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Mark Roberts Interview on Skeptic Zone

Hyperviolet

Damnum Fatale
Joined
Mar 20, 2007
Messages
989
Hi folks,

In case you guys missed the thread in the Community Subforum, here is the link again:
www.skepticzone.tv/

The interview was conducted by JREF member Dr Mark Henn (Mercutio) and is quite excellent, if I must say. So take the time to leave feedback on the blog.
It's their first show, let 'em know how you enjoyed it.

Furthermore, for those else interested:
Gravy, in a PM, told me:
Gravy said:
Mark Henn's question about the best way to approach truthers was a good one, and as usual I left a lot out of my response (and some was edited out.) I'll be writing a suggested "dos and don'ts for skeptics" to be linked prominently on my site.



Cheers!
 
The interview was conducted by JREF member Dr Mark Henn (Mercutio) and is quite excellent, if I must say. So take the time to leave feedback on the blog.
It's their first show, let 'em know how you enjoyed it.

Mark Roberts starts off by stating that the 9/11 Truth Movement was largely started by Holocaust denier's and anti-Semites. I suppose I could say that the die-hard believers in the official propaganda story are only interested in killing Arabs/Muslims. Some Arabs blew up the World Trade Center so let's blow up some Arabs. All political and social movements have crazy people in their midst.

Later Mark Roberts states, "Initially, the truthers get a big headstart...When you are forming a conspiracy theory you don't have to get anything right... People like us[debunkers???] have to rely on facts and evidence."

Really!!! Well, Zdenek Bazant and Yong Zhou had their first paper ready for publication on 09/13/2001, only two days after the attacks. What facts and evidence did they have at this point? In their paper they write,

"the conflagration caused by the aircraft fuel spilled into the structure causes the steel of the columns to be exposed to sustained temperatures apparently exceeding 800°C."

What evidence was there on 09/13/2001 that the columns were exposed to sustained temperatures exceeding 800C? None

In their first paper they also stated,

"the upper part may be assumed to move through distance h almost in a free fall."

What evidence was there for this occurrence? None.

I wonder why Mark Roberts isn't criticizing Bazant for coming to conclusions before any of the evidence was in?

Jerome Hauer, the director of the Office of Emergency Management(OEM) under Giuliani, already seemed to know that day how the towers were destroyed.

Dan Rather: Based on what you know and I recognize that we are dealing with so few facts. Is it possible that just a plane crash could have collapsed these buildings or would it have required a prior positioning of other explosives...?

Jerome Hauer: "...No, my sense is that a plane filled with fuel that hit that buildings that burned...the velocity of the plane certainly had an impact on the structure itself...the fact that it burned and you had that intense heat probably weakened the structure as well. And I think that it was simply the planes hitting the buildings and causing the collapse."

Charles Thornton, one of the members of the ASCE investigation, stated to Karl Koch, "Karl, we all know what caused the collapse." Karl Koch himself stated,

"I could see it in my mind's eye: The fire burned until the steel was weakened and the floors above collapsed, starting a chain reaction of gravity, floor falling upon floor upon floor, clunk – clunk – clunk, the load gaining weight and momentum by the nanosecond, unstoppable. Once enough floors collapsed, the exterior walls and the core columns were no longer laterally supported and folded in."

He might have seen it in his mind's eye, but apparently this wasn't ever captured on any of the videos. As S. Shyam Sunder once stated, "When you did it previously, you showed that the floors actually pancaked, and we did not see any evidence of pancaking in the videos or photographs we have."

What facts and evidence did Jerome Hauer, Zdenek Bazant, Charles Thornton, and Karl Koch have when they made their statements? None.

Why isn't Mark Roberts interested in pointing this out? Because he isn't interested in the truth. He is interested in promoting ideological conformity to the government's position.
 
Mark Roberts starts off by stating that the 9/11 Truth Movement was largely started by Holocaust denier's and anti-Semites. I suppose I could say that the die-hard believers in the official propaganda story are only interested in killing Arabs/Muslims. Some Arabs blew up the World Trade Center so let's blow up some Arabs. All political and social movements have crazy people in their midst.

Later Mark Roberts states, "Initially, the truthers get a big headstart...When you are forming a conspiracy theory you don't have to get anything right... People like us[debunkers???] have to rely on facts and evidence."

Really!!! Well, Zdenek Bazant and Yong Zhou had their first paper ready for publication on 09/13/2001, only two days after the attacks. What facts and evidence did they have at this point? In their paper they write,

"the conflagration caused by the aircraft fuel spilled into the structure causes the steel of the columns to be exposed to sustained temperatures apparently exceeding 800°C."

What evidence was there on 09/13/2001 that the columns were exposed to sustained temperatures exceeding 800C? None

In their first paper they also stated,

"the upper part may be assumed to move through distance h almost in a free fall."

What evidence was there for this occurrence? None.

I wonder why Mark Roberts isn't criticizing Bazant for coming to conclusions before any of the evidence was in?

Jerome Hauer, the director of the Office of Emergency Management(OEM) under Giuliani, already seemed to know that day how the towers were destroyed.

Dan Rather: Based on what you know and I recognize that we are dealing with so few facts. Is it possible that just a plane crash could have collapsed these buildings or would it have required a prior positioning of other explosives...?

Jerome Hauer: "...No, my sense is that a plane filled with fuel that hit that buildings that burned...the velocity of the plane certainly had an impact on the structure itself...the fact that it burned and you had that intense heat probably weakened the structure as well. And I think that it was simply the planes hitting the buildings and causing the collapse."

Charles Thornton, one of the members of the ASCE investigation, stated to Karl Koch, "Karl, we all know what caused the collapse." Karl Koch himself stated,

"I could see it in my mind's eye: The fire burned until the steel was weakened and the floors above collapsed, starting a chain reaction of gravity, floor falling upon floor upon floor, clunk – clunk – clunk, the load gaining weight and momentum by the nanosecond, unstoppable. Once enough floors collapsed, the exterior walls and the core columns were no longer laterally supported and folded in."

He might have seen it in his mind's eye, but apparently this wasn't ever captured on any of the videos. As S. Shyam Sunder once stated, "When you did it previously, you showed that the floors actually pancaked, and we did not see any evidence of pancaking in the videos or photographs we have."

What facts and evidence did Jerome Hauer, Zdenek Bazant, Charles Thornton, and Karl Koch have when they made their statements? None.

Why isn't Mark Roberts interested in pointing this out? Because he isn't interested in the truth. He is interested in promoting ideological conformity to the government's position.


Why is Mark Roberts, a liberal Democrat, interested in promoting ideological conformity with an ideology he doesn't share?
 
... He is interested in promoting ideological conformity to the government's position.
If you understood the things you reference you would not ask completely stupid questions.

Empty rhetoric proven by your purity of zero evidence. Talk is all you have making stupid statements backed up with nothing. You and 9/11 truth not done a single thing of value after 7 years. No Pulitzer Prize, nothing.
 
Mark Roberts starts off by stating that the 9/11 Truth Movement was largely started by Holocaust denier's and anti-Semites.
(Gravy notes truther getting his very first statement wrong, learns from experience and ignores the remaining ignorant drivel.)
 
Why is Mark Roberts, a liberal Democrat, interested in promoting ideological conformity with an ideology he doesn't share?

He is interested in promoting ideological conformity to the government's position regarding the events of 9/11.

Why am I, a conservative Republican, not interested in promoting ideological conformity to the government's position?

I believe National Review used to sell a bumper sticker that stated, "Love your country, fear your government."
 
He is interested in promoting ideological conformity to the government's position regarding the events of 9/11.

Why am I, a conservative Republican, not interested in promoting ideological conformity to the government's position?

Please point me to a link or any other reference that will demonstrate "the government's position regarding the events of 9/11".
 
Good job, Gravy and Mercutio both! Very interesting interview.


I would like to know about the sirens in the background--were they looking for you?

As to supporting ideologies, Gravy is not supporting anything. He is offering facts.
 
(Gravy notes truther getting his very first statement wrong, learns from experience and ignores the remaining ignorant drivel.)

You said something to this effect during the interview,

"A lot of the early conspiracy theorists for 9/11 were holocaust deniers, not a lot but prominent ones, looking for another excuse to be able present their views on what the Jews had done...but they didn't make it overtly a Jewish thing...and later on find out that these are hardcore holocaust deniers and anti-Semites."

Some of the early prominent 9/11 Truthers would include Michael Ruppert, Paul Thompson, Nafeez Mosaddeq Ahmed, Jimmy Walter, Barrie Zwicker, Jim Hoffman etc.

You later state, "A lot of people who stuck in there are not well mentally." Actually, it is probably the case some of the early truthers were more out of it mentally, while the more credible ones are still relevant to the 9/11 Truth Movement. James Fetzer, Morgan Reynolds and Judy Wood are largely irrelevant to the 9/11 Truth Movement at this point.

Nevertheless, your attempt to associate the 9/11 Truth Movement with Holocaust deniers is just another pathetic ad hominem attack against us. Why not mention the Jersey Girls, who lost their husbands in the attacks, and were instrumental in helping the create the 9/11 Commission? Because you want people to believe that the people who make up the 9/11 Truth Movement are the most detestable kind of people imaginable. So you can't very well say that a lot of the early prominent truthers were married women with children who lost their husbands on 9/11 and set out to discover the truth about what happened. That sounds to sympathetic. You want people unfamiliar with the 9/11 Truth Movement to think, 9/11 Truthers = Holocaust deniers. I suppose that is good propaganda though.

Please point me to a link or any other reference that will demonstrate "the government's position regarding the events of 9/11".

Here, here here and here.

Good job, Gravy and Mercutio both! Very interesting interview.

I would like to know about the sirens in the background--were they looking for you?

As to supporting ideologies, Gravy is not supporting anything. He is offering facts.

But his "facts" don't really go beyond the official explanation offered by our government. Someone repeating, "War is Peace; Freedom is Slavery; Ignorance is Strength" isn't really offering facts.
 
You said something to this effect during the interview,

"A lot of the early conspiracy theorists for 9/11 were holocaust deniers, not a lot but prominent ones, looking for another excuse to be able present their views on what the Jews had done...but they didn't make it overtly a Jewish thing...and later on find out that these are hardcore holocaust deniers and anti-Semites."

Some of the early prominent 9/11 Truthers would include Michael Ruppert, Paul Thompson, Nafeez Mosaddeq Ahmed, Jimmy Walter, Barrie Zwicker, Jim Hoffman etc.
It's one thing to be ignorant and too lazy to do your homework. It's another thing to flaunt those regrettable qualities.

This was for a revision of my Loose Change Viewer guide, which I never finished. August, 2006.

I’m going to take a break from Loose Change’s narrative for a moment, to talk about 9/11 denial and anti-Semitism. The American Free Press (AFP), a far-right-wing biweekly anti-Israel conspiracy-promoting opinion paper, is one of the main sources for information in Loose Change. Here’s an excerpt from the AFP’s mission statement:
You can see the future clearly if America continues her mad race to oblivion. Thanks to the press, the life-denying values – often called "democratic values" – are in vogue. Kids can't pray in school even as the taxpayers offer huge sums to the theocratic state of Israel. The Boy Scouts are scheduled for the guillotine because they don't want perverts to be scoutmasters and want to restrict membership to normal boys. The family is officially defined now as something other than what it has been since humankind appeared on this globe. The ancient Hippocratic Oath for doctors is trashed to accommodate the profitable business of abortion. Cultural communism-which is called political correctness-dominates all media. Art is literal trash and music is cacophony. Morals and speech are sewage, history as fact is viciously attacked by the media, entertainment is ethical syphilis. One must be blind not to see the direction. Where can it end? Jumping from a cliff brings a light-hearted feeling and the descent is most enjoyable until the inevitable sudden stop. Reality is not fitted with a bungee rope.

Whether you wish to choose or not, you will choose. It's the Global Plantation and Death or Liberty and Life. You will have and your children will have either an international communistic society with the very rich at the top, the bureaucrats in the middle and the rest of mankind at the bottom, or a free and sovereign America. –The AFP http://www.btpholdings.com/afp.html
It’s one thing to rely on crackpot sources, which, as you will see (if you haven’t already from the passage above), the AFP clearly is. But it’s another thing to rely on a crackpot source that’s run by Willis Carto, the racist Holocaust denier whom the Anti-Defamation League calls “one of the most influential American anti-Semitic propagandists of the past 50 years.” The AFP is published from the same office as Carto’s The Barnes Review, which ran a serious story titled “Adolf Hitler – An Overlooked Candidate for the Nobel Prize.” Willis Carto:
"If Satan himself, with all of his super-human genius and diabolical ingenuity at his command, had tried to create a permanent disintegration and force for the destruction of the nations, he could have done no better than to invent the Jews."​
Thanks to reader Ralph Hernandez for alerting me to this connection, which reminds me of a disturbing fact. There are several prominent anti-Semites and Holocaust deniers in the 9/11 conspiracy crowd. I don’t mean the people who believe the very common conspiracy theory that radical Zionists in Israel and/or in the US government orchestrated the 9/11 attacks to get the US to wage war against the foes of Israel. And it’s important not to automatically label as anti-Semitic, people who disagree with Israeli policy or with a Zionist political agenda. That said, I’m not aware of a single Holocaust denier or anti-Semite who’s prominent on the 9/11 myth-debunking side. But there are several people on the CT side who hold such views. These include:

Eric Hufschmid, author of the 9/11 conspiracy book “Painful Questions” and the video “Painful Deceptions,” is so proud of his Holocaust denial that he calls himself a “HoloHoax exposer.”

– The owners of the popular, and early, 9/11 conspiracy website Serendipity.li, who publish articles such as “In Defense of Anti-Semitism” and “Jewish media myths leading us to World War III.”

– The host of the webcast “Wing TV,” who goes by the pseudonym “Victor Thorn,” and who published a booklet titled “Christ Killers.”

Carol Valentine, who runs the conspiracy website Public-Action.com, where the current headline is “The American Coup d’Etat and the War for Jewish Supremacy,” and who writes, “Zionist Christians are traitors to America. Along with Jews, they scream loudest for Arab blood, even though all rational analysis shouts that Israel and Israeli agents in America were responsible for 9-11.”

– “Scholar for Truth” Rick Rajter praises Iran’s president Ahmadinejad’s Holocaust denial and has a website that links to the neo-Nazi site Stormfront. More about him on the Screw Loose Change blog.

– The writers and editors of the American Free Press, whose work is cited several times in Loose Change. They formerly published The Spotlight, a harsher anti-Semitic paper, which was shut down when a lawsuit bankrupted Willis Carto’s Liberty Lobby organization.

– 9/11 conspiracy promoter “Killtown,” who presents the idea that fewer than 300,000 Jews may have died at the hands of the Nazis, and who believes that Israel was involved in the terrorist attacks of 9/11 and therefore may be lying about the Holocaust.

***
March, 2003: A.K. Dewdney publishes his "cell phones can't work in airliners" paper in an online journal dedicated to Holocaust denial: http://www.vho.org/tr/2003/3/Dewdney248-271.html
***

Is Dylan Avery an anti-Semite? I don’t know. He denies that he is. Some people, like the administrator of the website littlegreenfootballs.com, insist that he’s the same Dylan Avery who posted anti-Semitic rants on that site in 2003. Indeed, there are remarkable similarities between the two besides the name, as I point out on page 50 of Loose Change Creators Speak.(PDF) But I’d need more evidence before making an accusation of anti-Semitism against Avery. Loose Change mostly stays away from the “Zionist plot” claims made by other conspiracists.

However, in their public lives Avery & co. have repeatedly thrown their hats in with these paranoid, far-right “Christian patriot” hatemongers. In addition to promoting the laughably bad “research” that’s printed in The AFP, they have done interviews with people like Victor Thorn, John Stadtmiller, Jack Blood, and Eric Hufschmid. This strikes me as very strange behavior for people who claim to be sensitive to murder victims.

In an interview with “HoloHoax exposer” Hufschmid, Avery responds to Hufschmid’s criticism that Loose Change doesn’t place enough blame on the Jews by saying,
“Take our word for it: we're well aware of the Illuminati and the New World Order, and we're well aware that there are people who want an all-Jewish state. We realize that all these things exist, but that's not what we're about. Your video, and Alex Jones's video, cover these things beautifully, and there's no need for us to cover these same topics. …I just hope you can support us.”​
Jason Bermas tells Hufschmid, “This not just about Cheney and Rumsfeld and those guys. But by piercing them, we're hoping to get to the bottom of this [Zionist] criminal network that you talk about.”
***

William Rodriguez's association with anti-Semites and Holocaust Deniers

“The Mindset of the Malaysian people has been changed forever on the 9/11 events after seeing the latest evidence.” –Malaysia's National News Service

Rodriguez travels with crackpots and Holocaust deniers to tell the world that 9/11 was an inside job. Citing this information, Muslim clerics march on a U.S. embassy. Venezuela's National Assembly calls for a new investigation to include the possibility of U.S. complicity in the attacks. Rodriguez is proud of these achievements.

Back in the U.S., Rodriguez speaks at a neo-Nazi conference and, not surprisingly, gets a speaking invitation from the world's top anti-Semites. In December, 2006 he announces his conversion to Islam and says
that the aim of American media is to criminalize Muslims.

December, 2007: Rodriguez won't denounce Kevin Barrett's anti-Semitism or agree not to associate with Barrett. (December 11 email on that page includes a list of Barrett's hateful statements.)

September, 2008: Rodriguez writes to notorious anti-Semites Willis Carto and Michael Collins Piper, warning them that I have mentioned them in this thread.

***

Screw Loose Change has numerous posts about 9/11 and Holocaust deniers, including an account of the Phoenix 9/11 Truth conference in Feb., 2007, which was organized by a Holocaust denier. Here's SLC's search results for "Holocaust" http://screwloosechange.blogspot.com/search?q=Holocaust

***

More about Carol Valentine and Eric Hufschmid at ref's site: http://911guide.googlepages.com/history

***

Excerpt from an email from me to Kevin Barrett, January, 2007:

9) Why did you say that it's a "Zionist Big Lie" that the "Germans hated the Jews for no reason."

10) Why did you say "the Holocaust as it is taught in the US is a hideously destructive myth"?

11) Why did you name one of the most egregious white-supremicist neo-Nazis, Ernst Zundel, as someone whose work deserves consideration? In case you've forgotten about Zundel's work, here's a quote by him:

"Wherever we look, we White people find ourselves besieged by peoples of other races who compete aggressively against us for jobs, food, housing, education and above all -- power! The Jews are particularly adept at seizing or insinuating themselves into strategic positions in our society where they wield power far beyond the extent of their numbers....Through us, the White majority of Europe and America, the Jewish minority have obtained their advantages, including their Israel, their Federal Reserve, their World Bank and their International Monetary Fund. In exchange for these advantages, the Jews give us -- their White hosts -- wars, depressions, inflation, unemployment, energy shortages, higher and higher taxes and air piracy. Like sheep, they expect us to go down the road with them -- all the way to the kosher slaughterhouse. We White people of America have done nothing so far which would frustrate the Jews' expectations or their ambitions of becoming the world's slavemasters."
***

The ADL published an overview of anti-Semitic 9/11 conspiracy theories: http://tinyurl.com/rhvkd


Of course, much of the anti-Semitism practiced in the U.S. is mild compared to that in the Middle East. This 2002 paper examines the resurgence of anti-Semitic myths there: http://tinyurl.com/lfj3y


This film takes a critical look at the Arab and Iranian reaction to 9/11, five years later: http://www.memrifilms.org/
 
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But his "facts" don't really go beyond the official explanation offered by our government. Someone repeating, "War is Peace; Freedom is Slavery; Ignorance is Strength" isn't really offering facts.
You have no excuse for not having visited my website, since the link was given at the start of the podcast. Nor have you pointed out where or when I repeated anything like you claim I did.

Here are some sections of my site for you to consider before you judge if I have merely repeated government slogans. Let me know in a few years, after you've read the material, if you've changed your mind. You'll need to email me then, since you're going on ignore now. Best wishes in your studies.

William Rodriguez, Escape Artist– To a hero of 9/11, the truth is a straitjacket.

An open letter to John Schroeder, formerly of FDNY Engine 10– His conspiracist interviewers repeatedly fail to clear up his confusion, then use his confused story to try to support their claims.

WTC 7 and the Lies of the 9/11 Truth Movement – An examination of how the conspiracist claims of WTC 7's condition and collapse correspond to reality, with numerous first responder accounts.

Loose Change 2nd Edition Viewer guide: Not a single claim right, and 81 factual errors in 81 minutes.


The 9/11 Terrorists, Confessions, al Qaeda & Jihadist History & Ideology


NIST & FEMA reports and critiques, 9/11 Engineering Studies, Alternate Hypotheses, WTC 7 Reports, Computer Simulations, more

Fire Safety Engineering and the Performance of Structural Steel in Fires, Building Code Changes

Did eyewitnesses report hearing or seeing bombs and demolitions explosives in and around the towers?.
(Includes analysis of the "118 Witnesses" paper and other conspiracist claims and methods.)

Accounts of structural instability in the Twin Towers, Bowing of columns, Collapse expected


Flight 77 – Pentagon – A thorough look at the evidence, many links & photos

Flight 93 – Shanksville, PA – A thorough look at the evidence, many links & photos

A partial (but long) list of agencies, organizations, and experts responding to and investigating the 9/11 attacks.You know: the ones the conspiracists say are liars, dupes, and shills.

They oughta know better: critiques of the inept work, absurd claims, and deceitful practices of Richard Gage, David Ray Griffin, Jim Hoffman, Steven E. Jones, Gordon Ross, Kevin Ryan, and others

Ground Zero cleanup, Fires in piles, Molten metals, Fresh Kills operations, Steel ID & scrap issues

What They Saw: Eyewitness Accounts of the NYC Aircraft Attacks

9/11 Forensics and Victim Identification

FDNY Info, Oral testimony transcripts, 9/11 Communication Problems, Other WTC First Responder Issues, corporate response


WTC Construction, Plans & Elevations, Power, Security, Statistics, Pre-9/11 photos, Tenants

WTC Insurance Issues before and after 9/11, Terrorism Insurance

9/11 Photo & Video Resources


Some Recommended Books about 9/11 and its Aftermath
(More books are listed at the categorized pages linked above)


Tragedy and Heroism: September 11, 2001 at the Pentagon

Firefight: Inside the Battle to Save the Pentagon on 9/11 (2008)

Touching History: The Untold Story of the Drama That Unfolded in the Skies Over America on 9/11

Among the Heroes (Flight 93)


 
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None of those webpages gave me any indication on what the government's position is on the events of 9/11. Perhaps I overlooked it and you could quote the relevant passages.

Also, they're all dated 2005 and later. Is it your contention that the government had no position on the events of 9/11 before then? If not, then please cite an earlier source. If so, then please explain how anyone besides conspiracy theorists knew what happened on 9/11 prior to 2005.
 
It's one thing to be ignorant and too lazy to do your homework. It's another thing to flaunt those regrettable qualities.

This was for a revision of my Loose Change Viewer guide, which I never finished. August, 2006.

I’m going to take a break from Loose Change’s narrative for a moment, to talk about 9/11 denial and anti-Semitism. The American Free Press (AFP), a far-right-wing biweekly anti-Israel conspiracy-promoting opinion paper, is one of the main sources for information in Loose Change. Here’s an excerpt from the AFP’s mission statement:
You can see the future clearly if America continues her mad race to oblivion. Thanks to the press, the life-denying values – often called "democratic values" – are in vogue. Kids can't pray in school even as the taxpayers offer huge sums to the theocratic state of Israel. The Boy Scouts are scheduled for the guillotine because they don't want perverts to be scoutmasters and want to restrict membership to normal boys. The family is officially defined now as something other than what it has been since humankind appeared on this globe. The ancient Hippocratic Oath for doctors is trashed to accommodate the profitable business of abortion. Cultural communism-which is called political correctness-dominates all media. Art is literal trash and music is cacophony. Morals and speech are sewage, history as fact is viciously attacked by the media, entertainment is ethical syphilis. One must be blind not to see the direction. Where can it end? Jumping from a cliff brings a light-hearted feeling and the descent is most enjoyable until the inevitable sudden stop. Reality is not fitted with a bungee rope.

Whether you wish to choose or not, you will choose. It's the Global Plantation and Death or Liberty and Life. You will have and your children will have either an international communistic society with the very rich at the top, the bureaucrats in the middle and the rest of mankind at the bottom, or a free and sovereign America. –The AFP http://www.btpholdings.com/afp.html
It’s one thing to rely on crackpot sources, which, as you will see (if you haven’t already from the passage above), the AFP clearly is. But it’s another thing to rely on a crackpot source that’s run by Willis Carto, the racist Holocaust denier whom the Anti-Defamation League calls “one of the most influential American anti-Semitic propagandists of the past 50 years.” The AFP is published from the same office as Carto’s The Barnes Review, which ran a serious story titled “Adolf Hitler – An Overlooked Candidate for the Nobel Prize.” Willis Carto:
"If Satan himself, with all of his super-human genius and diabolical ingenuity at his command, had tried to create a permanent disintegration and force for the destruction of the nations, he could have done no better than to invent the Jews."​
Thanks to reader Ralph Hernandez for alerting me to this connection, which reminds me of a disturbing fact. There are several prominent anti-Semites and Holocaust deniers in the 9/11 conspiracy crowd. I don’t mean the people who believe the very common conspiracy theory that radical Zionists in Israel and/or in the US government orchestrated the 9/11 attacks to get the US to wage war against the foes of Israel. And it’s important not to automatically label as anti-Semitic, people who disagree with Israeli policy or with a Zionist political agenda. That said, I’m not aware of a single Holocaust denier or anti-Semite who’s prominent on the 9/11 myth-debunking side. But there are several people on the CT side who hold such views. These include:

Eric Hufschmid, author of the 9/11 conspiracy book “Painful Questions” and the video “Painful Deceptions,” is so proud of his Holocaust denial that he calls himself a “HoloHoax exposer.”

– The owners of the popular, and early, 9/11 conspiracy website Serendipity.li, who publish articles such as “In Defense of Anti-Semitism” and “Jewish media myths leading us to World War III.”

– The host of the webcast “Wing TV,” who goes by the pseudonym “Victor Thorn,” and who published a booklet titled “Christ Killers.”

Carol Valentine, who runs the conspiracy website Public-Action.com, where the current headline is “The American Coup d’Etat and the War for Jewish Supremacy,” and who writes, “Zionist Christians are traitors to America. Along with Jews, they scream loudest for Arab blood, even though all rational analysis shouts that Israel and Israeli agents in America were responsible for 9-11.”

– “Scholar for Truth” Rick Rajter praises Iran’s president Ahmadinejad’s Holocaust denial and has a website that links to the neo-Nazi site Stormfront. More about him on the Screw Loose Change blog.

– The writers and editors of the American Free Press, whose work is cited several times in Loose Change. They formerly published The Spotlight, a harsher anti-Semitic paper, which was shut down when a lawsuit bankrupted Willis Carto’s Liberty Lobby organization.

– 9/11 conspiracy promoter “Killtown,” who presents the idea that fewer than 300,000 Jews may have died at the hands of the Nazis, and who believes that Israel was involved in the terrorist attacks of 9/11 and therefore may be lying about the Holocaust.

***
March, 2003: A.K. Dewdney publishes his "cell phones can't work in airliners" paper in an online journal dedicated to Holocaust denial: http://www.vho.org/tr/2003/3/Dewdney248-271.html
***

Is Dylan Avery an anti-Semite? I don’t know. He denies that he is. Some people, like the administrator of the website littlegreenfootballs.com, insist that he’s the same Dylan Avery who posted anti-Semitic rants on that site in 2003. Indeed, there are remarkable similarities between the two besides the name, as I point out on page 50 of Loose Change Creators Speak.(PDF) But I’d need more evidence before making an accusation of anti-Semitism against Avery. Loose Change mostly stays away from the “Zionist plot” claims made by other conspiracists.

However, in their public lives Avery & co. have repeatedly thrown their hats in with these paranoid, far-right “Christian patriot” hatemongers. In addition to promoting the laughably bad “research” that’s printed in The AFP, they have done interviews with people like Victor Thorn, John Stadtmiller, Jack Blood, and Eric Hufschmid. This strikes me as very strange behavior for people who claim to be sensitive to murder victims.

In an interview with “HoloHoax exposer” Hufschmid, Avery responds to Hufschmid’s criticism that Loose Change doesn’t place enough blame on the Jews by saying,
“Take our word for it: we're well aware of the Illuminati and the New World Order, and we're well aware that there are people who want an all-Jewish state. We realize that all these things exist, but that's not what we're about. Your video, and Alex Jones's video, cover these things beautifully, and there's no need for us to cover these same topics. …I just hope you can support us.”​
Jason Bermas tells Hufschmid, “This not just about Cheney and Rumsfeld and those guys. But by piercing them, we're hoping to get to the bottom of this [Zionist] criminal network that you talk about.”
***

William Rodriguez's association with anti-Semites and Holocaust Deniers

“The Mindset of the Malaysian people has been changed forever on the 9/11 events after seeing the latest evidence.” –Malaysia's National News Service
Rodriguez travels with crackpots and Holocaust deniers to tell the world that 9/11 was an inside job. Citing this information, Muslim clerics march on a U.S. embassy. Venezuela's National Assembly calls for a new investigation to include the possibility of U.S. complicity in the attacks. Rodriguez is proud of these achievements. Back in the U.S., Rodriguez speaks at a neo-Nazi conference and, not surprisingly, gets a speaking invitation from the world's top anti-Semites. In December, 2006 he announces his conversion to Islam and says
that the aim of American media is to criminalize Muslims.
December, 2007: Rodriguez won't denounce Kevin Barrett's anti-Semitism or agree not to associate with Barrett. (December 11 email on that page includes a list of Barrett's hateful statements.)

