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Bigfoot: The Patterson Gimlin Film - Part 2

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Skeptical Greg

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Skeptical Greg
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Part One in all it's glory:

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42523

Diogenes:28th July 2005, 12:29 PM

I believe the Bigfoot - serious, not follies is getting a little unwieldy so I thought I would submit this spinoff..


The discussion has had me looking at a lot of info, and one of the most intriguing things in Satsquatch lore, IMO is the

The Patterson-Gimlin Film


The drama surrounding the physical film itself, is as controversial as the contents of the video ..

Here is an interesting discussion about the film over at BigFoot Forums..

The Patterson Subject; a Professional Observation

It was started by Chris Walas, a Hollywood special effects wizard with an impressive set of credentials.
I believe that some of the more astute contributers over at Bigfoot Forums are making some impressive counterpoints to his analysis of the film..


Within the thread you will find some stills and clips of the PGF ( Patterson-Gimlin Film ) , which may not count for much if you don't have access to the complete film, but still I find them interesting..

It seems the only easily obtained copy is on the DVD

Sasquatch: Legend Meets Science (DVD)

Over at BFRO


I have always felt the film itself shows what seems to be a very real looking, Bigfoot type creature, and I am certainly not qualified to debunk it ( yet ) , though some that probably are, are satisfied they have. There is even someone who claims to be the " man in the furry suit "; but it is another story that appears to not be proveable..

The thread I pointed to, has some pretty good debunking of the debunking..

I am in the process of getting my own copy of the footage, and will comment more when I have had a chance to look at it..


The biggest problem I have with accepting this film as proof that Bigfoot exists, is that virtually nothing substantial emerged from the area in which the film was made.

I can't believe that such a convincing looking creature, vanished from the face of the earth, without a trace, unless it was a suit that was destroyed or very effectively hidden away.
_____________________________________________________

Obviously, after three years, much research and discussion, I have reconsidered the opinion that the subject of the film is " ...... a very real looking, Bigfoot type creature ... " ...

I posted my first questioning topic over at BFF Oct 7 2005 - so it didn't take me long after taking a closer look, to rethink my initial impressions ..

http://www.bigfootforums.com/index.php?showtopic=12993&hl=


O.K ... Lets do it for another 15,000 posts ..


Thanks to Drewbot for suggesting PGF Part 2 ...

If anyone wants to take up from where we left off ... Just go grab a post from the other thread and bring it over here..

Here is the last post before we got Chillzro'ed

Originally Posted by doctoratlantis
Now you want to exclude those that drowned? Be serious.
Click to expand...

LAL said:
I am serious. If a person drowns would you call that natural causes or accidental death?
Click to expand...
Click to expand...




_____________________________________________________________
 
Yes. Never drowns or has an accident or plays, etc.

I've said this before. Bigfoot never does anything but walk straight from nowhere to nowhere.

He never does anything like stand around and contemplate the view, or kick pine cones, or skip and hop, or dance with happiness, or anything that would leave anything other than a line of tracks.

He's never walking along, and then runs like crazy for 20 feet just to be running on a nice summer day.

Two of them never race each other to the river to see who is fastest.

He never gets mad and stomps around in a circle in frustration.

He never gets in a fist fight with the guy in the next valley.

He never does a left-face.

His kids never run around in circles in the mud getting filthy.

They never climb a tree and fall out, or get stuck up there and holler for mama.

They never hang around in unruly groups and misbehave, or draw things in the dirt.
 
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What would be ideal, is that someone with PGF-savant status, consolidate the 'What-we-know' into a few long posts to start this thread off. Like the 'what horses were there?', The history of Patterson at Corriganville & H-Wood, the original hoax attempt, the film-timeline, the different stories, Ray Wallace connection to Bluff Creek, etc...

All would be backed up with links/sources of course. I'd even say if someone volunteers to do this, that the thread be closed while they put together their info, so when it reopens any newcomers will be able to get all the info right at the beginning. That was the most intimidating part of the Giganto-PGF thread, that finding old info was agonizingly impossible. And if not for the patience of the old-timers, providing info for the 4th or 5th time, I'd still be searching for Dfoot's photo of the WAH mask.

Anyway, just an idea.
 
Moderation discussion split:
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=124793

Please make some attempt to post on topic in this thread. The topic being, the PG film. Not drowning, not how many posts you can bulk a thread up to, not anything other than the PG film.
Further off topic posts will attract mod actions, such as infractions, splits to AAH, and possibly suspension for ignoring mod warnings.
Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: chillzero
 
Drewbot said:
Ray Wallace connection to Bluff Creek, etc...
Click to expand...

Ray Wallace was living in Toledo, Washington, at the time of the PGF filming. He claimed (to Mark Chorvinsky) he told Roger where to look, but a letter of his to an investigator made it clear he didn't know where the film site was. He was a subcontractor in the area in 1958 and the tracks were appearing on one of his sites while he was away on business. He came back because he thought someone was trying to sabotage the operation. He found an evacuation the size of that of a 1200 lb. horse; his brother found tracks and owned a copy of a Titmus cast. Ray himself never claimed he made Bluff Creek tracks.

He was also irate he was suspected and questioned by the sheriff in connection with the 1958 "Crew tracks". Later he began spinning outrageous tales and making fake casts, probably after he moved back to his old home in Washington.

It is not true that his wife was the "man in the suit". She posed for souvenir pictures sold in the shop.

That's about the extent of any connection with Bluff Creek.
 
Where Ray Wallace himself was at any given time may be unimportant. The point is that his fake Bigfoot feet made from Alder wood were at Blue Creek Mountain (Onion Mountain) in 1967. This is very close to the Bluff Creek Patty filmsite.

Ray may not have been making the fake tracks himself, but his wooden tools were used by somebody. Green and Dahinden took photos of impressions made by those fake feet.
 
LTC8K6 said:
Yes. Never drowns or has an accident or plays, etc.

I've said this before. Bigfoot never does anything but walk straight from nowhere to nowhere.

He never does anything like stand around and contemplate the view, or kick pine cones, or skip and hop, or dance with happiness, or anything that would leave anything other than a line of tracks.

He's never walking along, and then runs like crazy for 20 feet just to be running on a nice summer day.

Two of them never race each other to the river to see who is fastest.

He never gets mad and stomps around in a circle in frustration.

He never gets in a fist fight with the guy in the next valley.

He never does a left-face.

His kids never run around in circles in the mud getting filthy.

They never climb a tree and fall out, or get stuck up there and holler for mama.

They never hang around in unruly groups and misbehave, or draw things in the dirt.
Click to expand...


I did see him flip a golf cart cause some jerks with beef jerky were messing with him.

But it is true, pretty much all the sightings all follow the same pattern, much like the grays of UFO fame.
I don't think you'll ever see Bigfoot do any of those things. It would require steady camawork and clips longer then a few seconds. The longer and more steady the film, the more they will be shown as frauds.
 
But it is true, pretty much all the sightings all follow the same pattern, much like the grays of UFO fame. I don't think you'll ever see Bigfoot do any of those things.
Click to expand...

Well, it's the fact that we don't find the tracks of bigfoot doing these things that I am really pointing out.

I wouldn't necessarily expect bigfoot to be seen doing them.

I don't think I'll ever see bigfoot do anything...maybe I will, but the odds seem long.
 
It's interesting that Don Abbott was in the area in September and found tracks and made casts, then Hodgson calls him and tells him about Patterson's encounter and movie just a month later, wanting tracking dogs, but Abbott isn't too interested and says he'll wait to see the film.

You'd think Abbott would be more interested, having just been in the area himself.
 
It looks like the skeptical podcast Point of Inquiry has an interview with Greg Long, author of The Making of Bigfoot. I haven't had a chance to listen to it yet.
 
We get to see the left hand (palm) at least twice in the PGF. Folks have described it as a "catcher's mitt" or baseball glove. It looks big. The right hand can be seen more readily, but it seems smaller than the left. Is this an illusion?


6b268a48.jpg
58966253.jpg
 
Alright I wasn't going to feed into this maddness but I so enjoy helping the obsessed become more obsessed. Patty's forearm is bristling not unlike the gorilla photo. Patterson was getting close and it was puff up time.

 
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What is striking about the Center picture in Crow's lineup, is the bountiful, LANNY MCDONALD Moustache. (Pattycakes for anyone who gets that reference without using Wiki)
 
William Parcher said:
Crow may lead you into the trap of agreeing that the hair has actually changed during the filming.
Click to expand...

William isn't that just like you always looking out for the welfare of others. Rather than worry about traps why not refute my claim. Without some good flame this thread is never going to go another 15,000 posts. It'll be lucky to make it into the new year.

BTW there are other frames where the palm of the left hand shows. In never looks small.
 
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