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Deeper than primes

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doronshadmi

Penultimate Amazing
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Mar 15, 2008
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Notion #1:

If we use partitions in order to define Entropy, then a multiset (a repetition of the same identity) has an entropy that is equivalent to the number of the repetitions that exists within it.

Since a set has no repetitions, it has no entropy.

Let us examine the partitions that exist within any given n > 1

{x} = Full entropy
{x} = Intermediate entropy
{x} = No entropy

2
---
{1,1}


3
---
{1,1,1}
{2,1}


4

---
{1,1,1,1}
{2,1,1}
{2,2}
{3,1}


5
---
{1,1,1,1,1}
{2,1,1,1}
{2,2,1}
{3,1,1}
{3,2}
{4,1}


6
--
{1,1,1,1,1,1}
{2,1,1,1,1}
{2,2,1,1}
{2,2,2}
{3,1,1,1}
{3,2,1}
{3,3}
{4,1,1}
{4,2}
{5,1}


7
---
{1,1,1,1,1,1,1}
{2,1,1,1,1,1}
{2,2,1,1,1}
{2,2,2,1}
{3,1,1,1,1}
{3,2,1,1}
{3,2,2}
{4,1,1,1}
{4,2,1}
{5,1,1}
{5,2}
{6,1}

...

As can be seen, Prime numbers have the least entropy, from this point of view.




Notion #2:


If we understand the Sieve of Eratosthenes ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sieve_of_Eratosthenes ) as a whole\part framework, than number 0 is the most dense part of it, and the set of primes is the least dense part of it.

In order to see it, let as represent the Sieve of Eratosthenes by non-finite frequencies notated by half circles, along a non-finite straight-line.

The first frequency is the non-finite collection of half circles that are representing the frequency level 1.

The next frequency is the non-finite collection of half circles that are representing the frequency level 2.

….

The next frequency is the non-finite collection of half circles that are representing the frequency level n.

Etc., … etc. …

Since the non-finite frequencies are synchronized with each other in Zero point, then 0 is the most dense part of the Sieve of Eratosthenes.

The least dense part of the Sieve of Eratosthenes is the set of prime numbers, because each prime number is a synchronization between no more than 3 frequencies, which are level 0, level 1 and the level of the prime itself.

Here is the diagram of the Sieve of Eratosthenes, represented as non-finite levels of synchronized half circles:

Tedarim6.jpg


At the left side of this diagram we can see the Zero point, and the first 20 primes are mareked along the 0_level line.

-------------------------------------------------------

The non-local ur-element is the maximum entropy of itself (no differences can be found within it). Also a local ur-element is the maximum entropy of itself (no differences can be found within it).

Maximum entropy exists in both non-locality and locality, but they are opposite by their self nature, so if non-locality and locality are associated, then a non-entropic domain is created.

The history of such a domain is written by symmetry, where at the first stage symmetry is so strong that no outcome of this domain has a unique identity, and all we have is a superposition of identities.

Symmetry is collapsed because the opposite properties of non-locality and locality are expressed more and more until each local ur-element has a unique identity of its own.

This uniqueness, which is anti-entropic by nature, cannot exist without the association between the non-local and the local.

Opposite properties do not contradict each other, if they are based on NXOR connective.

A NXOR connective enables the existence of NXOR\XOR logic (non-locality and locality are associated, and associated realms have more than one entropy level).

A XOR connective does not enable the existence of NXOR\XOR logic (non-locality and locality are isolated, and isolated realms have maximum entropy).

Please read pages 13-14 of my work called Eventors ( http://www.geocities.com/complementarytheory/Eventors.pdf ).

I think that the organic approach (the associations between the non-local and the local) is the accurate way to understand the realm that we are an inseparable part of it.

--------------------------------------------------

Let us re-examine these cases:

Case 1: associated realms have more than one entropy level.

Case 2: isolated realms have maximum entropy.

In case 1 NXOR is associated with XOR and we get an open realm because both NXOR and XOR go beyond their self state of maximum (and opposite state of) entropy.

In case 2 there is no association between NXOR and XOR, and each opposite is closed upon its own maximum entropy, and nothing exists beyond these closed and isolated opposite maximum entropies.

In a complementary realm, each opposite is opened to an "off spring" outcome, which is beyond its own isolated state (an isolated realm has maximum entropy).

