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The PG Film - Bob Heironimus and Patty

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William Parcher said:
good afternoon mangler.. interesting indeedy.. updates as they continue.. thanks william.
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William I beat you to the Bill Green impersonation by a good 3 months.

Violet at BFF PM'd me with the following on Augest 16, 2008 @ 12 22AM: OK, I didn't want to post this on the board, but your Bill Green impression CRACKED ME UP. Spot on.

Bless his heart. :-)
 
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William Parcher said:
No you didn't. I've done it twice now. The first time was about 2 years ago.
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Yes indeedy if you're going to parody anyone its always best to parody the greats. Too bad I couldn't find my quote from August still looking more research is needed.
 
Bill Munns said:
Kitakaze:

"What is so inhuman about Patty's arms that arm extensions are needed? They don't look out of human range to me. "

My study showed the armspan was 108% of body height, long, but within human range.

I've never argued for an inhuman IM or inhumanly impossible long arns. There's just longer than the average human's arms, proportional to estimated body height.

Personally, I think Patty's arms are nicely proportioned, especially upper arm to lower arm.

Bill
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I hope you're not doing math in the same manner as John Green, where 10 + 12 inches = 29 inches. :eek:

In that same article, Green appears to agree with your opinion that the arms are nicely proportioned, when he says, " The creature in the movie has normal-looking arms." In his very next sentence however, he contradicts that by saying, "It cannot be a man in a suit."

What exactly then, does he consider normal-looking?

Both his math and his conclusions leave me sort of :boggled:

RayG
 
RayG said:
In that same article, Green appears to agree with your opinion that the arms are nicely proportioned, when he says, " The creature in the movie has normal-looking arms." In his very next sentence however, he contradicts that by saying, "It cannot be a man in a suit."

What exactly then, does he consider normal-looking?

RayG
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Here is a paragraph from that article by Green:

But in order for the arms to bend at the elbow, which they plainly do in the movie, all of that extra length has to be added to the lower arm.

The result, in my case, is about 12 inches of arm above the elbow and 29 inches below it — almost as much of a monstrosity as Edward Scissorhands.
The creature in the movie has normal-looking arms. It cannot be a man in a suit.
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What he means is very simple....the proportion of Patty's upper arm to her lower arm looks very much like a human's arm proportion (hence..."normal")......as opposed to a 'human arm with a long extension on the lower arm'.
 
LTC8K6 said:
The IM argument is dead in any case. You can't use it on the subject in the PGF whether it's a man in a suit or not.
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How come? Forensic videographers determine body dimensions and proportions all the time based on some pretty crappy security video footage.

The PGF has lots of samples to build a model with. You might be surprised at the accuracy that, in theory, could be attained. Besides..what else is there left to do with this film? It certainly has never been seriously attempted. Steindorf just threw out a not-for-science animation. But that does not mean it can not be done correctly to current standards. Whether it determines anything pro or con would remain to be seen.

As far as the film goes it looks to me that Patty's arm length could be within human range, maybe on the long side. They look correctly proportioned which gives me doubts about hand extensions. The angle of the arm looks straight down from the shoulders and it does not look like the arm angles in from the elbow into a recessed shoulder socket. This implies that the width of the back must be added to the length of the arms to get the arm span of the actor. Measured relative to the height and averaged over X frames might tell us something. Intermembral indices for the entire body can be measured to a debatable degree of accuracy. But think pixels not inches since units disappear for these relative measurements.
 
SweatyYeti said:
What he means is very simple....the proportion of Patty's upper arm to her lower arm looks very much like a human's arm proportion (hence..."normal")......as opposed to a 'human arm with a long extension on the lower arm'.
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Any comment on Bill Munns' opinion?:

Bill Munns said:
Kitakaze:

"What is so inhuman about Patty's arms that arm extensions are needed? They don't look out of human range to me. "

My study showed the armspan was 108% of body height, long, but within human range.

I've never argued for an inhuman IM or inhumanly impossible long arns. There's just longer than the average human's arms, proportional to estimated body height.

Personally, I think Patty's arms are nicely proportioned, especially upper arm to lower arm.

Bill
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Óðinn said:
How come? Forensic videographers determine body dimensions and proportions all the time based on some pretty crappy security video footage.
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If only Patty would walk through a door with a height measure on it.

Intermembral indices for the entire body can be measured to a debatable degree of accuracy. But think pixels not inches since units disappear for these relative measurements.
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Astrophotographer did that and didn't find anything very special about Patty.
 
Kitakaze:

"Any comment on Bill Munns' opinion?:"

My opinion simply means that I do not see any evidence of an arm extension device being used in the PG film.

To Ray G.

"I hope you're not doing math in the same manner as John Green, where 10 + 12 inches = 29 inches.

In that same article, Green appears to agree with your opinion that the arms are nicely proportioned, when he says, " The creature in the movie has normal-looking arms." In his very next sentence however, he contradicts that by saying, "It cannot be a man in a suit."

What exactly then, does he consider normal-looking?

Both his math and his conclusions leave me sort of

RayG

My own analysis and attempts to determine measurements or proportions is not based on any other person's prior work or measurements, so I can't comment on anything stated by another researcher. Best to take it up directly with the other person.


Bill
 
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Kitakaze:

"That and that you see nothing inhuman about Patty's arms, you mean? "

I never argued they were, and don't plan to. Other than being rather long, by human standards, they are within human range and proportion. The arms are a non-issue for me.

Bill
 
kitakaze said:
If only Patty would walk through a door with a height measure on it.
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There you go thinking inches again.

Astrophotographer did that and didn't find anything very special about Patty.
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No offense to Astro but measuring a few cherry-picked frames downloaded off the internet wasn't what I had in mind.
 
Bill Munns said:
Kitakaze:

"That and that you see nothing inhuman about Patty's arms, you mean? "

I never argued they were, and don't plan to. Other than being rather long, by human standards, they are within human range and proportion. The arms are a non-issue for me.

Bill
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I know your opinion, I just wanted it to be clear for others. I also have long arms. They would look even longer in a Bigfoot suit, I bet.
 
We've talked about trying to assign an IM index to different Hollywood gorilla suits (on an actor). Since the question with Patty is 'is that a guy in a suit?'... it seems that you would want to know if the IM index of a gorilla suit will reliably tell you that there is a man inside.

IOW, test it on a known before applying it to an unknown.
 
Óðinn said:
There you go thinking inches again.
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Considering that I am not an American, I do not think in inches. What I was thinking was that some of the methods used to establish proportions on security footage wouldn't necessarily apply to the PGF.

No offense to Astro but measuring a few cherry-picked frames downloaded off the internet wasn't what I had in mind.
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What did you have in mind?

Here are some of Astro's measurements you can see yourself:

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=3844448#post3844448
 
Óðinn said:
There you go thinking inches again.


No offense to Astro but measuring a few cherry-picked frames downloaded off the internet wasn't what I had in mind.
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Looks like you have given yourself a project. Please post the results when you are finished.

Peace

GT
 
After you stop laughing, try to pinpoint this lard ass' shoulder joint. Then imagine him with furcloth instead of a jersey and you can see the issue with trying to locate the shoulder joint on Patty. Do you locate it as if it were a living creature, or a guy in a padded fur suit?


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