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Screw Loose Change has numerous posts about 9/11 and Holocaust deniers, including an account of the Phoenix 9/11 Truth conference in Feb., 2007, which was organized by a Holocaust denier. Here's SLC's search results for "Holocaust" http://screwloosechange.blogspot.com/search?q=Holocaust

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More about Carol Valentine and Eric Hufschmid at ref's site: http://911guide.googlepages.com/history

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Excerpt from an email from me to Kevin Barrett, January, 2007:

9) Why did you say that it's a "Zionist Big Lie" that the "Germans hated the Jews for no reason."

10) Why did you say "the Holocaust as it is taught in the US is a hideously destructive myth"?

11) Why did you name one of the most egregious white-supremicist neo-Nazis, Ernst Zundel, as someone whose work deserves consideration? In case you've forgotten about Zundel's work, here's a quote by him:

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The ADL published an overview of anti-Semitic 9/11 conspiracies here: http://tinyurl.com/rhvkd

Of course, much of the anti-Semitism practiced in the U.S. is mild compared to that in the Middle East. This 2002 paper examines the resurgence of anti-Semitic myths there: http://tinyurl.com/lfj3y

This film takes a critical look at the Arab and Iranian reaction to 9/11, five years later: http://www.memrifilms.org/

Yeah right Mark. BTW I thought you were retired from here? So I guess you’ve finally taken your thumb out of your mouth and have stretch out of that fetal position Gage beat you into and are now just getting some of your confidence back. Good for you tough guy.

That's some nice generizations you made there. Lumping everyone together who might have some similar thoughts on one issue. Do you generalize much? I mean being on the subject of anti-Semitism and all I was just curious.

Did you forget which liars you get your story on 9/11 from?
 
How sad. I just received an email from William Rodriguez. He wrote an email to “one of the most influential American anti-Semitic propagandists of the past 50 years.” (see above) and to anti-Semite Michael Collins Piper to advise them that "Mark Roberts of Brooklyn, NY" "attacked" the American Free Press on this website. He linked to this thread.

Rodriguez told them that I have "made fun of" 9/11 victims in the past. He did not elaborate on how he believes I did that.

He also told them that I mentioned the fact that Rodriguez spoke at the neo-Nazi conference Carto hosted. You can read about these things in my Rodriguez paper.

How nice of William to do the good Mr. Carto this favor. I wonder how he knew about this thread.

Way to live up to expectations, "truth" movement!

Did I say, "How sad?" If not, I'll do so again.

How sad.

William Rodriguez <wtcbill@gmail.com>to
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afpeditor@americanfreepress.net,
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michaelcollinspiper1960@yahoo.com
cc
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Mark Roberts <nyctours@gmail.com>

date
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: Sat, Sep 27, 2008 at 10:57 PM

subject:
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attacks on AFP and victims of 9/11.
In the email Rodriguez did not elaborate on how he believes I've attacked victims of 9/11.

A final point: William Rodriguez still has not responded to a single point in my detailed paper about his claims, which he's been invited to do since May, 2007.


Update: Rodriguez has sent another email, to the AFP and to his 9/11 family and fan mailing lists, advising them of further discussion on this site that is "famous for attacking people of 9/11." He seems to be forgetting that truthers cringed when he announced that he was sending a link to my paper about him to all 65,000 people on his mailing list. All the emails I received about him after that were in support of my work.

Strangely, Rodriguez took issue with my displaying his email address, which is publicly available on his websites. He encouraged 9/11 families and the AFP crackpots to contact him for my email address, which is also publicly available, on my website.

Rodriguez stated in that email that he is no longer a member of the Truth Movement. He says he has his own mission (which now includes a video for sale – MR).

Please get help, William.
 
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