About dimensions:

If an organic realm is the result of the associations between the non-local and the local, than our measurement tools must express this association.

For example, let us take the place value method.

If we look at it from both parallel and serial points of view, we get a fractal-like structure, which is a mixed pattern of both parallel and serial parts upon finite/non-finite scales.

Let us examine this structure by using bases 2,3 and 4:

234.jpg


The traditional place value system is based only on the serial broken-symmetry building-block, which is used to define non-finite fractals upon non-finite scale levels, where the structure of each fractal is determine by the serial broken-symmetry building-block that is used.

Furthermore, the traditional method ignores the whole/part relations that exists in such fractals and uses single paths along them as measurements tools, for example:
Pi representation in base 10 is a single path along a base 10 fractal, and this single path is notated as 3.14159265358979323846264338327950288419716939937510 …
where each numeral represents a different scale level along this fractal.

The organic approach changes at least two things here:

1) The fractal-like structure is based on both parallel and serial building-blocks.

2) There can be simultaneously more than a one path , and as a result our measurement tool is not limited to a single path of numerals, but it can be a tree of several paths made of several building-blocks with different symmetrical states, which simultaneously determine the structure of what I call Organic fraction. Here is an example of an organic fraction that is based on different bulging-blocks taken from bases 2,3 and 4:

ONNfrac.jpg


So as can be seen, the 4D model is just the standard approach to start with.

In order to deal with Organic fractions, a parallel/serial Turing-like model has to be formulated.

I am in a state of "Michael Faraday"-like* here that seeks for "James Clerk Maxwell"-like** in order to do that.

* http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Faraday
** http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Clerk_Maxwell

I think that since non-locality is involved here, then any formulation of Organic fractions must be incomplete and therefore open (this is a positive interpretation of Gödel's work).

Please read this message to Prof. Mandelbrot http://www.geocities.com/complementarytheory/2Mandelbrot.pdf .

In my opinion, meaningful frameworks exist as long as there is a difference between X-model and X (which is also a positive interpretation of Gödel's work).
 
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Notion #1:

If we use partitions in order to define Entropy, then a multiset (a repetition of the same identity) has an entropy that is equivalent to the number of the repetitions that exists within it.

As can be seen, Prime numbers have the least entropy, from this point of view.

Why is this insightful? It just follows from the definition of a prime number and your definition of maximum entropy. Whilst you don't give a rigorous definition of the entropy measure of an integer, it appears that it's related to the number of co-factors of a number. By definition, a prime number only has a single degenerate pair of factors.

Put it another way; you've come to the astounding conclusion that if one selects the numbers that have only 1 and themselves as factors, that they have the fewest factors.

Your notion 2 was impenetrable.

Why are you asking us to read your correspondence to a famous mathematician? Do you want one of us to ask him about it when we meet him next?
 
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I'm going to advise people not to respond to this thread. doronshadmi has a history of being totally incomprehensible and his threads always go for dozens of pages without any progress being made.

I can't help mys.. oo, a shiny thing!
 
I'm going to advise people not to respond to this thread. doronshadmi has a history of being totally incomprehensible and his threads always go for dozens of pages without any progress being made.

Small correction:
1. doronshadmi has a history of inventing new terms and not defining them;
2. doronshadmi has a history of misrepresenting every field of mathematics he touches upon.

For the rest: seconded.
 
Put it another way; you've come to the astounding conclusion that if one selects the numbers that have only 1 and themselves as factors, that they have the fewest factors.
I am talking about the general view where:

If we understand the Sieve of Eratosthenes ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sieve_of_Eratosthenes ) as a whole\part framework, than number 0 is the most dense part of it, and the set of primes is the least dense part of it.

Also the partition of each n > 1 has an internal degree of entropy, where primes has the least degree of entropy.

By using Symmetry as a first-order property, it is possible to to show how Entropy and Distinction of Ids are related to each other, and open an interesting framework for discoveries.
 
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First of all You have to define what you mean by entropy in this mathematical case.
Secondly if you mean by entropy the number of subset in which you can decompose the number in a summatorial series, from which common factors are called to have higher entropy. Then your conclusion is not a bit interesting at all, has you can decompose in such way in an increasing amount of ways has the numbers go bigger. And you cant have primes whit more then one term whit the “highest entropy” (the number 1 by what you are trying to highlight), simply because if you have a set of number “b” in an exclusive cluster, then you would be able to transcribe it into “nb” and therefore not a prime.
Has far as I can tell the rest is just rubbish, a diagram can be a good thing to explain an expression, but whiteout an expression it is completely useless has a final product.
 
First of all You have to define what you mean by entropy in this mathematical case.
Secondly if you mean by entropy the number of subset in which you can decompose the number in a summatorial series, from which common factors are called to have higher entropy. Then your conclusion is not a bit interesting at all, has you can decompose in such way in an increasing amount of ways has the numbers go bigger. And you cant have primes whit more then one term whit the “highest entropy” (the number 1 by what you are trying to highlight), simply because if you have a set of number “b” in an exclusive cluster, then you would be able to transcribe it into “nb” and therefore not a prime.
Has far as I can tell the rest is just rubbish, a diagram can be a good thing to explain an expression, but whiteout an expression it is completely useless has a final product.

Please read again the beginning of my first post:
doronshadmi said:
If we use partitions in order to define Entropy, then a multiset (a repetition of the same identity) has an entropy that is equivalent to the number of the repetitions that exists within it.

Since a set has no repetitions, it has no entropy.

So as you see, I am taking about not less tham Set\Multiset relation based on Symmetry as a first-order property.
 
Is Entropy thermodynamic or information entropy?
What is a partition?
What is the mathematical relationship between "partitions" and entropy?
What is the criteria that separates high, intermediate and low entropy?
What use is this nonsense?

The previous thread started by doronshadmi bogged down in his constant redefining of his terms and the total inconsistency of of his "mathematics".
 
Set\Multiset
local\non-local
sense\nonsense
night\day
habersham\diesel

:bunpan

please spot the pair that is not attributed to doron.

*right, it was night\day
 
Please read again the beginning of my first post:
Nope, no definition of "entropy". And I predict we won't get one from you either in this thread. Can I now apply for the MDC?

So as you see, I am taking about not less tham Set\Multiset relation based on Symmetry as a first-order property.
Ah, our old tired gibberish\nonsense complementation and Symmetry delusional stuff is back. Nothing really changes.

Is Entropy thermodynamic or information entropy?
What is a partition?
What is the mathematical relationship between "partitions" and entropy?
What is the criteria that separates high, intermediate and low entropy?
What use is this nonsense?
Good questions you'll never get an answer to from doron.

The previous thread started by doronshadmi bogged down in his constant redefining of his terms and the total inconsistency of of his "mathematics".
I never saw an actual rigorous definition of his terms. I did see vague descriptions of them, which indeed were contradictory to each other.

Doron's target audience is, in fact, kindergarten children. Yes, 5-years olds would, according to him, better understand his "mathematical" concepts than adults. Indeed, his own grasp - or at least his presentation thereof - of things like set theory and logic is on level with that of the average 5 years old.

Speaking of which: why don't you search for an internet forum that targets kindergarten children, doron? I guess your buddy Moshe Klein, who is kindergarten teacher, would be able to advise you to find such a forum.
 
By using Symmetry as a first-order property, it is possible to to show how Entropy and Distinction of Ids are related to each other, and open an interesting framework for discoveries.

Please show an interesting discovery you have made using this framework.
 
If we understand the Sieve of Eratosthenes ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sieve_of_Eratosthenes ) as a whole\part framework, than number 0 is the most dense part of it, and the set of primes is the least dense part of it.

Is this your astounding discovery? That the holes in a sieve are less dense than the bits of the sieve that aren't holes? That some numbers have more factors than others? And in particular primes have the fewest factors, and zero has the most factors?

Well, gosh. Just the breakthrough maths has been waiting for!
 
Is this your astounding discovery? That the holes in a sieve are less dense than the bits of the sieve that aren't holes? That some numbers have more factors than others? And in particular primes have the fewest factors, and zero has the most factors?

Well, gosh. Just the breakthrough maths has been waiting for!

The keyword in this case is Symmetry.

By using Set\Multiset compelemntation one can systematically research Entropy in terms of both Thermodynamic and Information by a one framework.

Nathen,

You simply cannot get things beyond the Set case, where anything is already clearly identified.
 
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