" idea could come from misinterpreting Billy Mitchell. He predicted in the late early-mid 30s (not sure on date) that Japan would attack Pearl Harbor. He even went so far as to say it would be on a Sunday morning,and he had the general direction of the attack down. Nothing psychic involved,just a keen tactical eye.
Click to expand...

Yeah, but the world is completely black and white in the land of the CT. This would be seen as absolute and total empirical proof of foreknowledge and complicity - nothing else.

[derail]It is also amazing to watch the reaction of truthers who believe in both the PH and 9/11 CT's. One of my truther "friends" actually knew about the Billy Mitchell quote and tried to convince me that it proved PH was a false-flag. I responded by asking him if he thought that Tom Clancy was complicit in the attacks of 9/11. The response? Dumbfounded silence.

Debt of Honor
 
I've actually mentioned DoH (I also remember Clancy did a CNN interview regarding it shortly after 9/11) and get the same response.
 
parky76 said:
Did Roosevelt have some idea that an attack was coming? Maybe.

do i care? not really. the sooner we joined the war against Fascism..the better off the world would be.
Click to expand...

I think Roosevelt may well have intended to provoke the Japanese into attacking, but I seriously doubt he knew when or where they were going to attack. He clearly believed that the U.S. needed to get involved in fighting the Nazis and Japanese, but prior to Pearl Harbor, there was a lot of opposition to that.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom